Civil and Electrical.........help!

eoghan h

Hey
Just wondering why Elec Eng is like 200 points less then Civil????
Are Civil Engineers paid more or is civil a better engineeribg degree??

....I'm confuzzled

My career guidance teacher told me that when the building industry in Ireland slows down, there are going to be far less jobs for Civil engineers....She have a clue what she's talking about???

godtabh

eoghan h wrote: »

Hey
Just wondering why Elec Eng is like 200 points less then Civil????
Are Civil Engineers paid more or is civil a better engineeribg degree??

....I'm confuzzled

My career guidance teacher told me that when the building industry in Ireland slows down, there are going to be far less jobs for Civil engineers....She have a clue what she's talking about???

Its to do with how many people apply for the course. The higher the number and the lower the places the higher the points will be and vice versa.

Dont know what the pay is but as an engineer you'rw not gona be making the big bucks but its a good living

eoghan h

not making the big bucks :-(

I thought engineers were really well paid.......

No, but you'll get a degree which you can (usually) use all over the world.

As for whether Civil is a better degree, it really makes no difference. If you want to go into Civil, you do Civil. If you want Elec, you do elec. If you're wishing to do a degree for the status of it all, then that's a whole other set of questions.

Starting salary for Graduate Civil Engineers is at around €29 - €34 I think. I remember seeing an ad for South Dublin County Council over the summer which had starting graduate engineers at €39,500... if they had a first (I). €35,000 was for a II.1 (or was it a second class degree?), and it went down a bit after that. Most other places I applied to over the summer had starting salary at around the €30,000 mark.

So it's quite decent. Certainly enough to live on. There was a thread here a good while back giving a link to the salary scales and what you'd expect to earn after 5 years, 10 years etc.

breadmonkey

Definitely pick whichever you have more interest in. After the 4 years you can always become an accountant or whatever if you want the €€€! (Seriously, I was quite surprised to find that all that stuff they tell you about engineering being a great degree for going into different areas is actually true!)

Also, as kearnsr pointed out the points requirement is only a reflection of the numbers applying for the course and not its quality.

DublinDilbert

As all of the others have said pick which one interests you most... if your not sure you could try do a course that has a "common" first year, which will give you a feel for all of them, then you can choose in 2nd year ( i think UCD engineering is done like this... )

Civil has been popular the last few years due to the building boom, this will not always be the case... electrical / electronic has not been so popular, partly due to the dot com fall out and alot of manufacturing moving to cheaper locations, but there is still design work going on in ireland...

If you decide to go down the electrical route, try pick a course with a fair amount of electronics & programming in it, cause it will stand to you in the long run...

eoghan h

I'm not sure which course I'm more interested in. I'm really confused and only a few months before CAO form has to be in....

So what career areas would ye recommend for making the big bucks???

Krieg

Civil eng = harder course but generally results in more money then other engineering discipline.


Honestly though, pick what YOU would like to do.
I mean, there is no guarentee that you will be making a 6 figure income if you got a degree in civil eng or Electronic. By picking the course you want to do, theres more of a chance you will enjoy the course + More of an interest in getting the qualification + More of a chance you will enjoy future work in that area.
Going on the notion that your doing a course specifically because theres a slight chance you will earn more money is pretty reckless and I cant imagine anyone advising it

breadmonkey

Even though I'm in Civil myself I really doubt that it's harder than Elec.

eoghan h

eoghan h wrote: »

So what career areas would ye recommend for making the big bucks???

Whatever career you go on, you probably won't make millions in it. If you want to really get money chances are you'll have to set up your own business. But really it's a bit silly asking what career you could do in order to get loaded.

A friend of mine finished Law and went over to the states straight into a $200,000 a year job. He hated it, and left it shortly after.

Civil is the easiest engineering to study.
It is is also the easiest discipline to set up your own business from, and that is where the big money is.

Timmaay

eoghan h wrote: »

Hey
Just wondering why Elec Eng is like 200 points less then Civil????
Are Civil Engineers paid more or is civil a better engineeribg degree??

....I'm confuzzled

If your talking about engineering in UCD, elec is 200 points lower because you have to get a B1 (i think) in higher maths where as you only need to get a C3 for civil. Therefore, less people meet the minimum requirements so the points drop.

As everyone else says, theres little difference between salaries in civ and elec, choose what you like. The only thing I'd say, is that elec engineering is much tougher than civil, much more maths and crazy equations, and when you do quilify, there'll be far more jobs for civils than elecs.

eoghan h

Thanks!!
Now i just have to work out which 1 i like more........

