first build, Powers on, fans spin, powers off, fans spin etc. no BEEPS, no video

aidancoughlan

Hi all,
this is my first ever PC build, so I am feeling my way a bit.

I'm building with a
Gigabyte GA-G33M-DS2R mAtx motherboard http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=335584,

2GB Crucial DDR2 800 PC6400 1.8v RAM http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=324016

E6750 CPU http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=338082

HD 2600 XT http://www.komplett.ie/k/ki.aspx?sku=338929

I've installed the mobo in the case, installed the 2GB memory, and CPU & heatsink and fan., and graphics card.

I've connected:
- the CPU fan, and 2 case fans
- the front panel power switch connectors,
- front panel audio, usb etc,
- 2 hard drives (power & sata)

I've followed the mobo & power supply instructions as closely as I can - and re-checked.

When I power on, it powers up, I see lights on the front, the CPU fan whirs and the case fans run, the DVD drive spins and lights - no video, no Beeps at all then it powers off after a second or three; but repowers again several seconds later - and repeats the same cycle. Sometimes it stays powered on with fans running- maybe the second or third time in the cycle, but still no beeps or video.

Any ideas? From searching for similar problems , Ive tried
- removing the CMOS battery & reinserting/trying again (as per some posts here)
- removing one of the 1GB memory chips
- removing the graphics card & relying on on-board video to display the startup on the screen.
- I checked the VGA display with my laptop - its ok.
- disconnecting the DVD drive - still same (without the dvd drive whirring)

I've not tried disconnecting the SATA hard drives yet, will do 2moro.
I'd appreciate any other suggestions to try though....

PogMoThoin

Are you sure you've got the cpu cooler fan attached to mobo, not psu. You need the case speaker connected also to get beeps.

TerrorFirmer

Make sure that the 24 pin is in correctly and fully inserted, and that both 4 pins are connected as well - even if they look like they are, double check them. With my new build, the 24 pin wasn't in fully, even though it looked like it was, and I kept getting random lock ups and occasionally, machine not booting apart from periodic power to the case fans. It was the very last thing I checked and turned out to be the problem.

RoyalMarine

un plug everything.

take off the fan on the cpu.
re-seat it.

plug in the cables from the power supply to the motherboard.
put in 1 stick of ram.
put in the graphics card.

leave the hard drive disconnected and same with the dvd drive.
if it stays on for say 2 mins, turn it off. then plug in the harddrive.
turn it on. if it stays on for 2 mins, turn it off.

go step by step. what ever makes it not run properly is likely the cause.
it could also be a power issue.

what power supply do you have?

aidancoughlan

Hi all, thanks for the replies. I'm just back from the pub, so I'd better not go at it now... :-)
I've checked the CPU fan - it's connected to the mobo ok (not power supply).
I *think* the 24-pin power supply is connected to the mobo properly - although I will double-check in the morning.
Failing that , I will remove the items one by one to try and isolate it - allthough the only components connected to power when I left it last night are the mobo/cpu/memory and hard drives.

Someone suggested in work today that it sounded like a short circuit. Apparently I should have put rubber washers between the motherboards and the screws that connect it to the motherboard tray - to prevent a short circuit. Theory is that the power supply is detecting the short circuit and cutting out - then repeating again. Apparently its only 5-volt and it wont have fried the motherboard. I dont recall any rubber washer or mention of them in the instructions... .Ill check again in the morning when I'm more qualified to peek at it !

TouchingVirus

aidancoughlan wrote: »

Hi all, thanks for the replies. I'm just back from the pub, so I'd better not go at it now... :-)
I've checked the CPU fan - it's connected to the mobo ok (not power supply).
I *think* the 24-pin power supply is connected to the mobo properly - although I will double-check in the morning.
Failing that , I will remove the items one by one to try and isolate it - allthough the only components connected to power when I left it last night are the mobo/cpu/memory and hard drives.

Someone suggested in work today that it sounded like a short circuit. Apparently I should have put rubber washers between the motherboards and the screws that connect it to the motherboard tray - to prevent a short circuit. Theory is that the power supply is detecting the short circuit and cutting out - then repeating again. Apparently its only 5-volt and it wont have fried the motherboard. I dont recall any rubber washer or mention of them in the instructions... .Ill check again in the morning when I'm more qualified to peek at it !

Sounds like crap to me - mounting holes on the motherboard are isolated just for this scenario. My first ever build I didn't bother using spacers and mounted the motherboard right onto the case, let me tell you it didn't just short :D

Re-Seat your heatsink/fan and only use 1 stick of memory and your gfx card - use the motherboard manual to put in the speaker wires onto the motherboard headers so you can hear any beeps

Solitaire

Or try it without your graphics card...

