Irish P4P list

sligobhoy67

Heres a no bad one IMO

Big Ears

Oisin Fagan in 6th and Brian Magee in 15th ?...........something seriously wrong there . I suppose all lists are subjective but I think it's insulting to have Brian Magee there , he's even below Jason McKay(an inferior fighter in the same weight class) .

jimmyboy

Oisin Fagan is a good fighter. Only been fighting for 5 years and was very unlucky in his last couple of fights.

Big Ears

jimmyboy wrote: »

Oisin Fagan is a good fighter. Only been fighting for 5 years and was very unlucky in his last couple of fights.

Doesn't make him better than Brian Magee though does it .

I've seen plenty of Fagan , and although he can be a handful for better level fighters if he had real class he wouldn't of struggled(and many people that saw the whole thing thought he was lucky to win) against Chill John .

sligobhoy67

Big Ears wrote: »

Doesn't make him better than Brian Magee though does it .

I've seen plenty of Fagan , and although he can be a handful for better level fighters if he had real class he wouldn't of struggled(and many people that saw the whole thing thought he was lucky to win) against Chill John .

Fagan a little to high! maybe - I do like Oisin however.

What about the top five, would you switch any of those around?

Big Ears

sligobhoy67 wrote: »

Fagan a little to high! maybe - I do like Oisin however.

What about the top five, would you switch any of those around?

I'd move Lee down to 5 and all those above him would move up one to compensate . Lee is a fantastic prospect but p4p(I'm getting sick of this mythical thing to be honest) is about showing how good you are not having people presume how good you are/can be .

sligobhoy67

Big Ears wrote: »

I'd move Lee down to 5 and all those above him would move up one to compensate . Lee is a fantastic prospect but p4p(I'm getting sick of this mythical thing to be honest) is about showing how good you are not having people presume how good you are/can be .

chill, its just a bit of fun and gives us fans something to talk about

jimmyboy

Big Ears wrote: »

Doesn't make him better than Brian Magee though does it .

I've seen plenty of Fagan , and although he can be a handful for better level fighters if he had real class he wouldn't of struggled(and many people that saw the whole thing thought he was lucky to win) against Chill John .

Agree with what your saying, I just felt you were underating Fagan.
You say "many people that saw the whole thing thought he was lucky to win against Chill John", but have you seen any of his fights since then against Varnell or Kimbrough or even before it against Spadafora. If so you would really see his class.

Kess73

Just looking down through those lists. Since when has Calzaghe been the WBA champ? Anthony Mundine holds that belt and is defending it again at the end of this month against Nader Hamdan.

Methinks that website should check who has what belt.

sligobhoy67

jimmyboy wrote: »

Agree with what your saying, I just felt you were underating Fagan.
You say "many people that saw the whole thing thought he was lucky to win against Chill John", but have you seen any of his fights since then against Varnell or Kimbrough or even before it against Spadafora. If so you would really see his class.

I watched the video of the Kimbrough fight and Fagan was robbed -

sligobhoy67

Kess73 wrote: »

Just looking down through those lists. Since when has Calzaghe been the WBA champ? Anthony Mundine holds that belt and is defending it again at the end of this month against Nader Hamdan.

Methinks that website should check who has what belt.

Not exactly sure how this works but they are BOTH the WBA champions!!!! :eek:

one regular and one super!

Kess73

sligobhoy67 wrote: »

Not exactly sure how this works but they are BOTH the WBA champions!!!! :eek:

one regular and one super!

There is something similar with the WBC in the heavyweight division. Oleg Maskaev is the WBC belt holder and Samual Peters is the interim WBC champion.


For me Mundine is the WBA holder. This idea of one guy having the title and another guy being the interim holder is rubbish.


All it does is further muddy the waters and gives the sanctioning bodies even more freedom to print money, which is the name of the game for them. The super and regular thing just bugs me.

sligobhoy67

Kess73 wrote: »

There is something similar with the WBC in the heavyweight division. Oleg Maskaev is the WBC belt holder and Samual Peters is the interim WBC champion.


For me Mundine is the WBA holder. This idea of one guy having the title and another guy being the interim holder is rubbish.


All it does is further muddy the waters and gives the sanctioning bodies even more freedom to print money, which is the name of the game for them. The super and regular thing just bugs me.

Actually I dont think you are right.

