Overnight stay in Mallow on Iarnrod Éireann timetable is ridiculous

Halfdog

I was looking up the Iarnrod Eireann timetable on their website. enquiring about trains returning from Tralee to Dublin. Apparently the last train from Tralee leaves at 21:15 and arrives in Mallow at 22.53 You then have to hang around all night until 5:35 to get the Cork train to Dublin.

This is rediculous, Do they leave the station open for you so you can kip on a bench? They could at least include a free packet of Marsh Mallows.

Tralee

Mallow

21:15

22:53

Railcar

Mallow

Dublin Heuston

05:37

08:25

InterCity

http://www.irishrail.ie/your_journey/timetables_junction1.asp

Chris_533976

I'd stay there for the night if they gave out free packets of Marsh Mallows

invincibleirish

#reason no. 475# of why irish rail are not a decent rail company, no night trains

heres my random idea, night train Cork-Dublin-Belfast, leave Cork 12am, stop everywhere, Dublin 2.30am-Belfast 4am and another train in reverse?

Queue replies citing difficulties re: Demand, Unions, Physical difficulties(what train used) etc. etc. so it cant be done.

Night trains & Sleeper trains everywhere else in Europe. Not Ireland.

KC61

The last train out of Tralee with a direct connection to Dublin is at 1915.

The next train is at 2115 - The website is making the point that with an overnight stay in Mallow you can then get the first train to Dublin the next morning.

Most transport journey planners do show this sort of option.

And no - you cannot stay in the station.

As for night trains, they really only are useful for very long distances, and I don't think any journeys in Ireland qualify.

Ham'nd'egger

Halfdog wrote: »

I was looking up the Iarnrod Eireann timetable on their website. enquiring about trains returning from Tralee to Dublin. Apparently the last train from Tralee leaves at 21:15 and arrives in Mallow at 22.53 You then have to hang around all night until 5:35 to get the Cork train to Dublin.

This is rediculous, Do they leave the station open for you so you can kip on a bench? They could at least include a free packet of Marsh Mallows.

If really you want to get back to Dublin enough that badly, get the earlier 7:15PM train.

Ham'nd'egger

KC61 wrote: »

The last train out of Tralee with a direct connection to Dublin is at 1915.

The next train is at 2115 - The website is making the point that with an overnight stay in Mallow you can then get the first train to Dublin the next morning.

Most transport journey planners do show this sort of option.

And no - you cannot stay in the station.

As for night trains, they really only are useful for very long distances, and I don't think any journeys in Ireland qualify.

You beat me to it, KC.

Sleepers have been tried a few times in Ireland but were never even near successful. As you say, the distances are not long enough to warrant it (Longest trip is Dublin-Tralee direct, circa 4 hours) nor would the numbers.

invincibleirish

Hamndegger wrote: »

You beat me to it, KC.

Sleepers have been tried a few times in Ireland but were never even near successful. As you say, the distances are not long enough to warrant it (Longest trip is Dublin-Tralee direct, circa 4 hours) nor would the numbers.

Intriguing, anywhere on the net about those sleeper trains?

I see BE are doing Dublin-Belfast 24hrs now by bus, how about a similar service for Cork and other provincial centres instead?

L1011

invincibleirish wrote: »

Intriguing, anywhere on the net about those sleeper trains?

I see BE are doing Dublin-Belfast 24hrs now by bus, how about a similar service for Cork and other provincial centres instead?

BE only run two of those services, the 11:00 and 03:00 (I think...) are run by Chambers on behalf of Ulsterbus. Theres not a huge demand - there was about 20 people on the 3am when I took it back after a concert and about 30 on the 11pm, but its a useful service. It has to leave from the road beside Europa as Ulsterbus don't think you're worth keeping warm

markpb

MYOB wrote: »

BE only run two of those services, the 11:00 and 03:00 (I think...) are run by Chambers on behalf of Ulsterbus. Theres not a huge demand - there was about 20 people on the 3am when I took it back after a concert and about 30 on the 11pm, but its a useful service. It has to leave from the road beside Europa as Ulsterbus don't think you're worth keeping warm

Isn't 20/53 almost half the bus? I'd say that's quite busy for a night bus and is more than covering their running costs. It's a fantastic service, especially now that it runs all through the night.

Ham'nd'egger

invincibleirish wrote: »

Intriguing, anywhere on the net about those sleeper trains?

I see BE are doing Dublin-Belfast 24hrs now by bus, how about a similar service for Cork and other provincial centres instead?

The best place to look for information would be the Irish Railway Records Society. If you are lucky, they have have had a paper published in their Magazine, IRRS Journal, over the years so the research will have been done for you. In the UK, sleepers only run on a few select routes, mainly from London to Scotland and the west country and are pricey; you pay for a ticket and a bed in one.