I don't see any specs for the PSU, if you tried to take a shortcut here and got an old or cheap model it might be the problem, either bust or one of the rails (usually the composite 12v in modern systems) isn't kicking out enough juice for the system. If it is the 12v then leaving the graphics card out and booting with just the onboard VGA might work

Of course it does sound a wee bit like you could have a DOA mobo if the machine isn't even beeping at the POST... good luck trying to get an RMA from GigaByte!

Anti

Sounds like a farked psu to me. Or possibly ram.

TouchingVirus

Solitaire wrote: »

Or try it without your graphics card...

I don't see any specs for the PSU, if you tried to take a shortcut here and got an old or cheap model it might be the problem, either bust or one of the rails (usually the composite 12v in modern systems) isn't kicking out enough juice for the system. If it is the 12v then leaving the graphics card out and booting with just the onboard VGA might work

Of course it does sound a wee bit like you could have a DOA mobo if the machine isn't even beeping at the POST... good luck trying to get an RMA from GigaByte!

If your motherboard is DOA don't send it back to the manufacturer, send it back to where you got it from and get a replacement/refund. Let them deal with the manufacturer

As a suggestion you could also try without RAM and GFX card, the machine should certainly emit some POST beeps without the ram in it

aidancoughlan

Sounds like crap to me - mounting holes on the motherboard are isolated just for this scenario

I'm begging to agree... the mobo manual doesnt mention any rubber washers etc., and although I did find some references to isolating the motherboards mounts on the web, it seemed to be on sites taling about older (eg. AT) motherboards..... I'll try reseating the heatsink as you suggest (actually, I had some diffculty figuring out how the stock heatsink "push-pins" worked - and had great reluctance to push them in totally because of the force required. It was 'loose' initiallially, and rocking around slightly - maybe I've upset the pre-applied Intel thermal paste?).
The speaker wires I connected with care using the manual reference, so I think theyre ok.

I don't see any specs for the PSU

It seems like a fairly good one (and brand new), read several reviews before buying eg.http://www.hothardware.com/articles/Corsair_VX450W_450W_Power_Supply/

As a suggestion you could also try without RAM and GFX card, the machine should certainly emit some POST beeps without the ram in it

I'll try this, go back to basic configuration mobo/cpu - see if I get beeps and move on from there. If not, I guess it back to www.Komplett.ie. After my disastrous experience with dabs (other post), and good follow-up from komplett.ie, nows my chance to see how they react to returns !!

thanks for all the replies...

requiem1

plug in a fan to the psu and jump the psu using a paper clip, there's guides online to show you how to jump the psu (i think its between the green and black wires) but it definitely sounds like something is shorting it. One time a screw from the cpu cooler fell off and got caught between the mother board and tray. Had the exact same thing as you

aidancoughlan

Hi all, many thanks for the replies so far....

plug in a fan to the psu and jump the psu using a paper clip

Thanks for that tip, I've just tried that by following http://www.overclock.net/faqs/96712-how-jump-start-power-supply-psu.html - it worked just fine, I had the PSU powering two 120mm fans using the paper clip "jump start" without any problems.


I've taken the mobo out of the case onto the anti-static sheet (in case it was shorting against something - theres no visible damage, the screws werent shorting anything, and it seems designed that the mounting screw holes are isolated from the circuits - I dont think it was shorting externally at least), and disconnected everything, except :
(1) cpu/heatsink (untouched from original install) and 1GB memory card in slot 1. CPU heatsink fan power supply is connceted to motherboard on the only slot for this purpose - and can only be connected one way, so it seems correctly connected.
(2) connected the large 24-pin "ATX" power connector to the mobo and make sure it is seated correctly - theres only one way to connect it, so its right way round.
(3) connected the smaller 4-pin "ATX_12v" connector to the other power location on the motherboard - again, theres only one way to do it and its seated fine.
(4) connected the Front panel "power switch", "HDD led", "Speaker connector"
wires from the case onto the motherboard - taking care to put them on the correct pins (ie. correct +/- wire locations) using mobo manual + case manual.
(5) connected VGA monitor (known to be working)


So, basic mobo,cpu+fan,1gb: When I power on, I get the same behaviour - led lights, fans spins (after a second or two), then shuts down and lights out. Then repeats. After a couple of cycles (sometimes 3-4 cycles), it seems to stabilise - fan stays whirring - but never any sound or video on screen.

