What on earth have I been doing?

ems_12

Hi everyone,

Well the time has come, decision has been made that I have to resign from my job and find another. Huge amount of reasons but basically it's going nowhere, I am good at what I do and could do so much better in other places.

So once I resign (thanks to thanks to the helpful stickies in this forum), I have to get a new job. I've an idea of the companies I want (2 in particular), but.....

....I would like your help in interview technique - how do I approach the topic of "my last company weren't great, I had a sh1t position doing nothing, I've now wasted a year of work but I know I am good for the job" without being negative about my old company, negative about "menial" tasks, as I know I'll have to do these wherever I am (just not 24-7, I expect at least a little specialist responsibility). How do I big-up my technical ability, when in truth I've lost confidence in myself in the past year!

The fact I'm posting this shows I've lost confidence - last year I would have walzed into an interview, chatted with "the suits" like I knew them and easily talked about me :rolleyes: and my greatness!!

jenny-walsh

I tackled that problem once by saying I had no room to grow within the company, so my only option was to move to another company that provided greater opportunity to learn and grow.

I didn't dis the last people and buttered up the new people while telling them I wasn't shy of work

leeroybrown

My question would be why are you quitting one job before looking for another one? it's all fine and well saying that you had 'no room to grow' when you're still in a job but if you couldn't manage to work this out and search for a new job before you quit interviewers may begin to wonder.

I'd suggest resigning after you get your new job.

As for your confidence - take some time to properly review your CV and look over your abilities and experience. If you feel that there are weaknesses then spend some time on that area.

jenny-walsh

leeroybrown; very good advice, that's the situation I was in (duh for not mentioning that bit) It's easier to get a job if you're in one.

Beruthiel

leeroybrown wrote: »

My question would be why are you quitting one job before looking for another one? it's all fine and well saying that you had 'no room to grow' when you're still in a job but if you couldn't manage to work this out and search for a new job before you quit interviewers may begin to wonder.

Totally agree with that. I would never leave one job until I was sure I had another one.

Eoin

Beruthiel wrote: »

Totally agree with that. I would never leave one job until I was sure I had another one.

Absolutely. Unless the situation is completely unbearable, stick with it till you get sorted. It can take a while to find the right job, and you may find yourself compromising as the weeks go on without a job.

Don't dwell too much on the reasons for leaving the old job, emphasize on what's attracting you to the role you're interviewing for, rather than what's making you leave.

jenny-walsh

eoin_s wrote: »

Absolutely. Unless the situation is completely unbearable, stick with it till you get sorted. It can take a while to find the right job, and you may find yourself compromising as the weeks go on without a job.

Don't dwell too much on the reasons for leaving the old job, emphasize on what's attracting you to the role you're interviewing for, rather than what's making you leave.

Very true, but they are going to ask why you're leaving, and it's a very pivotal question



I was once asked how I would handle a confrontation...I said I'd stick my fingers in my ears and hum loudly....I later discovered I got the job purely because of that answer...pity they weren't all like that

ems_12

Hey guys thanks for advice so far.

Yep I'm planning on sticking with this job while finding another one - which leads me onto more questions - how can I get a reference when I haven't told the current employers I'm leaving (I'm a graduate so these are my only full time employers, rest of my CV have summer placements etc as referees).
Any imaginative excuses for days off when you're really going to an interview for another job!?

Eoin

jenny-walsh wrote: »

Very true, but they are going to ask why you're leaving, and it's a very pivotal question

Oh yeah, you need to have an answer prepared - and your one is perfect. I mean that you shouldn't dwell on the negative aspects much more than that.

jenny-walsh

eoin_s wrote: »

Oh yeah, you need to have an answer prepared - and your one is perfect. I mean that you shouldn't dwell on the negative aspects much more than that.

Oh god no, have a prepared answer and move on.

ems_12...that's a toughie...can any of your work placements tell a little white lie for ya?
WIll you ever use your current company for references?
COnsidering you have to mention them, firstly i'd say when you're being interviewed they have to understand you're not going to be asking your current Boss for a reference...
If the interviewers wonder why just say you respect your current employers and colleagues and didn't wish to cause any upset by advertising the fact that you're considering leaving...maybe?
I've never used references from current employers when going for new jobs, even on my second one...

Ginger

Ah the comedy answer.. i was once asked for a role would I bullsh1t them. I said were they going to pay me to?-- They said no.. so I said I wouldnt it.

Later I learned that is why i got the job, because the guy interviewing me didnt want someone he could walk over.

I can honestly say if i said that in another interview thet would have kicked me out...

Eoin

ems_12 wrote: »

Hey guys thanks for advice so far.

Yep I'm planning on sticking with this job while finding another one - which leads me onto more questions - how can I get a reference when I haven't told the current employers I'm leaving (I'm a graduate so these are my only full time employers, rest of my CV have summer placements etc as referees).
Any imaginative excuses for days off when you're really going to an interview for another job!?