I have no idea on how the Dublin-Belfast service is doing numbers wise. It's one snag is that it it licensed onto to pick up until it crosses the border, and thence only to drop off on the North and vice versa on it's return route; it being a shared route with Ulsterbus. A Dublin-Cork bus would barely cover it's running cost at night, let alone a train.

jjbrien

invincibleirish wrote: »

#reason no. 475# of why irish rail are not a decent rail company, no night trains

heres my random idea, night train Cork-Dublin-Belfast, leave Cork 12am, stop everywhere, Dublin 2.30am-Belfast 4am and another train in reverse?

Queue replies citing difficulties re: Demand, Unions, Physical difficulties(what train used) etc. etc. so it cant be done.

Night trains & Sleeper trains everywhere else in Europe. Not Ireland.

I had an idea about this a few years ago but I would do it as leaving derry around 11pm, Belfast Central 12pm, to Dublin then down to Rosslare, then across from Rosslare to Cork via Waterford.

Ham'nd'egger

jjbrien wrote: »

I had an idea about this a few years ago but I would do it as leaving derry around 11pm, Belfast Central 12pm, to Dublin then down to Rosslare, then across from Rosslare to Cork via Waterford.

Derry-Belfast is 2 hours, Dublin Belfast is 2 hours, Dublin-Rosslare Harbour is 3 Hours, Rosslare Harbour-Waterford is 1 hour; Waterford-Limerick Junction is 2 hours while Limerick Junction is another hour. That comes in at 11 hours and up to 4 driver changes. Rosslare services would need to be running to meet a ferry to warrant it serving the station here; it is a quiet line at the best of times. There is also the cost of keeping at least 7 major stations en route open for this service, assuming that intermediate stations are not served. From Greystones to Waterford and towards Limerick Junction, signal boxes will need to be manned for this one movement, as will several level crossings.

Schuhart

Halfdog wrote: »

Do they leave the station open for you so you can kip on a bench?

You'll get the same kind of result on other routes - I think its just a feature of the timetable application.

afatbollix

got stuck in tralee because of this one night... basterds...

Ham'nd'egger

anto-t wrote: »

got stuck in tralee because of this one night... basterds...

No. You got stuck because you probably didn't check up the timetable properly.:D

afatbollix

i asked some one elce to check for me... idiots...

John R

invincibleirish wrote: »

#reason no. 475# of why irish rail are not a decent rail company, no night trains

heres my random idea, night train Cork-Dublin-Belfast, leave Cork 12am, stop everywhere, Dublin 2.30am-Belfast 4am and another train in reverse?

Queue replies citing difficulties re: Demand, Unions, Physical difficulties(what train used) etc. etc. so it cant be done.

Night trains & Sleeper trains everywhere else in Europe. Not Ireland.

There are far fewer sleeper trains across Europe now than there has ever been, with higher-speed trunk routes, motorways and loe-cost airlines the market for them has been on a downward curve for the last 20 years. They are only remaining popular for long distance city-city journeys that do not exist in Ireland.

The UK is a prime example, 30 years ago there were approx 15 sleeper trains nightly and dozens of overnight seated trains. Now there are 3 sleepers and only a handful of other lines have overnight trains, all of which are primarily to serve airports (Gatwick, Luton, Manchester) or sea ports (Holyhead, Fishguard). There are plenty of lines with 19-20-21 hour service but the earliest/latest trains all are lightly loaded in comparison to the rest of the day.

One of the few remaining sleeper services (London-Penzance) was threatened for closure recently and the level of subsidy paid per passenger (to the private company who operate it) was frightening, if I can find the report I will put it up here. In the UK they have the benefit of much of the lines used being open overnight for freight movements, in Ireland this is not so and all the cost of keeping open lines that would now be closed 23;00-05/06.00 would be all for one or two little-used passenger trains. You could easily hava a case of needing several times as many staff on duty than the train would be carrying.

John R

MYOB wrote: »

BE only run two of those services, the 11:00 and 03:00 (I think...) are run by Chambers on behalf of Ulsterbus. Theres not a huge demand - there was about 20 people on the 3am when I took it back after a concert and about 30 on the 11pm, but its a useful service. It has to leave from the road beside Europa as Ulsterbus don't think you're worth keeping warm

The Dublin-Belfast route is all jointly operated by BE and Ulsterbus, Chambers and the various operators BE sometimes use are on contract. The farebox goes to BE and UB the same as if it were their own coaches and drivers.

Bus Eireann (and Ulsterbus) also have some overnight services on the Dublin - Letterkenny, Dublin - Derry and Dublin-Galway routes. There are plans to extend this to some other trunk routes although I cannot give details at the moment.

