Drafting - Dangerous?

Bicyclegadabout

I mean behind buses and that when you’re commuting. It seems a bit risky but I’m not sure, what are your opinions?

In this windy weather it can be really feckin handy, and tbh I kinda enjoy the challenge of it.

Hungrycol

I do it when I can and it's handy to travel so fast for little effort. Just make sure your breaks are in good shape and your reflexes more so. I only tend to do it on a piece of road I'm familliar with so as not to slam into a pothole I don't see coming. Oh and be careul of leaving a busses slipstream, the wind can catch you off guard.

pete4130

It depends how yuo draft to be honest. Right behind the bus and righ up its ar$e is silly, if thay bus stops yuo cant see it happening or have anywhere to go. Safest way is at the back left of the bus so your not in the complete draft but still get some good benefit while still being able to see more of whats happening ahead of you and havign the option of slipping down the inside if there is room.
Catching a tow is alot easier but that has a whole different set of risks involved!

Raam

Not really a good idea unless you really know what you are doing. The bus will have much better brakes than your bike, so you run the risk of, well, it's obvious ain't it!
Think of the wind as a hill

fish-head

You don't have to get into an aero position to climb a hill though..

DirkVoodoo

Weighing the options of struggling against the wind or sucking in soot and carbon monoxide....I enjoy the odd draft, as mentioned it helps if you are familiar with the route and know where the bus is going to be stopping.

Frog Brother

Try it on a familiar bit of road alright, so as no to get any surprises. DON'T TRY IT ON A FIXIE WITH NO BRAKES- suicide:eek:

Bicyclegadabout

Frog Brother wrote: »

Try it on a familiar bit of road alright, so as no to get any surprises. DON'T TRY IT ON A FIXIE WITH NO BRAKES- suicide:eek:

Somewhere in the Sheldon Brown Fixie section, there’s an email from a guy in Australia who claimed that, in his prime, he could draft behind trucks going at over 75km/h. Going uphill. He estimated his cadence to be about 260rpm….sounds like good craic.

edit: http://sheldonbrown.com/fixed-testimonial.html
Email from "Andrew Eddy"

Tomas_V

Bicyclegadabout wrote: »

I mean behind buses and that when you’re commuting. It seems a bit risky but I’m not sure, what are your opinions?

Mostly I'm going faster then them, but, if doing it, I listen for the gear changes and hang back about 1/2 a car length, anticipate the bus stops, traffic lights, keep an eye on your inside track for escape routes & watch your speed, I'd say any more than 30kph, its going to be difficult to stop safely in city conditions. On wet roads, I'd say it's too risky.

cunnins4

Bicyclegadabout wrote: »

Somewhere in the Sheldon Brown Fixie section, there’s an email from a guy in Australia who claimed that, in his prime, he could draft behind trucks going at over 75km/h. Going uphill. He estimated his cadence to be about 260rpm….sounds like good craic.

edit: http://sheldonbrown.com/fixed-testimonial.html
Email from "Andrew Eddy"

He has to be spoofing! 75km/h uphill!! @ 260RPM! I'm yet to hit 75kph:( got 72 coming down howth one time, but never anything faster. Don't have a cadence meter to I have no idea what my cadence is ever, but 260 seems just a wee bit over the top!

As for drafting buses, it's great when you're tired, or it's windy, or if you're just a commuter. Can be risky, but that's obvious!

gimmeaminute

cunnins4 wrote: »

if you're just a commuter.

Just a commuter.

Sigh.

Ryder

drafting behind busses, cars etc. is idiocy. If the vehicle unexpectedly breaks you WILL hit it, likely with your front wheel and then your head and neck. The consequences are obvious........

Bicyclegadabout

Ryder wrote: »

drafting behind busses, cars etc. is idiocy. If the vehicle unexpectedly breaks you WILL hit it, likely with your front wheel and then your head and neck. The consequences are obvious........