From my understanding of it is - Mundine held the WBA until he lost to Mikkel Kessler in 2005, who held it until Kessler lost to Calzaghe. Mudine somehow seems to have been given another WBA in 2007 aswell after beating Sam Soliman. Going by that then I would recognise Calzaghe as the "true" title holder.

With regards the interim belt - my understand of that is that if the holder is yet to face a mandatory challenger and the time in which to do so is running out then an interim belt will be given to the mandatory challenger and if the real holder doesnt face him in time.

Clarification anyone?

Big Ears

Jesus guys haven't yee been around professional boxing long enough to know how bastardized it is .

Calzaghe is WBA Superchamp (ye :rolleyes:) while Mundine is the 'regular' champ .

The WBA brought this in when Hopkins beat Trinidad making himself WBA/WBC/IBF Middleweight champion , presumely they thought it was a good way to attract sanctioning fees . Williams Joppy fought Howard Eastman for the new 'regular' title now that Hopkins was Super Champ . Joppy won a narrow decision .

Since then they have enforced this in every division , anytime a WBA champion wins another belt(WBC/IBF/WBO) they become Super Champion and the 'regular' belt becomes vacant .

When Sven Ottke beat Byron Mitchell.....maybe that should be 'beat' but anyway beat Mitchell for the WBA Super-Middleweight title(and already having the IBF belt) he becomes Super Champion . Thus the regular belt became vacant . Mundine beat Antwun Echols for the belt .

Upon Ottke retiring Mundine remained 'regular' champion and there was now no longer a WBA Super Champion in the division . However it didn't stay this way for long as Mundine(now the only WBA champ at Super-Middleweight) lost his first defence since Ottke retired to Manny Siaca .

Siaca then lost to Kessler , who successfully defend several times(including beating Mundine in Australia) before beating Marcus Beyer for the WBC title and thus becoming the new Super Champion . This made the regular belt vacant and Mundine defeated Sam Soliman to become WBA 'regular champion'

Kessler defended his WBA SuperChampion title and his WBC title against Librado Andrade while Mundine beat a joke of an opponent in Paulo Nievas .

Joe Calzaghe then defeated Kessler to become WBA Super champion and WBC champion . Mundine defended his regular title against an even worse opponent Jose Clavero .

Mundine has a scheduled defence of his 'regular' title against Namder Hamdan , a better opponent than Mundine's last two defences but still a joke .

Joe Calzaghe as WBA 'Super Champion' is the real WBA Super Middleweight champion . Anthony Mundine is merely holding a title fabricated to get the WBA more money .

This is different from an interim title which is usually only brought about under exceptional curcumstances where the champino can't defend(eg injury) . Sometimes the WBC however likes to milk this , such as the Pongsaklek Wonjongkam-Jorge Arce affair where the WBC assisted Wonjongkam in avoiding Arce by making Arce fight for the interim title when he was mandatory and then never enforcing a fight against Wonjongkam(despite both making 6/7 defences of their titles without fight each other) .
The WBC probably enjoyed getting twice as many sanctioning fees to stop the situation .

Other cases of WBA regular champions currently are First Arslan(David Haye is Super Champ at Cruiserweight) . Hilariously the WBA actually had 3 champs at Cruiserweight for a while due to an interim champion also existing .

Jose Alfaro(Juan Diaz is Super Champion at Lightweight) .

A regular champion cannot unify against another organisations champion , if they could if would introduce the crazy situation of multiple 'Super Champs'

The 'Super Champ' has 18 months before he is mandated to defend against the 'regular champ' .

Who come up with this crazy idea ? Lennox Lewis , to prevent situations like where he(as undisputed , universally recognized champ etc) isn't put in the situation of having to be stripped for not defending against John Ruiz .


Yes it's stupid............but thisis boxing ?

sligobhoy67

My head hurts after that. Of course its all just for sancitioning fees - 2% of both fighters purse if I am not mistaken -yummy!

Yeah, I read that it was all Lennox's idea - well done Lennox - not.

Big Ears

sligobhoy67 wrote: »

My head hurts after that. Of course its all just for sancitioning fees - 2% of both fighters purse if I am not mistaken -yummy!

Yeah, I read that it was all Lennox's idea - well done Lennox - not.

You are mistaken , it's 3%.........even more reason for super fantastic extra shiny multiball titles .

sligobhoy67

Big Ears wrote: »

You are mistaken , it's 3%.........even more reason for super fantastic extra shiny multiball titles .

THREE PERCENT!! ffs - the robbin bassas! I wouldnt be bothered ever fightin for a belt if that was the case