Looking for a diesel car - good reputations?

cjmcork

Hey all, I currently drive a 4x4 and need to get something a bit more economical, but not spend a fortune - I've had no experience with VW Passats or Mondeos but how are they for reliability, etc........I have zero repair skills, so I need something good...Avensis D4D are too expensive......any help greatly appreciated

How much do you want to spend?

cjmcork

reckon i'd get about 17k for mine - it's an 06 Grand Vitara, re-sale isn't great unfortunately......

paulksnn

I picked up a 04 mazda 6 2L diesel last year for about 17k.
I'm very happy with it. Highly under-rated cars in my opinion.

cjmcork

I drove to Dublin yesterday from Cork and put 75 E worth of petrol into it - how's the Mazda for fuel economy...........

GERMAN ROCKS

Peugeot 407 or vw passat are both great cars and you could get both the new models for that money.

cjmcork

thanks - will do a bit of digging on these.....

mvpr

What about something like this Skoda?

http://www.cbg.ie/Cardetail.aspx?CBGID=832716&ID=1726360

Should defo be able 2 find an '06 one for 17k if you look around.

Or this Passat?

http://www.cbg.ie/Cardetail.aspx?CBGID=-6&ID=1763742

Or something a bit different? Might not be to everyones taste, but these engines will go forever.

http://www.cbg.ie/Cardetail.aspx?CBGID=&ID=1758918

Or my personal favourite. You should really check this out...

http://www.adverts.ie/showproduct.php?product=47273&cat=2

cjmcork

if i wasn't such a brand snob, I'd definitely get an octavia, I know it sounds odd coming from one driving a Suzuki, but it's a gorgeous 4x4 with 3 doors - so it's the only 4x4 that says 'i don't have a family - i just bought this cos i liked the look of it!"

Green Hornet

cjmcork wrote: »

Hey all, I currently drive a 4x4 and need to get something a bit more economical, but not spend a fortune - I've had no experience with VW Passats or Mondeos but how are they for reliability, etc........I have zero repair skills, so I need something good...Avensis D4D are too expensive......any help greatly appreciated

The Volvo S40 are nice looking cars, A friend of mine has the turbo diesel (not sure if its 1.9 or 2.0) and seems to be happy with it. Not sure about depreciation though. I've heard Volvo depreciate heavily but maybe that applies to older models.

cjmcork

oh, they're a gorgeous car - I'd love to say that I'll keep it for years, but I get bored very quickly, so the days of spending a fortune have to go, this is getting to be an expensive hobby

E92

Don't buy now if at all possible. Get a diesel car in July, because new diesels will be getting a lot cheaper and that will have to force down the price of used ones, especially as they will have the old tax system applied to them for the foreseeable future, which is a lot higher than the new one in the case of diesels(the opposite is true for most petrols though).


The OP mentioned reliability was important, therefore the only 2 worth considering are the Mazda 6 and the Avensis, or the i-CTDi Accord but they would be a lot more expensive, and hard to find. Mazdas are quite underrated which means they are cheap compared to the Toyota. Toyotas go for silly money used IMO, but on the plus side the fact that they depreciate so slowly means they'll be very much in demand when the time comes to sell it one. Mazdas depreciate more heavily at the moment, but now that Mazda are doing the importing etc themselves, their sales have been rising rapidly in recent times(though they are far from being a major player yet, the key word being yet), so I'm sure in a few more years time, Mazdas will be a lot more desirable than they are now, and that will make them worth more in the used market.

I'm sceptical about a 407 being durable enough, French cars always do badly in reliability surveys, and the Passat has to be the most overrated car for it's reliability(the current one is terrible, electric handbrakes go wrong a lot so they tell me here on boards) too.

Mondeos with petrol engines should be bulletproof(because they are straight out of a Mazda), but the diesel ones(which are Ford's own design) are known for having injector trouble if they're the TDCi version.

cjmcork

E92, this is great - more of this stuff please.......am veering towards the Mondeo, cos it's so pretty - the Avensis is a shocking price second hand and most of the cork dealers aren't really bothered - will I have an issue trading in a Suzuki GV.....low mileage and still beautiful!

Biro

paulksnn wrote: »

I picked up a 04 mazda 6 2L diesel last year for about 17k.
I'm very happy with it. Highly under-rated cars in my opinion.

