Getting stalked... by a mentally disabled person

LegacyUser

Here's what happened. Basically I've been getting the same bus to town for the last 3 years, Pretty much the bus driver is always the same chap and we've got to know each other. Also at my stop there is a girl who gets on who had down syndrome (I've no idea what age she is) Inever took any notice of her or anyone as i usually do be asleep getting on the bus. About 5 months ago she slipped while getting on the bus and i caught her before she hit the ground. now of course I would have done the same for anyone else.

But this girl does not see it like that. Since then she has been stalking me, I'm not exactly terrified but a little creeped out and feel sorry for her. Basically she gets off the bus in town 3 stops before me, now she gets off at my stop and and follows me to work. Some days she has stood outside my building for the whole day without moving then when i get on the bus she gets on it to sometimes she will also follow me home. Now while this was funny in a sad way at first its getting on my nerves. The bus driver was asked by this girls mother to keep an eye on her when she start getting the bus a few years ago so he gave me her mothers phone number. I called her and she was very apologetic and said she will speak to her but it hasnt made a bit of difference. She has started calling into my office now to reception to ask to speak to me, my boss and colleagues think again its hilarious but equally a sad situation for this girl. Also I wouldnt go to the local too much maybe once a month but the last couple of times i've been there she seems to turn up, she stands outside near the smoking area.

My partner suggested calling the gardai but I think they'd laugh at me and I wouldnt blame them. This girl has yet to even speak to me and I dotn want to speak to her in case i upset her or give her more reason to follow me. I'm hoping ignoring her will evenutually work but It hasnt so far, any advice?

dudara

I think that you're going to have to talk to the mother again and try to be a little more forceful with her.

The only other thing that comes to mind is that this girl might get distracted by someone else shortly.

Lollipops23

I'd tend to agree with Dudara on this.Let her mother know that she has been coming to your place of work and you really don't think it's appropriate.

I'd also tend to wonder why they let her roam the streets with no idea where she's going...what if the person that she took an interest in was of a more sinister nature than yourself?

milkerman

As dudara said you will need to be more forceful with this girls mother. Letting your Downs Syndrome child stand outside someones office all day is tantamount to neglect. OK you are freaked out by this, sadly there are some pervs out there who would have no conscience about taking advantage of her.
Speak to the mother again, if there is not an immediate cessation of this behaviour go ahead and report it to the Gardai saying that you are concerned about the girls safety.
Always record the name of the member you speak to and get an incident number.

Beruthiel

dudara wrote: »

I think that you're going to have to talk to the mother again and try to be a little more forceful with her.

Agree. Talk to the mother again, no need to get the Garda involved just yet.

FagFury

Definitely speak to her mother again. Tell her that if it doesn't stop you may have to speak to social services about her daughter and thats the last thing you want to have to do. Downs syndrome adults have the mentality of children so it is definitely neglectful to leave her standing around outside your office all day.

Perhaps the next time you are in the pub with your partner and she is hanging around there you both could have a word with her and explain what she is doing is wrong and to please stop. Don't do it on your own as they can behave irrationally and you need to have someone with you.

LadyJ

Hey OP,

It's an awkward one alright! I'd agree with everyone else, you should have a word with her mother and keep having words with her until it stops.

I used to volunteer in St Michael's House years ago when I was about 13 or so and it became quite clear to me that down's syndrome people form attachments very easily. They also seem to remember people's faces even after years and years. One of the kids that used to be there recognised me on a bus a couple of years ago which I thought was really strange.

It seems to me that this girl associates you with feelings of safety and trust which is probably why she's following you. She might have gotten quite a fright when she fell and you're the guy who saved her so she's grateful.

However, while you should be flattered, it is clearly getting to be a bit much and her mother is responsible for controlling the situation so make sure she deals with it.

Oriel

scared55 wrote: »

My boss and colleagues think again its hilarious

They are correct!
Speak to her mother, and tell her exactly what you've said here.

Gumbyman

Talk to mother again. Where do they think she goes during the day? Poor girl.

K_P

Talk to the mother again. Also, she's obviously supposed to be at some day centre or work or some place if she's getting on the same bus every day. Have the people there not wondered where this girl is when she doesn't turn up?

marie_85

Definitely talk to the mother again. Stress that you're worried about the girl standing around all day. And that it's not appropriate that she's asking for you in work.

But in the meantime, have you considered or is it possible to get an earlier bus? Or even walk to the next bus stop so she doesn't see you. It's inconvenient, I know, but it's what I would do as a short term solution.

