Bad reference?

MelonieHead

Recently an employment agency contacted a previous employer and they gave me a bad reference! I have no idea why, although I was fired I didn't think I'd done such a bad job that they would bad-mouth me and try to ruin my chances of getting a new job.

I finished working with this company 2 years ago. My husband says it is ilegal to give a bad reference although I was always kinda sceptical about this. Can I find out what they said about me? Should I? Do you think I should contact the employer to find out why he gave me a bad reference?

AARRRGH

MelonieHead wrote: »

Recently an employment agency contacted a previous employer and they gave me a bad reference! I have no idea why, although I was fired

Ehh...

MelonieHead wrote: »

My husband says it is ilegal to give a bad reference

Only if what they said is untrue.

MelonieHead wrote: »

Can I find out what they said about me? Should I? Do you think I should contact the employer to find out why he gave me a bad reference?

Ask the employment agency. I can't think of any reason why they can't tell you what the employer said.

Einstein

Just going out on a limb here, but if you were fired from a job, it's pretty unlikely they look too favourably on you. Prob wasn't a good idea to use them as referees.
Its also polite to contact the people you plan on using as referees to let them know first.

AARRRGH

Einstein wrote: »

Just going out on a limb here, but if you were fired from a job, it's pretty unlikely they look too favourably on you. Prob wasn't a good idea to use them as referees.
Its also polite to contact the people you plan on using as referees to let them know first.

Spot on ----^

Marksie

Not a PI
Moving to work and jobs

nesf

Einstein wrote: »

Just going out on a limb here, but if you were fired from a job, it's pretty unlikely they look too favourably on you.

They just need to say "we fired them for X" and that'll be enough damaged done and perfectly defensible since it'd be true.

MIN2511

Why did you use them as references?

Wishbone Ash

It's highly unusual to get a 'bad' reference. Usually an employer gives a good one or declines to give one at all.

themadchef

I would have to think very seriously about giving someone a bad reference. But, if i'm being asked in good faith if i felt that person was a good, honest, reliable employee i would feel obliged to be honest. I would not only state the reason / reasons why this particular employee was fired, i would also add they were however good at XYZ.

I'm of the opinion that people put a reference down on a C.V and never think for a moment that particular employer is going to be contacted. Well, personally i've recieved enough calls to think otherwise.

OP, just out of interest, what did you expect him to say?

watna

As said above, they might have declined to give you a reference. I've taken one for a candidate before and the person said, sorry I'm not comfortable giving a reference, it didn't end well and we had to let him go. Obviously, that's a bad reference without them saying anything about you.

Also, I've given reference where I would never recommend the candidate. Often reference will ask about honesty/integrity. For this person (who stole while she was working for me) I said "acceptable" for honesty. Now obviously that's not a glowing reference and any recruiter will know by your tone that you really mean awful but I can't say. Also, any good recruiter will ask at the end of a reference would you hire him/her again. if they say no, that really says a lot. Often it can be what you don't say, as opposed to what you do say.

If you got fired from your last job, they may have only asked the referee your reason for leaving the job and found out you were fired or they could have said they wouldn't hire you again.

Moral of the story is don't give a company that fired you as a reference and always ring your referees beforehand to let them know to expect a call. If they don't thrilled about it, find someone else.

Xcellor

MelonieHead wrote: »

Recently an employment agency contacted a previous employer and they gave me a bad reference! I have no idea why, although I was fired I didn't think I'd done such a bad job that they would bad-mouth me and try to ruin my chances of getting a new job.

I finished working with this company 2 years ago. My husband says it is ilegal to give a bad reference although I was always kinda sceptical about this. Can I find out what they said about me? Should I? Do you think I should contact the employer to find out why he gave me a bad reference?

I can't believe that you would use a reference of someone who had to fire you. That is just really, really, really unwise. They obviously had quite a serious issue with you to fire you so what makes you think they are going to give you a glowing report. As far as illegal, I've never heard anything like that, if it was slander then fine but you were fired so......

No references is better than bad references.

cronos

MelonieHead wrote: »

Recently an employment agency contacted a previous employer and they gave me a bad reference! I have no idea why, although I was fired I didn't think I'd done such a bad job that they would bad-mouth me and try to ruin my chances of getting a new job.

I finished working with this company 2 years ago. My husband says it is ilegal to give a bad reference although I was always kinda sceptical about this. Can I find out what they said about me? Should I? Do you think I should contact the employer to find out why he gave me a bad reference?

What would be the point of a reference if giving a bad one was illegal?

As mentioned earlier ask or email people before you give someone as a reference.

You could ring up the employer and ask them what reference they gave but to be honest it would be best just to go to another agency. Dont use that employer as a reference at the new agency. You could do some charity work for a few months as that looks good on a CV and you could ask them for a reference at the end of it. Obviously money might be an issue their though but it would be a great solution to the problem though and everyone would benefit.

Electric

Why would you use them as a reference if they fired you??? To me that seems to be pure madness. Why would you think that you would get a good reference? Getting fired is pretty serious.

All they had to say to your new employer was that they fired you, which if I were your new employer it would have set off some pretty big alarm bells!

This girl that used to work with us and was fired for never showing up to work, laziness etc. She gave one of the lads in her section as a reference thinking that if she bypassed HR she would get a good one. Anyways he declined to give a reference cos if he had given one he would have felt he had to say that she had been fired. Sometimes it's better to give no reference at all!

