Rugby rules question

jayteecork

I was thinking, when a player attempts a drop-goal, the ball must touch the ground first right?
So what if the ball lay stationery(or moving) and someone chipped the ball gaelic football style over the bar, would 3 points be awarded?
Thanks.

zAbbo

no because it's not a drop kick.

You're referring to a fly-hack

tolosenc

the ball must be dropped AFAIK

I have wondered though, why isn't it a knock on?

Podge_irl

It's supposed to be dropped straight down I think, but regardless I don't think it counts as losing possession/control so therefore not a knock on (much like juggling the ball isn't).

Cool_CM

obl wrote: »

I have wondered though, why isn't it a knock on?

wondered the same for a charge down

John_C

Another question about the rules:

My understanding is that the bottom of the posts is part of the touchline so a try can be scored by touching the ball of the bottom of the padding surrounding the post. I saw two similar situations last week where a ruck had formed about a foot back from the try line beside one of the the posts, in Blackrock -v- Clongows and Scotland -v- Wales. It seems to me that it should be reasonably easy to pick up the ball and get to the bottom of the post for a try since the post is stoping a defender from standing on the try line itself at this point.
Is there any reason why this isn't done?

Sundy

John_C wrote: »

Another question about the rules:

My understanding is that the bottom of the posts is part of the touchline so a try can be scored by touching the ball of the bottom of the padding surrounding the post. I saw two similar situations last week where a ruck had formed about a foot back from the try line beside one of the the posts, in Blackrock -v- Clongows and Scotland -v- Wales. It seems to me that it should be reasonably easy to pick up the ball and get to the bottom of the post for a try since the post is stoping a defender from standing on the try line itself at this point.
Is there any reason why this isn't done?

Your correct a try can be scored that way. I seems to remember france scoring one like that against italy maybe 2/3 years ago.
I honestly think it is not done due to fear of the try not being awarded.

Amz

Note to posters: They're Laws, not rules!

Especailly people who play, never refer to them as reules, particularly when addressing a referee.

welish

It was either Gareth Thomas or Tom Shanklin who scored like that against France I think it was, the year they won the grand slam.

Downtime

Amz wrote: »

Note to posters: They're Laws, not rules!
Especailly people who play, never refer to them as reules, particularly when addressing a referee.

I remember Girvan Dempsey getting an awful time from a room full of referees for refering to them a rules.

crisco10

Cool_CM wrote: »

wondered the same for a charge down

The way i have understood that law is that it is not intentional so is therefore not a knock on.
On the post thing, Contepomi did that exact thing for leinster (last season i think). it was easier to score a try by touching it off the bottom of the post so he did, ref awarded it and felipe got the plaundits for some smart play.

Eoin

crisco10 wrote: »

The way i have understood that law is that it is not intentional so is therefore not a knock on.

A charge down is usually deliberate, so if it was considered a knock on, it would be a deliberate knock-on, and therefore a penalty.

John_C wrote:

My understanding is that the bottom of the posts is part of the touchline so a try can be scored by touching the ball of the bottom of the padding surrounding the post. I saw two similar situations last week where a ruck had formed about a foot back from the try line beside one of the the posts, in Blackrock -v- Clongows and Scotland -v- Wales. It seems to me that it should be reasonably easy to pick up the ball and get to the bottom of the post for a try since the post is stoping a defender from standing on the try line itself at this point.
Is there any reason why this isn't done?

If the ruck is right at the foot of the post, then there are probably players at the bottom and in the way. If it's a little bit out, then the defenders should be at pillar and post, blocking the way.

Crash

Actually, I havent looked over the laws in ages, but are blockdowns actually legislated for then? because otherwise surely it would count as a knock on.

komodosp

And when does a charge down become considered a knock-on? Like do they have to be within a certain distance or something? I mean you could say it counts when the ball is moving upwards or something, but if someone kicked it low for touch, could you do a soccer-style diving save to stop it, and it be considered a charge down?

Sangre

çrash_000 wrote: »

Actually, I havent looked over the laws in ages, but are blockdowns actually legislated for then? because otherwise surely it would count as a knock on.