LegacyUser

K_P wrote: »

Talk to the mother again. Also, she's obviously supposed to be at some day centre or work or some place if she's getting on the same bus every day. Have the people there not wondered where this girl is when she doesn't turn up?

She is meant to go to some education centre or something for a few hours.

Her parents are pretty elderly in their 70's anyway so maybe they dont grasp the seriousness of it. I will speak with them again though.

Aura

Talk to the people in charge of the education centre if her parents aren't proving responsive.

ErinGoBrath

Agree with what the others have said re: contacting the mother again.

Fair play to you OP, you've been very considerate and handled the situation quite repectfully thus far.

cheekyass

scared55 wrote: »

" She has started calling into my office now to reception to ask to speak to me"

Sorry but this may be a silly question......but how does she know who to ask for???

Its definitely a sensitive situation, but its harmless....so I wouldn't think its right to get the gards involved. This would probably cause her parents to get an awful shock too...and I just don't think theres any need to involve them.

Speaking to her mother is probably the best road to take.

Good Luck!

DerekZoolander

or of course theres the other alternative and just go for it buddy

Wibbs

First and only warning for unhelpful comments for DerekZoolander.

Rb

Tell her mother you've seen a strange man following her daughter around during the day and that you're worried for her safety, might prompt the mother to take more control of the situation.

dresden8

What's the law in this situation. If the mother is in her 70's the child must be well an adult. Is she responsible? If not, who is?

Toots

My suggestion would be to contact the education centre and see what you can do there. Explain that as well as being inappropriate for her to hang out around her office, it is dangerous for her to be waiting outside the building all day on her own. My sister has Downs Syndrome, and she simply wouldn't have the wherewithall to know if someone was following her, or watching her. Even as adults the situation is the same. Call the education centre, and see would they maybe be able to arrange to phone her mother in the mornings to confirm that she either has or hasn't come to the centre.

TBH, she is going to need to be told more than once that she can't follow you to work. My guess is that her mother has said it to her, but then she's continued to follow you to work and nothing has happened so she thinks it's ok. Don't say anything to her yourself though, as you may upset her, or it could have the opposite effect and encourage her behaviour. I wouldn't get the Gardai involved unless it really gets out of control and the education centre and the mother don't do anything.

Mr. Presentable

Call Social Services and report both her parents and the centre she'd attending. If she's doing this with you she may endanger herself by latching onto someone else. Report them because you have advised both of the situation and they have done nothing.

jellie

yeah if youre not getting anywhere with her parents you should try the education centre. really the parents should be grateful this was pointed out to them & that youre not getting angry about it, there are some people who wouldve lashed out at the girl if she was following them all the time. i hope you sort it out, its a very sad situation

Mrs OBumble

If the parents are in their 70's, then this woman is, at a minimum, 30. She's not a "girl", she's a woman who happens to have an intellectual disability.

That doesn't mean she can't understand things, it means she will take longer and perhaps needs different methods to learn. Someone needs to find a way to tell her, in a way she understands, how her behaviour is making you feel, and what she could do that makes you more comfortable.

OP: do you have a girlfriend, sister, or even just a female friend, who could talk to her? Don't try it yourself, because the woman's attraction to you probably means she won't be able to hear what you're really saying. (Yes, I've assumed that the woman has the verbal skills for a conversation like this, it seems likely given that she can go into the office and ask for you by name.) Best not to get someone to pose as your girlfriend, because this woman has DS, she's not stupid, and may well catch the lie out.

You could try the garda, but really, what crime is she committing? Yeah, I guess they could direct her to move along instead of loitering, but probably they have better things to do with their time.

If you talk to her mother again, I'd go for a more facilitative approach. Try to find out what social support agencies they are involved with (eg the day-centre, a church, social group etc), and see who from there could help the situation. With elderly parents, there's always the risk that they will become unable to provide living-support, so there need to be agencies to help put in other supports well before the parents get old/sick. If there are no agencies around, then offer to work with the mother to look around the community for what supports there are - among other things, helping get the woman involved in other activities where she would meet other people would take the focus off you.

Good luck.

dc69

just call the garda and get them to advise,I doubt they will find it funny when you tell them the lengths she is going to i.e following you and calling your office.She is disrupting your life

If I was you I would just get a restraining order.Obviously you dont want her to get in trouble with the law but it may prompt swift action from her parents or carers when the garda turn up at the house or care centre,telling them that someone has taken a restraining order out on her.

an alternative,what i would do is simple tell her to piss off,blunt but it might work,it aint your problem how she reacts(mods that is meant seriously),its unusually harsh but it could be the easiest method to resolve the situation and if she doesnt respond(i.e leave you alone) it will go in your favour if you do go to the garda as you will have already asked to be left alone,and she hasnt done so.