If I were you I would try and assure your new employer that you are a worthwhile and model employee

Electric

Sorry the post appeared twice

ScouseMouse

I get asked for references on a regular basis and have no problems giving a good one where one is due. If I cannot say something good about someone I say it but have to be aware of slandering the person. I have to make sure I can backup what I say. I did see my old boss give someone a written reference which went like this.

To whom it may concern

Paddy worked here for 5 years and his performance was satisfactory.



Take from that what you will.

Personally, I do not believe someone could give a reference for a place they got sacked from.

Clytus

TBH...Im an employer,and never ever have I given someone a bad reference.

As another poster said..if I had a tough time with someone and got asked to give a reference for them,Id be more inclined to give non at all.

OP I think your husband is correct....Im pretty sure its not legal to give someone a bad reference,yet at the same time Im curious why you listed a company who let you go.

mikemac

I know it's been said before but you asked an employer who fired you to give a reference? :eek:
Seriously, what were you thinking?

It would have been better to give no reference than to do that.

It's often said that an employer that gives a one line reference or maybe none at all, then the unspoken rule is that's a bad reference as they have nothing good to say. Explained it badly but you know what I mean

Hitchhiker's Guide to...

watna wrote: »

Also, I've given reference where I would never recommend the candidate. Often reference will ask about honesty/integrity. For this person (who stole while she was working for me) I said "acceptable" for honesty. Now obviously that's not a glowing reference and any recruiter will know by your tone that you really mean awful but I can't say.

Nice! Can i work for you?

/ jokin, get your point

Don't think it is illegal to give a bad reference. It is just giving an opinion on someone, and that can't be illegal.

Think that you just have to be very certain of what you say, if the reference is bad.

watna

Yep, you do have to be very careful. I always thought of it as you can't say anything subjective like that "roundtower2 is a lazy fecker, I didn't like him at all etc". That's why generally people asking you for references will ask specific questions that you have to answer. Usually it'll be something like mark roundtower2s proactiveness out of 5. if I thought you were a lazy fecker I'd say 1 or 2 and say nothing more or I'd say diplomatically roundtower2 could be more proactive. There's way to give a bad reference without saying much and opening yourself up for legal action.

Listening to people on the phone and reading through what they're saying in the reference is a skill! You can tell a lot by tone of voice etc.

p.s. I'm sure roundtower2 is not a lazy fecker at all!

Lux23

This is something that is worrying me at the moment. Ive been offered a job subject to references and a medical and Im fairly sure I won't get bad ones but I know the company have already spoken to my referees as I rang to thank them, and they still haven't got back to me to finalise things. Ive handed in my notice and im really nervous ill end up facing the dole, not sure how these things work. They probably just haven't got around to calling me back yet but its really nervewrecking.

MIN2511

Never hand in a notice until you get a firm offer!!!!!!!!
Arrgh.... how long have you been waiting? Can you not ring them?

Lux23

MIN2511 wrote: »

Never hand in a notice until you get a firm offer!!!!!!!!
Arrgh.... how long have you been waiting? Can you not ring them?

Well my boss only spoke to them yesterday afternoon so not long, I was given no choice about giving my notice. I have only had three jobs since I was 17, the first of which i was in for nearly four years (most of which was while I was in college) but had to leave because of harrasment from another employee which this company did nothing about and was brought up in the court case(I was the victim not defendent). No way im getting a reference there and its too long ago anyway.

I did get a good reference from my previous employer before the job offer and the only other one I had is with my current employer. I get on very well here and as far as I know I shouldn't get a bad reference but I am worried. The HR girl said it was only a formality and should be no harm to hand in my notice.

To be honest Ive no idea how long these things take.
Im probably worried about nothing.

MIN2511

Lux23 wrote: »

Well my boss only spoke to them yesterday afternoon so not long, I was given no choice about giving my notice. I have only had three jobs since I was 17, the first of which i was in for nearly four years (most of which was while I was in college) but had to leave because of harrasment from another employee which this company did nothing about and was brought up in the court case(I was the victim not defendent). No way im getting a reference there and its too long ago anyway.

I did get a good reference from my previous employer before the job offer and the only other one I had is with my current employer. I get on very well here and as far as I know I shouldn't get a bad reference but I am worried. The HR girl said it was only a formality and should be no harm to hand in my notice.

To be honest Ive no idea how long these things take.
Im probably worried about nothing.

Yes, i would say the job is in the bag from your response but in future don't hand in your notice until your contract is signed!
I would say you should hear more before Friday, let us know how you get on

All the best!

Nody

Yes, you can leave a bad reference AS LONG as you can factually back it up. I.e. if I say X was fired due to stabbing a work collegue to work and I can show the court case where X was convicted for this I have done nothing wrong. On the other hand I can't say that X has stolen the lunchbox of Y unless I have something to prove this as this would be slander and would be illegal. The point is anything in the reference has to be backed up basically with something beyond gut feeling.

Due to this people don't tend to give bad reviews directly but rather as noted score someone low when asked direct questions as they are then subjective oppinions and not facts. Worth noting is that this goes in the other direction as well. If I give a review saying someone is a expert on Cisco routers with 15 years work experience with my company and company B hires him and he clearly shows he's clueless on Cisco routers company B can sue me (and my company possibly).