Accenture Vs BOI Graduate Programme

gandhi24

Hey guys, Im new to this board and was wondering if ye could help me out. I have been offered the Accenture System Integration& Technology Consulting Graduate programme and the BOI group graduate development programme where you go on 3 different 6 month placements within different parts of the company.

Just to give you a little background about myself. Im 24 and did a degree in Marketing and went travelling for 2 years and I am currently doing a masters in Business Strategy.

From reading through the different threads on this forum I have noticed that Accenture does not have a great reputation in how it treats its employees. I have not much interest or training in IT previously however from talking to people Accenture seems like a good name on your CV to work for a couple of years and Consulting is also a profession which interests me.

I would eventually like to be involved with more marketing/strategy roles rather than IT and I was wondering if a couple of years experience working with Accenture would benefit me more than the BOI graduate programme in helping me to secure a management position in a Strategy/Marketing management role. If anyone has any feedback on what the BOI graduate programme is like, I would appreciate it. Sorry if this has been a bit long winded.

tmalmb

I worked with a number of Accenture folks for approx 2 years, they loved working with the company but they did note that the company drives you hard, expects a lot from you however they do provide incentives if you can meet their expectations. Lots of opportunity to travel and work on various customer sites.

With regard to what looks best on the CV, I guess that all depends on where you plan on plying your trade. Accenture are an internationally known company where BOI may not be instantly recognised

gandhi24

Cheers, i would not like to go down the IT or system integration path ideally. I was just wondering if having a couple of years experience as an IT consultant with Accenture would enable me to get a good job outside of IT maybe in strategy consulting or marketing? Or would i be better off doing the BOI graduate programme?

ixoy

The majority of Accenture's work is in IT. You're unlikely to be exposed to marketing/strategy consulting after two years in the graduate role.

gandhi24

If I dont have a long term plan to be working in IT would there be much transferrable skills to be obtained by maybe working for Accenture for 2 years or would my time be better spent doing The BOI graduate programm?

useless

If you want to get into strategy consulting, I would say Accenture is a better bet. As an analyst in Sys Integraton & Technology, you'll most likely (although not definitely) be working on large system implementations, doing requirements gathering, process designs, testing, etc. It's generally not that hard, but the hours can be long sometimes.
If you really want to do strategy, you can work hard, get good reviews, and let the hierarchy know that you'd prefer to work on strategy-related roles.
Don't kid yourself that strategy is glamourous- lots of Powerpoint presentations and Excel numbercrunching.

Accenture treats its people reasonably well. The money is decent, the people you work with are generally smart, there's a great social side of things because the average age in the place is so young. However you sometimes have to work hard- and long. Late nights and weekends are the order of the day for several weeks before most project go-lives. Having said that, strategy consulting (for McK, Bain, BCG etc) is far worse in terms of work-life balance.

Well done on getting the two offers, and best of luck to you whatever you decide to do.

justfortherecor

Agree with above, if you're looking to get into Management Consultancy, that role in Accenture may not be what you're expecting. Its more the implementation of ERP systems involved in that role rather than actually changing company strategy or anything like that.

To be honest, if you're not quite sure what you want to do yet, the BOI programme is probably your better option as it gives you a good idea of different business areas on the rotation programme. Capital Markets is far more interesting than ERP/IT strategy implementation and offers more career options after a few years. That is just my opinion though.

damnyanks

Consultancies get paid by the hour when they rent you out.

They pay you a fixed yearly salary

They work you more you earn them more money

Your cost remains the same. Unless you want to work in IT don't bother with accenture. BOI are going places

useless

damnyanks wrote: »

Consultancies get paid by the hour when they rent you out.

Utter nonsense. Most large consultancies (Accenture/BearingPoint/Deloitte etc) don't actually charge by the hour anymore. Pricing is usually on a project basis, with payments tied to meeting milestones and deadlines, often with risk/reward clauses, penalty clauses for late completion, etc. Clients aren't stupid you know- practically nobody is signing up for hourly rate+expenses consulting work anymore.

They pay you a fixed yearly salary

Salaries for analysts in consulting usually have an overtime component- Accenture definitely pays OT.

farva

useless wrote: »

Utter nonsense. Most large consultancies (Accenture/BearingPoint/Deloitte etc) don't actually charge by the hour anymore. Pricing is usually on a project basis, with payments tied to meeting milestones and deadlines, often with risk/reward clauses, penalty clauses for late completion, etc. Salaries for analysts in consulting usually have an overtime component- Accenture definitely pays OT.

Correct.

And I know that BearingPoint pay you an annual bonus Accenture dont.

OP, I'd say that you would be much better off in BOI, I've heard some terrible things about Accenture at grad level and about projects they've fcuked up. A mate of mine was looking into them as he's interested in management consulting and found that Accenture force you into IT and the limited exposure that you do get into management consulting you have to follow a strict process, with no room for your own innovation.