Lola123

JustMary wrote: »

If the parents are in their 70's, then this woman is, at a minimum, 30. She's not a "girl", she's a woman who happens to have an intellectual disability.

That doesn't mean she can't understand things, it means she will take longer and perhaps needs different methods to learn. Someone needs to find a way to tell her, in a way she understands, how her behaviour is making you feel, and what she could do that makes you more comfortable.

OP: do you have a girlfriend, sister, or even just a female friend, who could talk to her? Don't try it yourself, because the woman's attraction to you probably means she won't be able to hear what you're really saying. (Yes, I've assumed that the woman has the verbal skills for a conversation like this, it seems likely given that she can go into the office and ask for you by name.) Best not to get someone to pose as your girlfriend, because this woman has DS, she's not stupid, and may well catch the lie out.

You could try the garda, but really, what crime is she committing? Yeah, I guess they could direct her to move along instead of loitering, but probably they have better things to do with their time.

If you talk to her mother again, I'd go for a more facilitative approach. Try to find out what social support agencies they are involved with (eg the day-centre, a church, social group etc), and see who from there could help the situation. With elderly parents, there's always the risk that they will become unable to provide living-support, so there need to be agencies to help put in other supports well before the parents get old/sick. If there are no agencies around, then offer to work with the mother to look around the community for what supports there are - among other things, helping get the woman involved in other activities where she would meet other people would take the focus off you.

Good luck.

QFT.
Op,
Have you considered that maybe she just wants to say thank you or something and doesn't know how to go about it? Agreed that it's not a nice feeling to have someone following you around, but in this situation, don't go ringing the gardai, unless it's to tell them you are concerned for her safety.
Ring her mother again and contact the education centre.

Snake Nose

JustMary wrote: »

If the parents are in their 70's, then this woman is, at a minimum, 30. She's not a "girl", she's a woman who happens to have an intellectual disability.

That doesn't mean she can't understand things, it means she will take longer and perhaps needs different methods to learn. Someone needs to find a way to tell her, in a way she understands, how her behaviour is making you feel, and what she could do that makes you more comfortable.

He knows all that - that's why he is approaching with extreme caution.

OP: do you have a girlfriend, sister, or even just a female friend, who could talk to her? Don't try it yourself, because the woman's attraction to you probably means she won't be able to hear what you're really saying. (Yes, I've assumed that the woman has the verbal skills for a conversation like this, it seems likely given that she can go into the office and ask for you by name.) Best not to get someone to pose as your girlfriend, because this woman has DS, she's not stupid, and may well catch the lie out.

Why should he have to go to all this hassle? And why get somone who is untrained to try and mediate the situation? She is either responsible for herself, or her guardian is - and the person responsible needs to be told kindly that it must stop, and let THEM deal with it. He shouldn't have to 'own' this problem. he has already been more than tolerant.

You could try the garda, but really, what crime is she committing?

Stalking - it's a crime. Look it up.

I agree that he should talk to the parents again, but the bottom line is that he shouldn't have to be dealing with this, as calling into his job and asking for him is going beyond 'harmless'.

celt262

I find this story hard to believe im sorry if it is genuine but i don't understand how a Downs Syndrome person can be let wander the streets and stand outside buildings all day without someone contacting social services.

Noopti

There have been plenty of cases of social services/parents neglecting children, and it going unnoticed. it is perfectly feasible that this story is true.

celt262

It's disgraceful if it is and the OP should definatley contact the relevant people to stop it from happening.

Noopti

Agreed, if talking to the parents multiple times yields no success then social services should be called.

Quality

Why dont you just try and talk to the girl? Ask her why she is following you?

tbh

I don't think that's a good idea. You shouldn't have any contact with the girl, it will probably only confuse her. You won't be able to properly explain the situation to her, and you might even frighten her. My advice would be to contact her mother again, and tell her if she doesn't do something about it, you'll have no choice but to go to social services. and you'd be doing the right thing if you did, this girls welfare is in danger.

Toots

celt262 wrote: »

I find this story hard to believe im sorry if it is genuine but i don't understand how a Downs Syndrome person can be let wander the streets and stand outside buildings all day without someone contacting social services.