***CLUE??***: When I **remove** the ATX_12v (the small 4-pin power to the motherboard), and power on - the CPU fan whirs and keeps whirring first time, and power stays on. In contrast, when I put it back and power on, the previous cycle repeats again. What should this tell me ? The motherboard manual suggests that

"the 12v power connector mainly supplies power to the CPU. If the 12v power connector is not connected, the computer will not start".

It doesnt elaborate on whether beeps will sound, or the POST stuff will come up on the screen.
My PSU manual says (in reference to the 12v power),

"The vX450W has an 8-pin +12v;also known as "EPS12V" cable. If your motherboard has an 8-pin +12v socket, connect the 8-pin cable directly to your motherboard. If your mobo has a 4-pin socket, detach the 4-pin from the 8-pin cable, then plug the correct 4-pin directly to your motherboard..."

I dont understand the reference to the *correct* 4-pin - both 4-pin plugs emerge from the one cable (4 wires each), and they look identical - there are no markings distinguishing them, and there is no separate 4-pin cable. I've tried both - one results in the lights and fan staying on first time (still no sound or video), and the other results in the repating on/off cycle. (also no sound or video).

I wonder if its something to do with the CPU - when I installed it the heatsink did my nut in (the "push pins" were fiddly to install), and I wonder if the cpu made a good enough connection with the heatsink ? If not, could this be the answer ? Is the CPU required in order to drive the POST video etc. ? If it were not connected correctly to the heatsink, could it result in this behaviour ? I'll try removing it and re-installing it if theres any suggestion that could be the fault, but I dont want to do it unnecessarily since it'll mean going to get some thermal paste to re-install. (it comes pre-installed with some thermal kind of dry thermal stuff on the heatsink)

Any ideas? Should I just send back the mobo, or is there anything else I should try ?

yoyo

Yes, The CPU would be required to POST, In order to check if the intel heatsink is mounted correctly you can try moving each black pin push thing, if one seems loose, the fan isnt installed correctly, if you want to double check you can also turn over the mobo, locate the CPU spot and ensure four black pins are coming in between the clear plastic locking mechanism, if theres one black thing not out, try pushing hard down on the corresponding pin and ensure it locks into position,

Nick

aidancoughlan

locate the CPU spot and ensure four black pins are coming in between the clear plastic locking mechanism

Hi nick, thanks for that... I've checked underneath, and I can see the pins showing under the motherboard - each has a black tip appearing between the white plastic pin ends. However, when I checked it earlier this evening, one of them wasnt properly seated. I guess this could mean that the connection between the cpu and heatsink might not have been 100%. If that was the case, do you think it would have fried the CPU & caused the behaviour I am seeing - it would have to have happened pretty quickly on first power-up though - the power on/off cycle happened within seconds.

BTW, have a look at
http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=1160&pageID=3885
I've connected the 24-pin power connector to the motherboard - its fairly unambiguous where it goes and how it connects.
However, my version of the vx450W does not have *both* the 4-pin and 8-pin CPU power cables as shown on that page though - it has one cable, from which emerges 2 * 4-pin CPU power plugs. Apart from the 24-pin, the motherboard has only one other power connector which is 4-pin - I've tried each of the two 4-pins in turn, and get slightly different behaviour from them as described earlier - though no sound (beeps) or VGA from either.

RoyalMarine

the cpu wouldnt "fry" like that. it wouldnt have even got warm in the 2 seconds it was on for. plus they can go to pretty high temps before they get damaged.
any chance you have a m8 that has a new computer that you could test this board on? and test the power supply aswel.

TouchingVirus

aidancoughlan wrote: »

Hi nick, thanks for that... I've checked underneath, and I can see the pins showing under the motherboard - each has a black tip appearing between the white plastic pin ends. However, when I checked it earlier this evening, one of them wasnt properly seated. I guess this could mean that the connection between the cpu and heatsink might not have been 100%. If that was the case, do you think it would have fried the CPU & caused the behaviour I am seeing - it would have to have happened pretty quickly on first power-up though - the power on/off cycle happened within seconds.

BTW, have a look at
http://www.bjorn3d.com/read.php?cID=1160&pageID=3885
I've connected the 24-pin power connector to the motherboard - its fairly unambiguous where it goes and how it connects.
However, my version of the vx450W does not have *both* the 4-pin and 8-pin CPU power cables as shown on that page though - it has one cable, from which emerges 2 * 4-pin CPU power plugs. Apart from the 24-pin, the motherboard has only one other power connector which is 4-pin - I've tried each of the two 4-pins in turn, and get slightly different behaviour from them as described earlier - though no sound (beeps) or VGA from either.

Take out the memory - for ****s and giggles

Try another PSU (perhaps a friends PC)

Try removing the GFX card.

If this fails try finding somebody else who knows their hardware stuff and see if they can lend a hand.