Nah, not necessarily.

311

I'm always weary behind trucks ,because I can't see anything. Buses aren't too bad because it will never suddenly stop with people onboard

flickerx

pete4130 wrote: »

Catching a tow is alot easier but that has a whole different set of risks involved!

Pete you ever done this before? I try to do it occasionally with small flat bed trucks but I always lose my grip once they accelerate off. Have images in my head of my arm being ripped out of its socket if I grab on too tight and they floor it when the lights go green!

cunnins4

gimmeaminute wrote: »

Just a commuter.

Sigh.

I knew someone would take offence to that. I meant that if you're not training for a race or something. If you're training the wind is your friend.

Raam

flickerx wrote: »

Pete you ever done this before? I try to do it occasionally with small flat bed trucks but I always lose my grip once they accelerate off. Have images in my head of my arm being ripped out of its socket if I grab on too tight and they floor it when the lights go green!

I thought he meant just being able to get into it's draft and stay there, not actually hang on to the thing!

gimmeaminute

cunnins4 wrote: »

I knew someone would take offence to that. I meant that if you're not training for a race or something. If you're training the wind is your friend.

If you knew someone would take offence why didn't you edit it? The 'just' was completely unnecessary to your point. For an a).

For a b) I wasn't offended, I was inspired to sigh.

And for a c) How is wind your friend if you're training? Because it makes you work harder? Can't you use a bigger gear for that? I find calm days the best for training as I can maintain a rhythm more easily and thus monitor my effort level more closely.

Smile, big grin, wink etc...

Raam

gimmeaminute wrote: »

How is wind your friend if you're training? Because it makes you work harder? Can't you use a bigger gear for that?

In my experience, spinning into the wind isn't the same as pushing a bigger gear.

Ryder

Nah, not necessarily

Pretty blase response. You posted the question.
Yes, that kind of messing in traffic is dangerous and is unnecessarily risky. Obviously does'nt bother me what you do, but cyclist drafting in mainstream traffic with the risks if collisions and sudden slow downs in the stream if the wind shadow is lost gives us all a bad name.

Bicyclegadabout

Ryder wrote: »

Pretty blase response. You posted the question.
Yes, that kind of messing in traffic is dangerous and is unnecessarily risky. Obviously does'nt bother me what you do, but cyclist drafting in mainstream traffic with the risks if collisions and sudden slow downs in the stream if the wind shadow is lost gives us all a bad name.

Lucky for me I was automatically logged out while responding.

Blasé, yes it was.

dude, generalisations don’t help, nor does posing opinion as fact, nor does stating the obvious.
I want information, advice and maybe an interesting anecdote or two. That’s all.

Thanks.

Raam

Speaking of drafting, I could have done with someone to draft the last few days because of this wind we are having. I saw one chap get off to walk yesterday, he was trying to push a huge gear and was getting nowhere.

oobydooby

Raam wrote: »

Speaking of drafting, I could have done with someone to draft the last few days because of this wind we are having. I saw one chap get off to walk yesterday, he was trying to push a huge gear and was getting nowhere.

I know what you mean. I had to dismount twice in the last week crossing the East link. (I know... we are requested to dismount and get some cyclocross training in with the bike around the barriers but I commute on a tank). Between the lateral wind shadow of the trucks and the irregular gusts it was lethal.

As for drafting, that's silly in Dublin City. I can't think of any stretch of road where the surface is good enough. Maybe a good buslane would work but you'd want an express bus. It would make sense on a main road I guess but it's hard to keep up with the faster traffic.

Anecdote: I was cycling through Laos many years ago... and sometimes we would draft behind tuktuk taxis or pickups. The roads were fairly empty traffic wise and some stretches were perfect for cycling. We were just doing it for the craic - sacrificing the clean air for to make a bit of progress with no deadline would be a silly move. Anyway, zipping along at 40 km/hr pedalling fairly fast about a bike length behind a pickup one day all of a sudden a shovel comes flying from nowhere, just missing us!