I'd agree with this, good buy. Very good car. I know where you can get a mint '04 one too for a bit less than your Suzuki...

bazz26

Mazda 6 and Ford Mondeo turbo diesels represent the best value second hand.

VW Passats are overrated and overpriced. My uncles 2007 one broke his heart with stupid niggly problems.

Ideally wait until July and import a diesel car from the UK where it will work out cheaper on the new VRT and motor tax system.

cjmcork

thanks for these - what about a Vectra?

Biro

cjmcork wrote: »

thanks for these - what about a Vectra?

The 1.9 diesel comes in two forms, a 120bhp and a 150bhp. They're excellent, but that's because they're a Fiat unit. I wouldn't bother with them at all if Opel made them.
The rest of the car is very "meh...".

paulksnn

Sorry about the delay- I normally get about 47mpg - less when I put the foot down.
But as someone said, the newer smaller diesels are putting out the same horsepower now.
If you can afford a new one, wait alright for july.
I came from a polo, so the 6 is actually big enough for my usage.

Redsoxfan

You could pick up a 1.9 or 2.4 JTD Alfa Romeo 156 (facelift model) for around the money you would get from your Vitara. VRT will be less in July if you import from the UK, much bigger selection that Ireland, but 1 or 2 nice examples on Carzone from time-to-time. Fuel ecomony and tax will be less on the 1.9. It's the same engine as I have in the GT and so far so good. I looked at 156s myself, but decided to get a coupe while I still could.

47mpg from the Mazda sounds pretty good.

cjmcork

Hello - aren't alfas among the most unreliable cars on the road - I know they're beautiful, but I can't afford to keep an Alfa mechanic on my payroll

Redsoxfan

I depends who you talk to-I had a 147 for 2.5 years and never had to have any work done other than annual service. The timing belt was replaced at 30k miles (before I bought the car). I now have a GT diesel and am delighted with it.

Make sure any car you buy has been properly looked after (serviced etc.) and get an independent inspection if at all possible.

pburns

GERMAN ROCKS wrote: »

Peugeot 407 or vw passat are both great cars...

Eh...NO! :rolleyes:

Well I'd recommend a Mazda 6 but try and go for the facelifted model (05 onwards I think). There were improvements in noise supression, interior etc. I have a 04 6 and have been offered surprisingly good money on trade-in - more than I expected so nothing wrong with re-sale value as far as I can see.

E92

Alfas consistantly do badly in reliability surveys. No matter what one you look at they're always down towards the bottom. Doesn't mean they're all bad, but a visit to Honest John reveals the following:

Honest John wrote:

FIAT/Alfa joint worst for breakdowns attended by German ADAC during 2001. 9th from Bottom of 100 models for reliability in Auto Express 2002 survey. 18th from Bottom in 144 car 2002 JD Power / What Car? Customer Satisfaction Survey of V and W reg cars. Alfa Romeo had joint highest average cost in warranty claims for cars up to 10 years old in 2002 Warranty Direct index Joint fourth bottom in 2002 Which reliability survey of cars up to 2 years old; 74 cars surveyed. Alfa Romeo 2nd least reliable of 31 makes of car in 2002 'Which?' reliability survey cars 2000 - 2002; 3rd least reliable cars 1997 - 1999. Only 87% breakdown free in 2003 Which survey. Alfa Romeo had fourth highest warranty repair costs in 2003 Warranty Direct Reliability index (index 155.10 v/s lowest 31.93). 98-2000 average for breakdowns and faults and poor for problems; 2001-2003 average for breakdowns and poor for problems and faults in 2003 Which survey. 7th from bottom out of 137 models in 2003 Top Gear survey. 156 8th bottom model and Alfa Romeo bottom marque in 2004 JD Power Customer Satisfaction Survey. Alfa Romeo 5th bottom of Reliability Index for 2004 combining average cost of repair of £392.88 with high 39.55 failures per 100 Warranty Direct policies. Link:- www.reliabilityindex.co.uk Came 16th from bottom in 2005 JD Power/What Car Survey of 23,000 cars reg Sep 2002 to Aug 2003 with satisfaction score of 74.7%

Now the Fiat diesel engine is good, but there's no denying the fact that if you want reliability, then it has to be either the Toyota or the Mazda.

cjmcork

hey all - am likely to get a new focus diesel - what do we think - they have a 2 year warranty..........bore easily of cars, so likely to keep it for the 2 years - what's the opinion?