Its a stated exception to a knock on in Law 12

"Charge down. If a player charges down the ball as an opponent kicks
it, or immediately after the kick, it is not a knock on even though the
ball may travel forward."

Crash

cheers.

Eoin

çrash_000 wrote: »

Actually, I havent looked over the laws in ages, but are blockdowns actually legislated for then? because otherwise surely it would count as a knock on.

As I said, it would count as a deliberate knock on, which would result in a penalty - that would be pretty harsh.

Sundy

http://www.irb.com/lawregulations/laws/index.html

Its all here people

pd101

Does anyone know what these new rules are that are being tested in the Super 14? I was only half listening when it was on SSN this morning, but I think one of them was that if you kick the ball out on the full and your inside the 22, it goes back to where you kicked it from. There are another few as well.

It was Stuart Barnes explaining them, so if I was paying attention I'd probably still be confused.:rolleyes::D

Stealdo

pd101 wrote: »

Does anyone know what these new rules are that are being tested in the Super 14? I was only half listening when it was on SSN this morning, but I think one of them was that if you kick the ball out on the full and your inside the 22, it goes back to where you kicked it from. There are another few as well.

It was Stuart Barnes explaining them, so if I was paying attention I'd probably still be confused.:rolleyes::D

A little OT from the original post, but....

Only part of the ELV's are going to be used in the S14 because they don't want players to get too confused when they have to revert to the existing rules for test matches later in the season. (At least that's the public line on it, it may be the case that SANZAR are trying to veto some of the new laws.)

Those that are in for the S14....

You're partly right re: kicking from inside your 22, however the rule is unchanged where the opposition plays the ball into your 22, the change is where previously if a team mate passed the ball to you from outside your 22, and you were inside the 22 you could kick directly to touch, now if you do this, the lineout will be where you kicked it. This means that teams with a scrum say just outside their 22 won't have the option of passing it back in for the kick straight to touch. If a ruck/maul/tackle is formed after you've played it in though you can kick directly out on the next phase.

The best of them in my opinion is that there will be a full offside line at a tackle, so if a player makes a linebreak and is tackled by the second line of defense he can happily pass the ball off the ground knowing that any lazy runners from the opposition are offside if they intercept. This will only apply where it's a tackle in terms of the laws - i.e. the player is brought to ground.

If the ref decides the ball is unplayable in a ruck/maul/tackle then it will be a turnover with a free kick going to the opposition. This seems to be a change from the 'team going forward' law in a ruck, and obviously FK replacing a scrum. (personally I don't like this cos I think it rewards players who get 'trapped' on the wrong side)

The corner posts are no longer considered to be in touch, so you have to touch the ground to be called out.

The non-throwing hooker will not be allowed to lift the lineout jumper at position 1. He has to stay 2 metres back, crooked throws at a lineout are a free kick rather than a scrum.

The offside line at a scrum is 5 metres back from the last foot rather than at the last foot.

Loads of penalty offences are free kicks now rather than penalties, such as incorrect binding, boring in, hands in a scrum, killing the ball in a ruck, over the top, playing the ball on the ground etc etc.

As mentioned there's a good few others in the pipeline that are not being used for the S14, but I think that's the important ones that are.

Personally I think these spell bad news for Ireland because it seems like they will hugely reward pace (something we don't have much of) and will reduce the number of lineouts in a game (kicking to touch rule, penalty rule). We'll see less penalties that allow the team to kick to touch and get the ball back. There'll be less scrums as well, but with the 5 metre off side line, there's a real attacking option for a team to opt for a scrum rather than a free kick.

Won't judge it till I see it in action at the top level, but it smells a lot like league to me.

ekevosu

I can't find the link now but all these new rules (proposed) are on youtube with examples of it being tested in real life games (the scottish league I think?).

Someone on this forum posted it before and some of them seemed really interesting, as many numbers as you want in the lineout regardless of other team etc. The video explainsd it really well, sorry can't find the link right now.

pd101

Stealdo wrote: »

Won't judge it till I see it in action at the top level, but it smells a lot like league to me.

Thats what I was thinking as I read your post. Thanks for clearing it up though.