The main market for all these are connections to Dublin Airport although they do get steady loads to/from Dublin city as well.

The loadings on the 11pm, 1am, 3am Dublin - Belfast runs was good enough for BE/UB to extend it to a full 24hr service.

munchkin_utd

John R wrote: »

There are far fewer sleeper trains across Europe now than there has ever been, with higher-speed trunk routes, motorways and loe-cost airlines the market for them has been on a downward curve for the last 20 years. They are only remaining popular for long distance city-city journeys that do not exist in Ireland.

A big market for the sleeper trains in Europe is the American and Asian student backpacker type of person. They use the night travelling to avoid "dead time" travelling on trains during the daytime. And its less nights to pay for accomodation!!

Go to sleep in Paris wake up in Barcelona, Go to sleep in Barcelona wake up in Milan! Its handy if you are on a Budget and want to stay flexible-ish.

It wouldnt be something that would work in ireland. Comfy night busses though from one end of Ireland to the other on the quiet roads at night though might be more viable and economical all right as other people are suggesting.

serfboard

munchkin_utd wrote: »

It wouldnt be something that would work in ireland. Comfy night busses though from one end of Ireland to the other on the quiet roads at night though might be more viable and economical all right as other people are suggesting.

Well, if you're travelling to/from Galway you can indeed travel at night.

Citylink run a service from Galway to Dublin Airport / City Centre and all points in between at 01:15 and 02:15 arriving in Dublin at 04:45 and 05:45 (http://www.citylink.ie/timetable-galw2dubl.htm). They also do a service from Galway to Shannon Airport (and all points) at 03:30 arriving 04:45.

Bus Eireann do a service from Galway to Dublin Airport / City at midnight, gets in after 3 AM.

And for other parts of the country there are these (http://www.buseireann.ie/site/your_journey/nightrider_services.asp) NightRider services that Bus Eireann provide as well.

We're not there yet, but this country has improved a lot in terms of 24 hour travel compared to what it used to be like ...

Slice

Isn't 20/53 almost half the bus? I'd say that's quite busy for a night bus and is more than covering their running costs. It's a fantastic service, especially now that it runs all through the night.

Hell, if those are the figures and if Irish Rail can justify putting on 9 services for 600 people then it wont be too long before they get round to doing a sleeper service as well

invincibleirish

serfboard wrote: »

We're not there yet, but this country has improved a lot in terms of 24 hour travel compared to what it used to be like ...

Not in Cork it hasnt, no Nightrider services, no nightlink, no late services at all, 11.20pm is last call for city bus service and anywhere between 9-11pm last call for commuter services, ridiculous, if you were to try and live your life by public transport you'd always be home in bed for 12, who wants that?.i see even sligo has late night services? WTF? if Sligo can,if Dublin can then why cant other urban areas?.

bazzer06

Hamndegger wrote: »

Derry-Belfast is 2 hours, Dublin Belfast is 2 hours, Dublin-Rosslare Harbour is 3 Hours, Rosslare Harbour-Waterford is 1 hour; Waterford-Limerick Junction is 2 hours while Limerick Junction is another hour. That comes in at 11 hours and up to 4 driver changes. Rosslare services would need to be running to meet a ferry to warrant it serving the station here; it is a quiet line at the best of times. There is also the cost of keeping at least 7 major stations en route open for this service, assuming that intermediate stations are not served. From Greystones to Waterford and towards Limerick Junction, signal boxes will need to be manned for this one movement, as will several level crossings.

Not to argue with the general theme of your post but dublin - rosslare a quiet line????? on the absolute contrary i'd say

Aquitaine

bazzer06 wrote: »

Not to argue with the general theme of your post but dublin - rosslare a quiet line????? on the absolute contrary i'd say

It certainly isnt. you cant breath on that train some days its so busy

Ham'nd'egger

bazzer06 wrote: »

Not to argue with the general theme of your post but dublin - rosslare a quiet line????? on the absolute contrary i'd say

\

Towards Arklow, Gorey and Enniscorthy, the line does very well into Dublin with commuters. The section into Wexford and Rosslare Village and Harbour however are very quiet and struggle to garner much traffic even with the ferry traffic.

Colm R

invincibleirish wrote: »

Not in Cork it hasnt, no Nightrider services, no nightlink, no late services at all, 11.20pm is last call for city bus service and anywhere between 9-11pm last call for commuter services, ridiculous, if you were to try and live your life by public transport you'd always be home in bed for 12, who wants that?.i see even sligo has late night services? WTF? if Sligo can,if Dublin can then why cant other urban areas?.

When it comes to Cork, Bus Eireann does not care about the quality of services. I'm actually going to go and start a new thread on this.