N81 Grade seperate the Tallaght Bypass - can it be done????

tom1ie

Ok as the title suggests i'm wondering if the n81, say from the tallaght side of templeouge or even the m50 junction,can be grade seperated all the way to the saggart turn off? something like the job that was done on the n7. Is this wishfull thinking? It would kill off most of the traffic problems in tallaght i reckon.:cool:

Aard

I know of a Tallaght Bypass Extention that is either currently in planning stages, or actually being built, I'm not sure. It will bypass Saggart and link with the N7. I'm not sure of plans to upgrade the current bypass however.

If I were to re-vamp the road system out that direction, I'd leave things as they are in and around Tallaght Village, and instead make a bypass from the current M50/N81 interchange going south-west through Dodder Valley Park parallel to Bohernabreena Road, then turning west under Jobstown, before linking up with the current N81 at Blessington Road. In the map below, the big black circles are Grade-Seperated interchanges.

tom1ie

nice map i have to say. yeah this would probably be the best thing to do but i dont know about putting a junction at ballycragh what with all the traffic coming off the m50 at firhouse and using the link road in and around that area.

Victor

Aard, at Oldbawn your route is in the flood plain of the Dodder. Then you go through a load of houses in Kiltipper and Ellensborough and then cross some rather steep and narrow valleys.

Aard

Ok my route mapping skillz are somewhat lacking so!


I'm not sure the current Tallaght Bypass could be grade seperated - there are a lot of housing estates on the route, not to mention the proximity of the Oldbawn Rd to the Belgard Rd, which iirc are both part of the R113 and would need to have junctions. It's a tricky one all right.

tom1ie

yeah looks like it cant be done- or can it...................................:eek:

L1011

Aard wrote: »

Ok my route mapping skillz are somewhat lacking so!


I'm not sure the current Tallaght Bypass could be grade seperated - there are a lot of housing estates on the route, not to mention the proximity of the Oldbawn Rd to the Belgard Rd, which iirc are both part of the R113 and would need to have junctions. It's a tricky one all right.

Some "creative" destruction of the public park would solve that

I wonder how feasible it would be to remove the margin in the middle, Jersey Barrier it, keep the existing number of lanes and install frontage roads along either side to reduce the number of junctions needed? Google Maps suggests very little space along either side but quite a wide margin, and there are turning lanes that would/could become unneeded...

D'Peoples Voice

tom1ie wrote: »

Ok as the title suggests i'm wondering if the n81, say from the tallaght side of templeouge or even the m50 junction,can be grade seperated all the way to the saggart turn off? something like the job that was done on the n7. Is this wishfull thinking? It would kill off most of the traffic problems in tallaght i reckon.:cool:

Yeah I must admit I thought SDCC were going to re-engineer the outer link road (Phase 3) so that cheeverstown road junction with the N81 would meet the Killarden road junction and they would put in a flyover at that point.
http://roads.southdublin.ie/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=189&Itemid=246
But no, it looks like they believe that AT-grade separation is the best way to do it.

AlekSmart

Yea d`PV..Its kinda sad but hardly surprising how these things pan out

I Think Most of the non-administrative minded people posting here would recognize that this Traffic Signalled,AT-Grade business is reverting yet again to form on SDCC`s part.

As sure as night follows day,this project will HAVE to be revisited and probably sooner rather than later.
Short sighted decision making still holds sway within a large swathe of Irish Public Administration and the current Roads & Traffic situation in the "Greater" Tallaght Area illustrates that only too graphically !! :mad:

Victor

The ORR is meant for traffic within Lucan-Clondalkin-Tallaght, not long distance traffic. It will be 50km/h.

D'Peoples Voice

Victor wrote: »

The ORR is meant for traffic within Lucan-Clondalkin-Tallaght, not long distance traffic. It will be 50km/h.

Victor, i take your point but we are not looking for motorway standard hee,
just less delays.

After the M50, on the N81, we have a roundabout only to be followed by a junciton caused by a left turning road. Why wasn't this road reconfigured to join the roundabout, instead of having a separate junction?

The new junciton where H. Williams used to be - the less said about that, the better!

Take the Old bawn - Tallaght village junction, now clearly there are fewer cars going into tallaght village than there was 20 years ago(given the new road opening at the former H.Williams site mentioned above), yet they have never reconfigured the old bawn road to share a junction with the Belgard road on the N81, thus we now have three junctions in short proximity.

Further up, we have the junction at Woodies, no specific complaints with that junction, only that another 100-200 meters up further we have another set of traffic lights at what used to be Nestle, to allow traffic out from what used to be the old Blessington road in the 1970s. This junction should be closed or a simple underpass created like the one at Goffs on the N7 to allow buses out onto the N81.

Another short distance on we have the killnarden junction followed in quick succession by the Cheverstown road junction, this should all be the one junction - regardless of the type of traffic using the Cheverstown Road, Victor.

Following on from that, we have a second killnarden junction on the left before the Jobstown house, followed in very quick succession by the Jobstown road junction to the right. These should be the one junction.

Likewise with the Citywest, Saggart and Blessington junctions.
They are creating traffic not managing it!!!!

spacetweek

tom1ie, thanks for the bypass idea, but I think it would be too destructive of the Dodder Valley. In any case, if Metro West is extended into town, it may follow this route, so you wouldn't want to use it up on a road (yes, I know the metro would cause destruction to the valley too, but it takes up a lot less space than a motorway). Also, your proposed new road starts at the N81/M50 interchange, so this would be a very complex arrangement.

I think an appropriate scheme for the N81 would be to copy what's being put in place on the N4 at the moment, where there will be dedicated bus lanes the whole way whose interaction with traffic at junctions is minimised. Like the bus lanes on the N7, but proper ones. Tallaght is a very low density town and a fast efficient bus service is crucial to keep a lid on car traffic, and get people to and from Luas lines and extensions. Part of all this is a major upgrade of the N81/M50 junction. It needs an N4/Red Cow full scale makeover.

On the subject of the extension, I notice on SDCC's roads info that the Tallaght BP Extension has been updated. It has been greatly extended in scope and will now reach Hollywood Cross, Wicklow - most of the way to Baltinglass. I wonder if it will be dual the whole way.

tom1ie

I totally agree that the n81/m50 junction needs to be upgraded to a full scale red cow intersection job, but theres not much point in doing that if the first thing you come across, after coming off the free flow slip road, is a roundabout or a set of traffic lights. The traffic needs a good strech of road before it comes to such an obstacle to minimize or stop tailbacks.
I have to say to an extent i agree with D'Peoples Voice, just re-organise some of the junctions and this should somewhat minimize traffic, but the proper job would be to re-bypass tallaght from the n81/m50 junction out past saggart.
If this was done in tandem with building a PROPER p+r at the proposed luas stop near citywest it would kill off alot of traffic.:D

tom1ie

Tallaght By-Pass Extension

Click to see location map. - Section within the adminstrative area of South Dublin County Council shown diagramatically in red and marked a - b.

Present Position: January 08 - NRA have decided that this scheme be transferred to the Kildare National Roads Design Office. The scheme has been extended to Hollywood Cross, Co Wicklow. The EIS is being prepared for that section within the administrative area of South Dublin County Council. The balance of the scheme requires a route selection process to be commenced in Kildare and Wicklow.
Construction is unlikely to commence prior to 2010. :mad::mad::mad:



I honestly do not believe this bull****!! How much longer are they going to make us wait in these poxy traffic ques. We need to do something about this crap. Does any one have any ideas on what could be done.
For a start i am passing on this sdcc message to all tallaght councillors and reprasentatives- for all thats worth! Any one else know other avenues we could persue?!