A Primal Nut

Either way, you'll get into a job. Civil because the building industry is booming, electrical because its so varied. I'm in 4th year Electrical & Electronic Engineering and we've done everything from power generation & transmission to analog circuits to digital electronics to computer hardware and software, with some control & automation and Commications Engineering thrown in. As a result, the course is very intense. Job opportunites are broad. You usually get a chance to specialise though. There seems to be a lot of jobs available anyway.

Engineers get the most money out of all starting graduates, you don't have to worry about doing further study (like in law & accounting) and any experienced Engineers I know are on a lot of money.

Incidentally, the course and the job are two very different things. I hate most of the **** I'm doing in my course basically because everything is explained through equations instead of actually explaining what the **** is going on! Having said that, I'm still looking forward to actually working, getting hands-on experience, etc. It's probably something similiar in the other engineering disciplines so I'd recommend going for the one you'd rather work in rather than the course because you'll be working a lot longer than ya'll be studying.

Think about which employer you'd prefer. A building company, working on a building site, or with the esb designing, say power stations or with an electronics company working on desiging hardware for computers and networks. Its all very different.

As for the points difference, more people want to do Civil Engineering and in some colleges, a higher grade is needed in Maths to do Electrical/Electronic Engineering, further decreasing the amount of eligible candidates.

Michael Collins

Timmaay wrote: »

If your talking about engineering in UCD, elec is 200 points lower because you have to get a B1 (i think) in higher maths where as you only need to get a C3 for civil.

Actually this is no longer the case. You used to need a minimum B3 to get in but now it's same as all the others at a C3. This is part because there's a general first year and part because...well their desperate!

Engineers get the most money out of all starting graduates

Ah if only! There's a few groups who get more. Teachers for one. It's still not bad, and it rises quicker, in general, than teachers' saleries do.

Borzoi

eoghan h wrote: »

Are Civil Engineers paid more or is civil a better engineeribg degree??


My career guidance teacher told me that when the building industry in Ireland slows down, there are going to be far less jobs for Civil engineers....She have a clue what she's talking about???

From looking at the 2005 IEI salary guide there's damn all differnece in the average rate of pay between Civil/Construction engineers and Electrical/electronic engineers

If you're confused about your preference go for a course with a common first year

Your guidance teacher may have a crystal ball, but frankly I wouldn't be paying for batteries:)

Teg Veece

I know I've mentioned this course in another thread but I think that the Energy Engineering course starting at UCC next year might be just the degree for you.
Its actually a mix of both civil and electrical engineering. Its run between both departments and you'll have absolutely no problems getting a job afterwards especially with the recent push for alternative energies.

With the oil supplies running out, I'd say it could be a very interesting career choice.

Here's a link to get you started: http://www.ucc.ie/en/engfac/undergrad/energyeng/

eoghan h

I've been considering the Energy Engineeri degree too!

Basically I want a well paid job with HUGE OPPURTUNITIES for travel!! I wanna be able to work anywhere in the world if I get bored of Ireland....

What does everyone think about the future employment of each degree?? Is civil going to drop??

godtabh

A Primal Nut wrote: »

you don't have to worry about doing further study (like in law & accounting) and any experienced Engineers I know are on a lot of money.

Thats not true. If you want to pogress as egineer it will involve a lot of CPD which will involve a certain amount of study for example if you want to be chartered

breadmonkey

What does CPD mean?

chris85

breadmonkey wrote: »

What does CPD mean?

CPD stands for continuous professional development. It done by engineers ireland. involves going to conferences, further study, etc. Needed for chartership.

I like the sound of the energy course, sounds very interesting to be honest.

Civel engineers get it too easy in my opinion.

in any type of engineering discipline you will have no problem getting a job, especially since you are willing to travel

breadmonkey

chris85 wrote: »

Civel engineers get it too easy in my opinion.

Haha, why?

eoghan h

I'm worried with the Energy Engineering degree that it may be hard to find work!

Are the basics of the engineering degrees more or less the same??

eg.
Could a civil change to mechanical fairly easily???

breadmonkey

eoghan h wrote: »

Could a civil change to mechanical fairly easily???

I can only speak for UCD but 1st year mech and civil are identical. The two diverge significantly thereafter.

Teg Veece

eoghan h wrote: »

I'm worried with the Energy Engineering degree that it may be hard to find work!

Are the basics of the engineering degrees more or less the same??

eg.
Could a civil change to mechanical fairly easily???