What baffles me is that Accenture have a terrible rep for treating their grads pretty badly and making a balls of big projects. Why do people think that "Accenture would look good on a CV"????

ixoy

farva wrote: »

What baffles me is that Accenture have a terrible rep for treating their grads pretty badly and making a balls of big projects. Why do people think that "Accenture would look good on a CV"????

Because it does? I know from a few people in recruitment that Accenture will guarantee a very favourable reply because they're known to be hard working.
As to making "a balls of big projects", I'm not quite sure which you're referring to, bust most of the Irish ones have worked out well enough.

useless

I'm genuinely interested and a bit puzzled as to what people consider 'treating grads badly'.

OK, the major IT consulting firms all make their grads (and their experienced people- it doesnt get easier!) work hard, sometimes 60+ hours a week are required to get projects over the line. In my experience this usually doesnt last longer than 8 weeks or so. You might do this twice in a year if you're really unlucky.
On the plus side, all these companies have very structured career progression, you get to change projects or your role on a long term project every 6 months or so, and you're paid well. Yes, investment banking pays (a lot) more, but the tradeoff is a complete absence of work-life balance.

Where's the bad treatment in that? Im not standing up for any or all consultancies, but would genuinely like to know where this poor reputation comes from.

I also would like to know which projects Accenture have 'made a balls of' in Ireland....

Finally- to get this thread back on track- @OP: If you think that marketing/strategy is what you want to do in the longer term, have you applied for graduate marketing positions with FT100 or major Irish organisations, and/or the true strategy houses eg McKinsey, Bain, BCG?
Would these not be more suited to your goals than either Accenture or BOI?

If you HAVE to take one of these 2 jobs, then I suggest you call up both BOI and Accenture and ask to go back in & meet people there & talk about the jobs on offer- you 'interview' the company, if you like. That would give you better information to base your decision on that comments from random people on a message board!

farva

I just heard that accenture work their grads very hard and have no room for innovation - its suposed to be quite regimented. I heard all this of a good mate of mine considering applying to them for a grad position. This is from his research into working from them, I could be misinformed but I'm just letting people know what I've heard.

When I said that Accenture have made a balls of some big IT projects here, I admit that I cant give specific examples, but I've heard that many times off someone very senior in a rival consulting firm who has been working in the industry for 20+ years. And before anyone says its just because he is in a rival firm, I have never heard of any other company (BearingPoint, McKinsey, Cap Gemeni, Deloitte...) having such a bad repuatation.

From what I've heard about Accenture I wouldnt work for them, if I was interested in that indusry.

newestUser

Accenture implemented the PULSE system used by the guards, which at the time of it's introduction apparently was a dog of a system, which made operational procedures even slower than before.

Or so the grapevine says, anyway.

justfortherecor

I heard from a very reliable source as well that they made an absolute fcuk up of an outsourcing procedure for a major Irish organisation, causing much delay and frustration for the client. I of course will not name the organisation for legal reasons but my source was working with the client org at the time.

As for the grad programme, to be honest it seems OK. They take you away for 4 weeks when you first start to Chicago and London and I've heard this is great for forming a good relationship with all the other starters. The work may be a bit tedious at times and they can work grads pretty hard but as an above poster said, there does seem to be a recognised path for promotion etc. Just dont expect to get to an extremely high level in a company of 170,000 employees.

They do offer strategic consulting for grads in London as well, with the added incentive of a £10,000 bonus when you sign, but I think there is no strategic positions available for grads in Ireland, but I could be wrong on that.

jballantine

Surely MCIM in Accenture Ireland would be better. It wont be as techy as systems and integration. But as accenture is known for technology, you will always be in some form or another working with computers etc.. Do there is room for managing and running project teams , and supply chain optimisiation etc.

In regards to the Accenture ****ing things up, thats a bit harsh, yeah deloitte Ireland I would agree with. There the laugh stock. The amount of projections they have screwed up is beyond believe.

At least the Revenue Online system is up there with the best.

jballantine

oh yeah you get overtime in accenture as a grad so thats a plus.

useless

justfortherecor wrote: »

They do offer strategic consulting for grads in London as well, with the added incentive of a £10,000 bonus when you sign, but I think there is no strategic positions available for grads in Ireland, but I could be wrong on that.

Theres a mix of right and wrong in what you wrote there.

When you apply for the grad programme in Accenture in Ireland, you can indicate on the application and/or the interview that you want to work in Management Consulting (MCIM in Accenture-speak) rather than Systems Integration & Technology. Strategy is a sub-division of MCIM. You would work as a 'general' MCIM person for a couple of years before choosing which sub-division you want to belong to (in MCIM, there's Strategy, Financial & Performance Management, Human Performance). Nobody at grad level in either London or Dublin is recruited into 'Strategy' anymore since Accenture changed the way the organisation is structured last year.