E92

Focus is great if the Mazda3 is anything to go by(very similar car really being based on the Ford after all). Look at the link in my sig. I think if you do you'll think twice about buying a new Focus diesel before July;).

Damien360

4 Focus 1.6 Diesal vans in work and all are very reliable. Service costs are low and they get 50mpg or thereabouts depending on whether they are driven like they are stolen or carefully.

Genuine rockets once you get up to speed. Dead out of first gear though so you won't be winning any races at the lights.

New Focus hatch just out and the better looking saloons coming out later in year. New diesal coming also which might bump the diesal price up a bit to cancel any gains made in VRT change.

E92

Damien360 wrote: »

New diesal coming also which might bump the diesal price up a bit to cancel any gains made in VRT change.

What diesel is that? The new Focus has the same engines as the old one, apart from the ECOnetic models(which are also the same engines as the old one, just a few aerodynamic tweaks here and there). The 1.6 diesels will have emissions low enough for 14% VRT and €100 road tax though, ECOnetic or not.

cjmcork

how much do people reckon that prices will come down and will it not be cancelled out by a bit more depreciation on my own jeep? when are the saloons coming out - cos they're gorgeous

Damien360

I was in the market for a new car a few weeks ago and bought a 2nd hand Toyota instead. During the conversation with Ford salesman he told me there is a lower emmissions TDCI engine on the way and to sit tight until after July. I came across a refernece to it on the net but I have just spent the last few minutes hunting that refernece and I could'nt find it again.

He did not have a release date for the saloon Focus at the time and I was not intersted in the hatch.

Will be dealing with him Wednesday about a 1.8TDCI Mondeo for work (if boss agrees on trade value of current Mondeo) and I will ask him again.

cjmcork

hey, that's cool - I'm not seeing my guy till friday, so at least I'll know the story before I go to him - you're not in Cork (like) no?

JHMEG

E92 wrote: »

Now the Fiat diesel engine is good, but there's no denying the fact that if you want reliability, then it has to be either the Toyota or the Mazda.

The Reliability Index link in your post puts the Honda Accord in #1 place, and the Subaru Forester in #2.

Top 10 are Honda, Subaru, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Honda, Toyota, Nissan.

Mmm.. bit of a trend there.:D

Damien360

Not in Cork .....like.

Look for E92's thread with excel sheet of costs now and after on all cars including diesals. It will open your mind a bit.

E92, cannot find that bloody reference to the engine so put it down to b******t for now (on my part and salesman).

As for reliabilty index, Honda diesals cost an arm and a leg, Subaru do not have a diesal until late this year or early next, Mitsubishi diesal no cheap, and OP said the Toyota D4D was too expensive.

Oilrig

Personal opinions based on my experiences or that of close friends,

ALFA, rotten reliability, end of story.
MAZDA, good quality but spares prices are horrendous
VW, overrated in so far as their diesels are dog rough and they are troublesome eventually regardless of maintenance - plastic cooling fittings fail etc. Parts are relatively cheap though and available from your local MF.
AUDI, SKODA, SEAT, etc, same as above.
BMW, out on their own at the moment regarding diesel refinement, but must be meticulously maintained - can be expensive
MERC, signs are that the newer stuff has recovered from the horrific reliability problems of the past - CEO got sacked over it - but still not convinced.
FORD, Focus has a bullet proof reputation, really worth a look.
TOYOTA, never heard a bad word said...

Take yer pick...

E92

JHMEG wrote: »

The Reliability Index link in your post puts the Honda Accord in #1 place, and the Subaru Forester in #2.

Top 10 are Honda, Subaru, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Honda, Toyota, Nissan.

Mmm.. bit of a trend there.:D

I gave the Honda a mention earlier, but its a lot more expensive than the Toyota never mind the Mazda(the OP was bothered by the cost of the Toyota already). I know it would be reliable obviously, it's a Honda.

What are you doing talking about diesels when you hate them so much:D?

@Damien360, the new Focus 1.6 diesel will have a cut in CO2 compared to the old one. Enough of a cut to get it into 14% VRT and €100 road tax(was previously 16% VRT and €150 road tax if they were still selling the old one in July).Perhaps this is the "new":rolleyes: engine?

Biro

Oilrig wrote: »

ALFA, rotten reliability, end of story.

Among the best diesels going.

Oilrig wrote: »

MAZDA, good quality but spares prices are horrendous

Absolute horse sh!te. Among the cheaper main dealer services and timing belt changes going. I know, I have one.