Now, we're doing a leisurely 20km/hr outside the draft so we don't stop to investigate but keep in behind the truck and a few minutes later another shovel comes flying but this one lands in the pickup and the pickup stops. We soon figured that the locals who were looking for work would wait on the side of the road with their shovels and throw it at the pickup. If it lands in the pickup they get a lift and presumably a job! We soon gave up drafting these things because most of the shovels were missing the target and plodded along enjoying the fresh air instead.

Cabaal

oobydooby wrote: »

Now, we're doing a leisurely 20km/hr outside the draft so we don't stop to investigate but keep in behind the truck and a few minutes later another shovel comes flying but this one lands in the pickup and the pickup stops. We soon figured that the locals who were looking for work would wait on the side of the road with their shovels and throw it at the pickup. If it lands in the pickup they get a lift and presumably a job! We soon gave up drafting these things because most of the shovels were missing the target and plodded along enjoying the fresh air instead.

Jahsus, that sounds bloody dangerous!

niceonetom

oobydooby wrote: »

We soon figured that the locals who were looking for work would wait on the side of the road with their shovels and throw it at the pickup. If it lands in the pickup they get a lift and presumably a job! We soon gave up drafting these things because most of the shovels were missing the target and plodded along enjoying the fresh air instead.

i have to be misunderstanding this. are you telling me that in laois throwing shovels at a moving vehicle is considered a job-application? that's gas. it's like some sort of ancient celtic trial of manhood thing. can you run through the forest without snapping a single twin underfoot? who cares, can you lob a shovel into the flatbed of o toyota hilux doing 80? yes? now you are a man.

Ghost Rider

He said Laos, didn't he...?!

(People who can't spell should be kept on a short Laois, by the way.)

niceonetom wrote: »

i have to be misunderstanding this. are you telling me that in laois throwing shovels at a moving vehicle is considered a job-application? that's gas. it's like some sort of ancient celtic trial of manhood thing. can you run through the forest without snapping a single twin underfoot? who cares, can you lob a shovel into the flatbed of o toyota hilux doing 80? yes? now you are a man.

niceonetom

Ghost Rider wrote: »

He said Laos, didn't he...?!

(People who can't spell should be kept on a short Laois, by the way.)

ah right. still mad though.

Bicyclegadabout

Bicyclegadabout wrote: »

Lucky for me I was automatically logged out while responding.

Blasé, yes it was.

dude, generalisations don’t help, nor does posing opinion as fact, nor does stating the obvious.
I want information, advice and maybe an interesting anecdote or two. That’s all.

Thanks.

Hmmm, I should probably clarify this/apologise for it/something. Boards.ie can be difficult to work with sometimes.


Anyway, Laos, not Laois!!!! From Mountmellick to Rathdowney, people are cursing the name "niceonetom".

flickerx

Ghost Rider wrote: »

He said Laos, didn't he...?!

He meant Leitrim.

Ghost Rider

Gimme a brake!

flickerx wrote: »

He meant Leitrim.

unionman

oobydooby wrote: »

Anecdote: I was cycling through Laos many years ago... and sometimes we would draft behind tuktuk taxis or pickups. The roads were fairly empty traffic wise and some stretches were perfect for cycling. We were just doing it for the craic - sacrificing the clean air for to make a bit of progress with no deadline would be a silly move. Anyway, zipping along at 40 km/hr pedalling fairly fast about a bike length behind a pickup one day all of a sudden a shovel comes flying from nowhere, just missing us!

Now, we're doing a leisurely 20km/hr outside the draft so we don't stop to investigate but keep in behind the truck and a few minutes later another shovel comes flying but this one lands in the pickup and the pickup stops. We soon figured that the locals who were looking for work would wait on the side of the road with their shovels and throw it at the pickup. If it lands in the pickup they get a lift and presumably a job! We soon gave up drafting these things because most of the shovels were missing the target and plodded along enjoying the fresh air instead.