Are you using your annual leave for a day off? If so, then don't offer any excuse at all, it's not their business. If it's short notice and all that, and they push you for a reason, then just mention some vague medical appointment. Anyone with any tact wouldn't push you on it.

Is there anyone discreet in work who could provide you with a reference? This can turn into a tricky Catch 22 situation. You don't want to ask for a reference until you've signed contracts with the new place, but they won't sign contracts until they get their reference etc.

ems_12

Wow guys you have no idea how much this is just helping me realise that I'm not doing something crazy, that ppl move jobs and that I've every right to move if not happy.
Yep ok doc app or annual leave day would explain my absence, only have one or two annual leaves left but should be grand
Think I'm gonna have to skip the reference and just hope that prospective employers understand the whole situation. then get one when I hand in my notice (eek!)
Thanks again!! (that doesn't mean stop with any advice if u wanna add more -I'm all ears!)

Ginger

Leaving your first job is always the hardest because you usually have some sort of loyalty because they gave you your first job sorta thing.

Everyone goes through it.

jenny-walsh

Ginger wrote: »

Ah the comedy answer.. i was once asked for a role would I bullsh1t them. I said were they going to pay me to?-- They said no.. so I said I wouldnt it.

Later I learned that is why i got the job, because the guy interviewing me didnt want someone he could walk over.

I can honestly say if i said that in another interview thet would have kicked me out...

Heh, can be quite amazing eh! One little thing can lose or win the interview!

jenny-walsh

ems_12 wrote: »

Wow guys you have no idea how much this is just helping me realise that I'm not doing something crazy, that ppl move jobs and that I've every right to move if not happy.
Yep ok doc app or annual leave day would explain my absence, only have one or two annual leaves left but should be grand
Think I'm gonna have to skip the reference and just hope that prospective employers understand the whole situation. then get one when I hand in my notice (eek!)
Thanks again!! (that doesn't mean stop with any advice if u wanna add more -I'm all ears!)

Hey listen, if you've done a good job for this company they can't give you a bad ref, if you've had no complaints, disciplinary etc you'll be fine.

Make sure you leave on good terms, hell, they're a company, they're used to people going!! you're not going to hurt their feelings!!

Chin Up

Eoin

jenny-walsh wrote: »

Hey listen, if you've done a good job for this company they can't give you a bad ref, if you've had no complaints, disciplinary etc you'll be fine.

No, but they can decide to just confirm your dates of employment. Some companies won't give a reference - good or bad - as a policy. This is why it's important to try and source someone in work, preferably at management level, who will unofficially give you a reference. This is what I did, so I was able to get everything sorted before even handing in my notice.

jenny-walsh

eoin_s wrote: »

No, but they can decide to just confirm your dates of employment. Some companies won't give a reference - good or bad - as a policy. This is why it's important to try and source someone in work, preferably at management level, who will unofficially give you a reference. This is what I did, so I was able to get everything sorted before even handing in my notice.

Most companies assume, if you have one of the above "standard" references, that there was nothing wrong with your work and attitude, they've seen it all before anyway
A reference often times just proves you did the job and 10/1 they'll call the company anyway to chat to someone in your department, that's happened me nearly every job. One place I know of chat's to the receptionists (cos they usually know everything that goes on)
Of course there's the exception to every rule, definately source someone who'd discreetly give you a decent reference.

ems_12

This is what you get for being helpful - I keep coming back with more questions!

So when I write my cover letter to a prospective company, should I include a bit at the end (along with "looking foward to hearing from you") that says how I have obviously not handed in my notice to current company, and I would appreciate their descretion and not to contact them? And say that once I have secured a new position they are welcome to persue any references? How on earth do I word that?

I'd be reluctant to not say anything at all in case someone just rings up the boss at current job asking about me in relation to new job! I haven't listed him on my references list.

Ginger

Just put references available on request on your CV... That way they have to ask for your references first.. that way you can decide who you would like to be your references based on your interview..

Now normal employers wont contact your current employer before they interview you and will ask you afterwards if its ok to contact your references so that you can tell your referees that someone may be ringing to ask about you (and you can pay them off in advance )

Eoin

Ginger wrote: »

Just put references available on request on your CV... That way they have to ask for your references first.. that way you can decide who you would like to be your references based on your interview..

Now normal employers wont contact your current employer before they interview you and will ask you afterwards if its ok to contact your references so that you can tell your referees that someone may be ringing to ask about you (and you can pay them off in advance )

^^ Exactly. There was another similar thread a few weeks ago where a company rang around before asking the candidate as they supposedly knew someone there. It's considered quite unprofessional to carry out any reference checks without the express permission of the candidate, and also not until an offer is on the table.