Oilrig wrote: »

BMW, out on their own at the moment regarding diesel refinement, but must be meticulously maintained - can be expensive

On a par with Accord diesel and PSA 1.6 unit in Mazda 3 and Focus I'd say.

Oilrig wrote: »

FORD, Focus has a bullet proof reputation, really worth a look.
TOYOTA, never heard a bad word said...

True, although Toyota reputation beginning to slip. Ford generally good, but a few niggly things here and there. Focus least so out of the range.

E92

Biro wrote: »

True, although Toyota reputation beginning to slip. Ford generally good, but a few niggly things here and there. Focus least so out of the range.

Toyotas are definitely starting to go down the tubes. Just go onto any websites dedicated to Toyota and see what they think of the most recent Toyota, the Auris. Anything else is still fine I think.

The Ford came top in German reliability surveys a couple of times, but I wonder how good is that PSA engine?(the petrols would be fine though, I think some of them like the 2.0 and 1.6 are Mazda engines, the 1.4 isn't though AFAIK)

cjmcork

E92, can I see this marvellous spreadsheet mentioned?

JHMEG

E92 wrote: »

IWhat are you doing talking about diesels when you hate them so much:D?

Where did I mention diesel?! OP should give up smoking and get a petrol imo.

Damien360

E92,
Spent the last hour hunting this and have come to the conclusion it must be the econetic engine you mentioned. I went in looking for a diesal and he was keeping me happy, me thinks.

As for Ford diesal relibility, I had a 2.0ltr Mondeo Zetec diesal doing 30000miles a year plus. Now 4 years old with knackered clutch but I have had to get 3 injectors replaced over that time.

The 4 Ford Focus 1.6 TDCI vans and the one hatch 1.6 TDCI do the same miles and the oldest 2 are both 05 with no engine trouble at all. No trouble at all to be honest. Servcing costs are low compared to the diesal Golfs, Passats and the one Mazda 6 in the company. Even my Mondeo was typically 400 for regular service and the Passat was 600. Focus was 300 and the Golf was 500. All prices from memory so nobody get on their high horse please.

Both Golf and Passat have 1.9 TDI and turbo blew in both. Replaced under warranty.

The Mazda 6 was very reliable and had 130000miles on when replaced 3 weeks ago but parts were costly. Timing belt change and service hit the 900 price and boss had a canary.

Biro

E92 wrote: »

Toyotas are definitely starting to go down the tubes. Just go onto any websites dedicated to Toyota and see what they think of the most recent Toyota, the Auris. Anything else is still fine I think.

The Ford came top in German reliability surveys a couple of times, but I wonder how good is that PSA engine?(the petrols would be fine though, I think some of them like the 2.0 and 1.6 are Mazda engines, the 1.4 isn't though AFAIK)

I'd far sooner it be a PSA engine than a Ford engine!

Biro

Damien360 wrote: »

The Mazda 6 was very reliable and had 130000miles on when replaced 3 weeks ago but parts were costly. Timing belt change and service hit the 900 price and boss had a canary.

Ye have a dealer that's reefing ye royally. I got the timing belt done in my 6 for €350 approx., Mazda main dealer. Mate got the same in his.

cjmcork

hello - i'm the OP and I don't smoke! I just want some advice - is that not what these forums are for?

JHMEG

cjmcork wrote: »

hello - i'm the OP and I don't smoke!

But you're about to take it up - by buying a diesel...

Damien360

The Mazda 6 was due a full major service at the time. That dealer was in Limerick. We had another 6 in Dublin and that cost typically the same as the Limerick one to service in another dealer.

Also, off topic, how do you get a previous quote to appear in the indented box. I searched this in the forums and tried it but I ended up with the text without the indented box.

bazz26

I have a Ford Focus with the 1.6 litre PSA diesel engine and find it great. Cannot fault the engine, plenty of poke and good fuel economy. My Focus is a 2005 with 76,000km of which I have put 15,000km on it so and there has been no problems with it.

2005 and early 2006 Focus 1.6 TDCi had 110bhp but from around the middle of 2006 Ford detuned the 1.6 TDCi down to 90bhp to allow for the reintroducion of their own 1.8 TDCi with 115bhp from the previous generation Focus. Not sure what the bhp the 1.6 TDCi is in the new facelifted Focus is.