Great story. Completely mental!

To the OP, I think drafting is dodgy in Dublin, too many things can go wrong. At best, it inhibits your ability to read the road, and if that ability is inhibited at 20/30k, with limited stopping distance and an obstacle weighing several tonnes in front of you? (Shudders), I wouldn't fancy my chances. I do know of one fatality in Dublin under such circumstances (happened 30 years ago).

cunnins4

gimmeaminute wrote: »

If you knew someone would take offence why didn't you edit it? The 'just' was completely unnecessary to your point. For an a).

For a b) I wasn't offended, I was inspired to sigh.

And for a c) How is wind your friend if you're training? Because it makes you work harder? Can't you use a bigger gear for that? I find calm days the best for training as I can maintain a rhythm more easily and thus monitor my effort level more closely.

Smile, big grin, wink etc...

Jaybus, you're all about the humour aren't you? I was just saying drafting when you're just commuting's fine, but if you're training, it's not really that beneficial to your races.

"The wind is your friend" was said to me by one of Ireland's first Ironman competitors (he also held the Irish record for a while afaik) when I ran into him on a training ride. I was moaning about a head wind and he said "think of the wind as your friend". He came second in the Loughrea sprint triathlon that weekend. He's been competing for 20 or so years, so I think he knows what he was talking about. So ever since when someone says to me "do you not find the wind annoying?" i say "no, wind is my friend". It's a light hearted way of looking at windy days.

Hope i've cleared this up for you...sigh.....wink...etc....

gimmeaminute

cunnins4 wrote: »

Jaybus, you're all about the humour aren't you? I was just saying drafting when you're just commuting's fine, but if you're training, it's not really that beneficial to your races.

"The wind is your friend" was said to me by one of Ireland's first Ironman competitors (he also held the Irish record for a while afaik) when I ran into him on a training ride. I was moaning about a head wind and he said "think of the wind as your friend". He came second in the Loughrea sprint triathlon that weekend. He's been competing for 20 or so years, so I think he knows what he was talking about. So ever since when someone says to me "do you not find the wind annoying?" i say "no, wind is my friend". It's a light hearted way of looking at windy days.

Hope i've cleared this up for you...sigh.....wink...etc....

I stand extensively, expansively corrected.:o

And well spotted, I am all about the humour.

Ryder

Lucky for me I was automatically logged out while responding.

Blasé, yes it was.

dude, generalisations don’t help, nor does posing opinion as fact, nor does stating the obvious.
I want information, advice and maybe an interesting anecdote or two. That’s all.

Thanks.

I'm sorry. Had thought your question was self-explanatory

Drafting – Dangerous?

Obviously not.

You're right,

nor does stating the obvious

What is fact is that in one inner city Dublin hospital on average one cyclist is brought in every 2 weeks following a collision with a motor vehicle. How many were drafting? I don't know, but common sense would dictate that it is a high-risk activity and maybe even dangerous. Why risk it?

Sorry, dont have any anecdotes.

oobydooby

niceonetom wrote: »

i have to be misunderstanding this. are you telling me that in laois throwing shovels at a moving vehicle is considered a job-application? that's gas. it's like some sort of ancient celtic trial of manhood thing. can you run through the forest without snapping a single twin underfoot? who cares, can you lob a shovel into the flatbed of o toyota hilux doing 80? yes? now you are a man.

nice one - I've heard Laos (rhymes with cow) pronounced like Lay-os (rhymes with chaos) and everything in between I thought... Strange thing is, a lot of the shovel-chuckers were women looking for work!

TheThing!

Hit 40mph on the quays behind a truck, what a rush

niceonetom

TheThing! wrote: »

Hit 40mph on the quays behind a truck, what a rush

theThing makes a compelling point.

Drafting - Fun?