If you can't, then get onto komplett and tell them what's up.


To me it sounds like a dodgy motherboard though

aidancoughlan

the cpu wouldnt "fry" like that. it wouldnt have even got warm in the 2 seconds it was on for.

Yeah, I didn't think so either - I dont have much of a clue really, but it went into the power off/repeat cycles within seconds, so it doesnt seem likely its "fried".
On original install, I tried to insert the CPU into the socket without removing the plastic covering on the back (i know, i know), and maybe this damaged something in the socket, not allowing the CPU to work right...?

Take out the memory - for ****s and giggles

I've tried pretty much everything else suggested (removed 1 of the memory cards), I'll try removing both memory cards and see what happens.


The only other items I can find to try are:
(1) **BIOS version** might not support the CPU. The ga-g33m-ds2r started with bios version f2, but requires F3 to support the E6750. I've found some conflicting views on this here
GA-G33-DS2R needs F3 BIOS to support E6750
http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Support/Motherboard/CPUSupport_Model.aspx?ClassValue=Motherboard&ProductID=2534&ProductName=GA-G33M-DS2R

Out of the box your board propably has F2 bios and you need F4a at least for this (new) CPU to work I think.
Pasted from <http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1191867&page=32&gt;

Right now, i'm using an e6850 with the bios F2!
Your issue has nothing to do with bios F2 but probably with your PSU!
Pasted from <http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1191867&page=32&gt;

The biggest problem with 1333fsb is the cpu itself. Some boards with an older bios won't recognize the 1333 fsb cpu and won't post. They need to be booted with an older 800 or 1066 cpu to flash to a newer 1333 compatible bios
Pasted from <http://forums.pcper.com/showthread.php?p=4141399&gt;

The first release bios F2 works for all c2d fsb1333!!
Right now, i'm using an e6850 with the bios F2!
Your issue has nothing to do with bios F2 but probably with your PSU!
Pasted from <http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1191867&page=33&gt;

Maybe I can try my old PIII in the 775 socket - and boot from that, then upgrade the bios? I'm not sure if a PIII will fit the same socket, will check that out now... [Edit:/no it wont, the PIII is socket 370]

(2) The PC components were left in my car overnight for 1-2 nights over the christmas cold spell - maybe the CMOS batttery has drained - could that cause this behaviour I wonder ? I'll get a new one today in PCWorld and try it again later.... hopefully this could be a quick answer...

thanks for all the input...

jimmyjim11

might b dodgy power switch causing problem ??

aidancoughlan

might b dodgy power switch causing problem ??

I don't think so.. I've tried testing the PSU by powering the 120mm fans quite separately to the motherboard, as suggested earlier in the thread by requiem1 - it works fine, powering the fans no problem.
Also, when I connect the 24-pin power cable to the mobo and **dont** connect the 4-pin additional power cable to the other socket on the mobo, the PSU powers the fans just fine - no power-down & up cycles (although still no beeps/sound or video).

I'm no expert, but by process of elimination, I suspect it's either the motherboard, CPU, or memory is faulty - or an incompatability of the combination I've chosen.

This evening, I'm going to try
(a) replacing the CMOS battery with a new one (just bought it at Halfords - PC world dont sell them for some reason) - I've seen this recommended in some posts, and mine was subjected to a cold overnighter in the car.
(b) swapping the remaining 1GB with the other one in case its faulty
(c) removing the memory altogether

As soon as I can get thermal paste, I'll try...
(d) removing the CPU & heatsink, and re-seating them - though this will involve thermal paste which I havnt used before (and which PC world dont supply either !).


If all above fails, I'll try upgrading the BIOS on the motherboard to ensure it's compatible with the E6750 CPU - I asked in PCWorld, and they said they could get their technician to do this for me : AFAIK, this means putting in a supported CPU first (which I dont have) to get far enough to do the upgrade. They will also have spare memory hanging around to try out as well. I know a few mates who have built PCs years ago, but none that have bits hanging around that are recent enough that I could use to substitute/test the system.

Thanks for all the help, I'll keep you posted on how I get on.

ps. Does anybody know about the 24-pin and 4-pin power connectors - why are there two separate connectors on the mobo, are they both supposed to be connected? I read somewhere that the 4-pin connector was for P4 systems - does this mean P4 and above ? Also, my PSU has a cable with two 4-pin power connectors coming out of it - but only one 4-pin socket on the mobo (and no indicating on which 4-pin to use - they are identical), which seems strange to me. The fact that the behaviour is different depending on which of the two 4-pins I connect to the mobo puzzles me - one does the power on/off/on cycle, and the other doesnt. But either way, no beeps or video.