There is a 10k Stg bonus is paid over two years in the UK. Different grad recruitment market there where Accenture is competing with all the investment banks for the same types of grad. The catch is that you've to stay for 2 years or pay the money back:-)

irlrobins

jballantine wrote: »

In regards to the Accenture ****ing things up, thats a bit harsh, yeah deloitte Ireland I would agree with. There the laugh stock. The amount of projections they have screwed up is beyond believe.

Got a source for this?

farva

jballantine wrote: »

deloitte Ireland I would agree with. There the laugh stock. The amount of projections they have screwed up is beyond believe.

I have heard that too, but as this thread wasnt about Deloitte I never mentioned it. I think that its quite well known in industry circles.

irlrobins

Based on PPARS no doubt.

Onikage

Accenture pay an annual bonus to services & consulting, just not to solutions. Plenty of overtime and free nights out though.

ixoy

Onikage wrote: »

Accenture pay an annual bonus to services & consulting, just not to solutions. Plenty of overtime and free nights out though.

They most certainly don't pay an annual bonus to services. Bonuses are for exceptional performance only, based on review.

stepbar

BOI give up to 6% of your salary in shares (depends on your / overall group performance in the year). However you must hold on to the shares for 3 years. Of course you can take the cash instead of the shares but expect to get taxed for same. On top of that you can get up to 8% in a pay increase each year (how in ever you would have to do something special to get 8%).

DublinWriter

jballantine wrote: »

In regards to the Accenture ****ing things up, thats a bit harsh

Oh really? A *bit* harsh? You'd consider the €150 million paid to Accenture for PULSE to be money well spent, considering Accenture kept the intellectual rights and then went and sold it onto the South African police?

Remember where you heard it first folks, there's another government IT scandal chugging it's way down the line to us in the next few months - Project REACH.

This is going to put P-PARS in the ha'penny place. Unlike P-PARS, which had a merry go round of consultancy companies involved starting with Bull, REACH was a purely Accenture puppy.

My own estimations place circa €1 billion of tax-payers money being payed to Accenture for the past six years for this project. It was taken over by the Department of Finance last April and 'unofficially' shelved.

When this story eventually breaks in the next eight weeks, it will go down in history as one of the biggest scandals in the history of the Irish State.

skelliser

im intrigued, tell me more!!

although that reach thing seems to be working, www.reachservices.ie

useless

DublinWriter wrote: »

This is going to put P-PARS in the ha'penny place. Unlike P-PARS, which had a merry go round of consultancy companies involved starting with Bull, REACH was a purely Accenture puppy.

I think you'll find it was BearingPoint, not Accenture, who did the implementation of REACH.
http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/summary_0199-246644_ITM

Not that every single Accenture project is a success, mind;)
http://www.breakingnews.ie/business/mhgbkfojmhsn/rss2/

jballantine

Yeah the Sainsbury's one would also spring to mind as another screw up, but in fairness Accenture Ireland seem to actually deliver what they say.

I see DublinWriter is getting his facts wrong, typical journalist I suppose, anyway whats the crack with this REACH thing, I would love to hear the story about this. Any one working for the Department of Finance or Bearpoint care to enlighten us?

ixoy

DublinWriter wrote: »

Remember where you heard it first folks, there's another government IT scandal chugging it's way down the line to us in the next few months - Project REACH.

This is going to put P-PARS in the ha'penny place. Unlike P-PARS, which had a merry go round of consultancy companies involved starting with Bull, REACH was a purely Accenture puppy.

No it wasn't. Bearing Point implemented REACH. Some Accenture projects interface through REACH but it's not an Accenture project. So it's not another Accenture screwup.

skelliser

all i can see that reachservices does is allow you to download various
departments forms! its www.reach.ie that gets the alarm bells ringing, it talks about it in the past tense, it was this and that etc and then says it was taken over by the dep. of finance, does that mean it was binned?

seems to me that reachservices.ie is the poor mans reach.
i.e. they couldnt implement the whole thing so they thru up something to make it look like it does something and then binned the rest

farva

DublinWriter wrote: »

Oh really?Remember where you heard it first folks, there's another government IT scandal chugging it's way down the line to us in the next few months - Project REACH.

This is going to put P-PARS in the ha'penny place. Unlike P-PARS, which had a merry go round of consultancy companies involved starting with Bull, REACH was a purely Accenture puppy.

My own estimations place circa €1 billion of tax-payers money being payed to Accenture for the past six years for this project. It was taken over by the Department of Finance last April and 'unofficially' shelved.

When this story eventually breaks in the next eight weeks, it will go down in history as one of the biggest scandals in the history of the Irish State.

Reach was/is a BearingPoint project and was a success on BearingPoint's part. They delivered exactly what they were contracted to do and what was asked of them. The problem with reach is that each individual government department was supposed to incorporate their website into reach just as the UK have, but the departments were never told about it and ended up making their own websites making reachserveices essentially redundant. It was a big time Government fcuk up and not a BearingPoit one!!