If she's an adult there's a good chance nobody would think to call social services. There are many adults with Downs Syndrome who have part time jobs and go around doing their own bits and pieces independently, but live in sheleterd accommodation, it just depends on the severity of their disability. The fact that she gets the bus on her own indicates that she must have a level of independence.

LegacyUser

This is a sad situation.

But you can't go to the parent, they are in their 70's...

The poor girl is just confused...i'd try get the education centre who look after her to deal with it...

shinny

cheesedude wrote: »

This is a sad situation.

But you can't go to the parent, they are in their 70's...

The poor girl is just confused...i'd try get the education centre who look after her to deal with it...

That's a very good idea. At least they know her and she wouldn't feel like she was being reprimanded. You'd have to ask them to clearly spell it out to her.

It really is an awful situation.

Lollipops23

dc69 wrote: »

an alternative,what i would do is simple tell her to piss off,blunt but it might work,it aint your problem how she reacts(mods that is meant seriously),its unusually harsh but it could be the easiest method to resolve the situation and if she doesnt respond(i.e leave you alone) it will go in your favour if you do go to the garda as you will have already asked to be left alone,and she hasnt done so.

You don't seem to understand that the girl has a mental disability.if a person with Downs is told not to do something they might need to be told several times or much more forcefully. It is not the OPs place to do this as she(the OP is a girl btw) does not want to upset her(v understandable tbh)

i think she should go back to the parents and have a frank discussion about the fact that they are being so irrespnsible about there daugther. Don't care that they are elderly, it's a sad part of having child with Downs that you need to take care of them into adulthood.

dublinlawyer

Quality wrote: »

Why dont you just try and talk to the girl? Ask her why she is following you?

+1
I think some of you are being way over dramatic. Police, social services ..theyre not the first resort here. I wouldnt like these parents to get the fright of their lives. I'm sure life has been tough enough.
And if she says she loves you or whatever just explain to her that you don't feel that way. That you helped her on the bus as you would anyone. That she must not follow you anymore and she must go to her school.
Before you all say ..she won't understand...well if she's capable of forming a crush she may be capable of breaking it.

johnnyskeleton

Would you consider getting a different bus or cycling/getting a lift into work? It might sound harsh but it will definately send a message.

bronte

My mother works with these types of children, and I used to go into her workplace on sunday about 10 years ago.
I was in the other day and the children all remembered me.
I couldn't believe it.
Memory must be a strong part of their development.
If you have no joy with the parents try and get a hold of the education centre and explain everything.
Good luck.

Mrs OBumble

Lollipops23 wrote: »

You don't seem to understand that the girl has a mental disability.if a person with Downs is told not to do something they might need to be told several times or much more forcefully. It is not the OPs place to do this as she(the OP is a girl btw) does not want to upset her(v understandable tbh)

Ahh, that the OP is female (a woman, not a girl, she's way over 16 if she's working in an office) puts a whole new light on things, and removes a whole bunch of sexual connotations.

OP, I've changed my mind. If you're a decent human-being, rather than a NIMBY (and I suspect you are, or you wouldn't have bothered posting), then you should talk to woman yourself ... but with the support of social agencies as I suggested before. You need to be very clear about what you want to happen (Some possibilities: you want her locked up so you never see her anywhere again? it's ok if she catches the bus but not if she gets off at your stop? you're willing to say "hello" when she gets on the bus, but don't want any contact other than that? you're willing to have coffee with her for 1/2 an hour once a week, provided she leaves you alone the rest of the time? ).

BTW: the condition is called Down Syndrome, not Downs Syndrome. It's named after the doctor who first "discovered it". It would be good to have at least a basic level of respect for the people who live with it, and call it by the correct name.

Lollipops23 wrote: »

i think she should go back to the parents and have a frank discussion about the fact that they are being so irrespnsible about there daugther. Don't care that they are elderly, it's a sad part of having child with Downs that you need to take care of them into adulthood.

The woman is an adult, and I'm struggling to see how the parents are being irresponsible. In the days when society didn't know how to educate or care for people with DS, most of them didn't learn to function with any degree of independence (catching the bus, working part time), they usually died before their parents, and most were locked in psychiatric hospitals out of the public eye. That has now changed, thank goodness, but it means that responsibility for care and behaviour management lies with society, not the parents. (We wouldn't expect the parents of a 30-year-old alcoholic to care for him/her. Why should we expect it of parents of a person with an intellectual disability.)

seahorse

I'm sorry but clearly the social services need to be involved here. A young mentally disabled woman is wandering around town clinging to strangers - who knows who'll be the next stranger she'll get overly fond of, or what their morals or pervy leanings might be?

