Focusrite Liquid Mix

James Hunt

Hi...just wondering if anyone here has experience of one of these little units. I was thinking of possibly investing in one. All the reviews I've seen on the net/magazines etc...are all positive, but you'd always be looking for other views as well.

Much obliged for any input.

PaulBrewer

Enda from Future Sounds, who's a member here, loaned me one when they came out.
I gave it a quick spin on my Mac Laptop with Logic 7.whatever it was, then.

While I didn't do any sessions with it I thought it was a smart box that sounded good (I was only using headphones at the time though) and worked easily with Logic.

However there were some latency issues with Pro-Tools that may well have been sorted by now. Within PT it didn't auto-compensate for plugins so you had to drag your audio some number of samples earlier in order for it to output 'in time'

Overall first impressions were good...... and I'm a horrid Snob.

James Hunt

Thanks Paul, that's fairly positive coming from a snob! I'd be running it in Pro Tools alright, so there may be may fiddling/time adjusting involved, although they're on V2.0 of the software now, which addressed latency to some degree. It only runs the RTAS though the wrapper as well, and I've never used a wrapper.....but most people seem to agree that it's fairly glitch free and sounds great. Feck it, I'm nearly sold.

PaulBrewer

Give Enda a bell, he's around here somewhere. If it's sorted great, if not it would make life very difficult.... less so as an insert but a right pain to use on an Aux......

unclebill98

Hi, I've used it. Works better as a post production tool in my exp anyhow's.

Are you looking for plug'ins or just the extra DSP power?

PaulBrewer

Hi Bill,
Why do you think it suits Post Pro better?

unclebill98

Hi Paul, welcome to the forum.

Well, unlike the Voicemaster Pro and other Foucusrite products that have a Zero Latancy headphone out, this issue alone impacts its use as a plug'in at the input stage. If your Mac/Pc is not a fast one these issue are made even more of a problem. That being my main fault with the unit.

There is nothing worse than the artist trying to explain that theres something funny with the headphone mix? You know its the latancey! They know its a pain and that there paying you for this.....!

In the flow of recording I liked it more in the post-pro stage. Theres not doubting its a very good unit and has tons of plug-ins for use in everyday situations. I only had it for a few recordings and would get one if/when the time comes.

I use the VM pro, its a savage unit and have gotten very good results with it. For me the Liquid Channel is where its at? If you can afford the bloody thing!

One reason some people buy the LM is for its out board DSP and taking the strain of you laptop recording setup. TC Electronic Powercore is a very good unit, does not come with as much plug'ins but I've heard good things about it. Universal Audio do the UAD expander. SSL do the Duende

They all work on the same idea, except that the LiquidMix has a hardware interface. So, are you paying for the quality of in RTAS plugs or the lump of plastic to hold? Really depends on you preferance in the DAW, are you a mouse or a keyboard kind person?

jtsuited

don#t use it with pro tools. or any other daw that doesn't have plugin delay compensation. an unbelievable bunch of plugins. and relatively speaking extremely cheap.

pity ptle doesn't have delay compensation.

PaulBrewer

unclebill98 ,
I thought you meant Post-Production as in Audio for Video.
Now I smell what you're stepping in, ok!

We had a Liquid chan and though it to be a bit of a Dawg to be honest. (Sorry Enda!) In my opinion it's trying to be all things to all men . I think perhaps the analogue side lets it down... All the other guys who tried weren't impressed either - It's a Great Idea,but...

We deal with TC and I've never heard a bad TC unit!

We're also represent SSL in Ireland. The Duende has been getting monster reviews and my customer feedback has been very positive. However I've heard of a few what I think are driver issues ... Jim Motley from SSL is over on the 28th for our soiree in Westland if you care to pop in? Details on another one of my posts.

Another good thing the Liquid mix has is Cheapness !

unclebill98

Ah, yes. I should have been more clearer.

Well, you get what you pay for when it some to audio. Anything that hampers the artist while recording is a big no no tbh.

I was using the Liquid Channel on a kick mic? We had some vintage pre on the vocals, can't remember its name, looked like a grill? Well thats what i said when i seen it, the owner was not impressed at all!

not really used SSL stuff before. Was looking at some outboard DSP for the laptop but, no need at the moment. I am on a 3 yr old Powerbook, still going strong!

TC, would be for me top quality build gear.

James Hunt

Belated thanks for all the input lads....

studiorat

Waves make a outboard dsp box that uses ethernet, could be worth looking at, it could be a little faster than the ssl or the focusrite. As for the Liquid channel, it's a pig, the latency really limits it's use.
Maybe we can arrange another auld shoot-out between the SSL and the Focusrite? Paul? Enda?

trackmixstudio

I have a liquid mix.
It sounds really good. Bear in mind it is called a liquidMIX.
32 channels each way through firewire causes latency. This is not the fault of the unit.
I use it in logic. Logic has full plugin delay compensation so it is not a problem, but profools le has no delay compensation so any tracks with a liquid mix inserted will play back late.
The way around this is to insert a liquid mix on every channel (32).
It is not designed for tracking with, but is very good for mixing use.
The SSL emulations are a bit too crunchy for my liking but overall it is very useful and seriously good VFM.
I personally prefer URS channel strip pro which is a native plugin and does pretty much the same job but sounds better to me.
Michael

PaulBrewer

studiorat wrote: »

Waves make a outboard dsp box that uses ethernet, could be worth looking at, it could be a little faster than the ssl or the focusrite. As for the Liquid channel, it's a pig, the latency really limits it's use.
Maybe we can arrange another auld shoot-out between the SSL and the Focusrite? Paul? Enda?

Hell Yea, at dawn ... in the Phoenix Park.... Have at thee, Cad!

unclebill98

trackmixstudio wrote: »

I have a liquid mix.
It sounds really good. Bear in mind it is called a liquidMIX.
32 channels each way through firewire causes latency. This is not the fault of the unit.
I use it in logic. Logic has full plugin delay compensation so it is not a problem, but profools le has no delay compensation so any tracks with a liquid mix inserted will play back late.
The way around this is to insert a liquid mix on every channel (32).
It is not designed for tracking with, but is very good for mixing use.
The SSL emulations are a bit too crunchy for my liking but overall it is very useful and seriously good VFM.
I personally prefer URS channel strip pro which is a native plugin and does pretty much the same job but sounds better to me.
Michael

Profools

Yep my thoughts are the same, better to by used in the mixing stage.

studiorat

Pro Tools HD has latency compensation, unfortunately the plug-in instances for SSL Denude and Liquid MIX are allocated as RTAS plug-ins and there lies the problem with latency. It is easy to manually compensate providing you know the correct delay for the unit.

Though lately I've been considering tracking and editing with Pro Tools and then using Logic to do a final mix down. If I could only keep track of the audio files in Logic as easily as in Pro Tools I'd be a happy man.

PaulBrewer

In Logic 8 the default setting is a Project.

So unless you set otherwise, all files are kept together, including your samples etc.... i.e. a copy is made of the samples used so a client can be sure he has all the 'bits' on the backups.

However there is some discussion on the quality of the mix engine in Logic in relation to PT that should be explored. I've not done an A/B myself.