This girls parents need to be told in no uncertain terms what's going on here and they need to stop brushing off their responsibilities also.

passive

Lollipops23 wrote: »

You don't seem to understand that the girl has a mental disability.if a person with Downs is told not to do something they might need to be told several times or much more forcefully. It is not the OPs place to do this as she(the OP is a girl btw) does not want to upset her(v understandable tbh)

i think she should go back to the parents and have a frank discussion about the fact that they are being so irrespnsible about there daugther. Don't care that they are elderly, it's a sad part of having child with Downs that you need to take care of them into adulthood.

Just out of curiosity, when was the OP's sex clarified? Sorry if I'm missing an obvious clue...

JustMary wrote: »

BTW: the condition is called Down Syndrome, not Downs Syndrome. It's named after the doctor who first "discovered it". It would be good to have at least a basic level of respect for the people who live with it, and call it by the correct name.

Huge difference, totally caused by bigotry, hatred and disrespectfulness, not an understandable and barely noticable (in the sound) assumption of the possessive (sadly sans apostrophe) to a condition named after a person.

(edit: "Down's Syndrome in British English" according to Wikipedia.")

LegacyUser

Wikipedia is not a relevant source...anyone can just go in and edit it. I don't know why people always use wikipedia to back up an arguement.

JustMary is totally correct by the way...I fully agree with all she said

Tragedy

According to the 38 year old registered english charity, it's called Down's Syndrome in english.

OP: as has been said, try parents again, then try the care centre. It's not your responsibility to talk to the girl

Santa Claus

cheesedude wrote: »

JustMary is totally correct by the way...I fully agree with all she said

She is correct, but saying people are being disrespectful to people with Down syndrome by referring to it as Downs sysndrome is a bit OTT.

Practically every poster on this thread has shown concern for the safety/welfare of this young woman and tried to come up with discreet/compassionate ways to resolve the situation without it resulting in embarassment for the young woman.
Just because some of them spelt the name of her condition wrong doesn't change this !!

passive

well firstly, it linked to here -> http://www.ds-health.com/trisomy.htm

Wikipedia doesn't just make stuff up, except in the case of subtle factual errors or opinionated garbage... But anyway, the fact that it can actually be "down's" rather than down syndrome is an incidental afterthought to "it's stupid and wrong to make out that people were in some way being offensive or discriminatory by accidentally using an s on the end." So agree all you want.

Anyway, getting reluctantly into "all she said," the OP is under no obligation to this person. She should contact the parents again and any relevant social services who can protect the disabled girl/woman and she should be allowed continue with her life. Disability does not come with a licence for invasion of personal space/straightforward stalking. it does mean a person might do those things without any malice or understanding of the situation, but it also means there should be people or institutions in place to care for and guide them away from such courses of action.

The OP does not have to go for coffee with the person who's been following her in a very bizarre fashion. And I don't know where I stand on society/parental responsibility, but either way the overall welfare of this girl is not the OPs responsibility, although she would of course help her in any immediate way (such as stopping her from falling, which caused all this obsessive trouble).

StormWarrior

If the woman with Downs Syndrome can form an obsessive attatchment that easily, then I would imagine offering to associate with her in any way would further encourage such behaviour. If this woman spends all day stalking someone she doesn't even know, then clearly she should have someone keeping an eye on her, parents, education centre or whoever. I really think the OP should ask social services for help, or at least tell the parents she is considering it. Letting this situation continue is unsafe for the woman with Downs. As previously mentioned, what if some unscrupulous person decides to take advantage of her? And if the parents and education centre aren't doing their jobs properly, maybe they need some help from social services. I know people say she's an adult and seemingly independent, but her behaviour clearly shows she needs to be taken care of.

Mrs OBumble

passive wrote: »

well firstly, it linked to here -> http://www.ds-health.com/trisomy.htm

The OP does not have to go for coffee with the person who's been following her in a very bizarre fashion. ... but either way the overall welfare of this girl is not the OPs responsibility.

No one said that the OP had to do this.

But I did suggest that the OP needs to work out what she wants to happen - with the options ranging from the woman being locked up or at least barred from catching the bus (via trespass order), to the OP giving her a degree of friendship. I have no idea what the best possibility here, just suggested some options.

And IMHO, the welfare of every single member of society is the responsibility of every single other member of society. This is why those who are working pay taxes which are used to support those who are old, sick, unemployed, disabled etc. On a more personal level, the welfare of the people who live in my town, suburb or street, catch my bus, work in my workplace, play in my sports club, etc IS my responsibility.