I wouldn't be too worried about finding a job with any of the engineering courses especially Energy Engineering. I finished up with an Electrical and Electronic Engineering course myself earlier this year and most of my class got jobs in the electrical side of things rather than the electronic. As an energy engineer, you'd have access to those jobs and more.

My advice would be to forget about picking a course because of pay or job availability. Pick a course that you enjoy. There's no point in getting paid a lot of money if you hate what you're going to be doing for the next 45 years of your life.

Turbulent Bill

Honestly, just pick the one that you enjoy most. The salary, travel opportunities etc. are basically the same across all disciplines for graduates, and if you pick something just for the money then you will be miserable. The employment market can (and probably will) change while you're doing your course, but it's impossible to predict what will happen.

I'd advise anyone to do a course with at least a year's general engineering (all disciplines), before specialising later. At 17/18 you probably haven't had enough exposure to different fields, so you're better off doing a bit of everything to get some experience. Another advantage is that lots of jobs are now interdisciplinary (mech and civil, elec and mech etc.), which requires a broad range of skills.

chris85

breadmonkey wrote: »

Haha, why?

Sorry im on the mechanical side of things an theres always a friendly rivelry between civil and mech.

Their calculations are a lot easier though. I really like mechanical all the same.

Dundhoone

I cant comment on Electrical engineering , but friends of mine with purely electronic engineering degrees have a had a hard time getting work over the past eight years. And that was during the boom time.

I'd advise civil , but then im biased!

eoghan h

Dundhoone wrote: »

I cant comment on Electrical engineering , but friends of mine with purely electronic engineering degrees have a had a hard time getting work over the past eight years. And that was during the boom time.

I'd advise civil , but then im biased!

Did you study civil in Galway?? If i dont get the points for Cork I'll probably go to Galway

Dundhoone

Yes i studied in Galway - the course is held in good regard. Mech grads that I knew also got jobs quick enough, it was just that the Electronics didnt have as much opportunity. Electronics in Ireland just isnt a huge industry I think.

eoghan h

I think I might study the Undenominated course in Galway so then I can decide in 2nd year which I want to pursue!

breadmonkey

eoghan h wrote: »

I think I might study the Undenominated course in Galway so then I can decide in 2nd year which I want to pursue!

Just thought I'd give you a heads up here: I did the undenominated in UCD and didn't realise that people would be awarded a place in their chosen discipline based on their 1st year results. I honestly have no idea if this is the case in Galway but it's a definite possibility. This isn't really a problem if you're going for Chem or Elec but Mech and Civil might require you to outdo your classmates. To be honest, if you can handle exams then this won't be an issue but just be aware that there might be that little bit of added pressure.

johnathan woss

Asbad wrote: »

Civil eng = harder course

Are you joking ?

gubbie

Asbad wrote: »

Civil eng = harder course but generally results in more money then other engineering discipline.

Hahahahahaha
Good joke

If someone just gets 400 points chances are they're not gonna be able to do elec. That is unless you are one of those incredibly gifted at maths and Physics people and slept for the whole year

UCD are also creating another back road entry into something like Civil if there's a spare place for anyone who doesn't get the points for it but ends up doing another engineering in UCD

godtabh

gubbie wrote: »

Hahahahahaha
Good joke

If someone just gets 400 points chances are they're not gonna be able to do elec. That is unless you are one of those incredibly gifted at maths and Physics people and slept for the whole year

UCD are also creating another back road entry into something like Civil if there's a spare place for anyone who doesn't get the points for it but ends up doing another engineering in UCD

Points has nothign to do with whether you can do the course or not.

You could easily get 400 points doing arts, history, biology and your normal subjects. How does that help you with eletronic engeneering?

SparkyLarks

If you want to ear as an engineer, try petrolum engeneiring, big shortage of them at the moment and it;s getting worse as alot of the petrol enginers will be retiring in the next few years in america. it;s a big issue for the american engineering industry.

then go and work in the middle east/Norway and ther is good money. but it;s tough 12 hours days 7 days a week for 3 weeks then one week off and back on again.

Ther is a lot of oportunities out there if you want to work hard in a funny location.

Redjeep!

Hmmm engineering....

No other profession is probably less well respected, misunderstood and underpaid. You'll be patronised by newly qualified accountants who think that they're better at maths than you, assumed to be one step above the person who empties the bins by sales and generally thought of as a glorified electrician/ bricky/ plumber by the rest of the world. (Not that I want to be critical of any of these roles).

Personally I have told, no make that strongly advised, my sons not to even consider it and to go off and be something like a lawyer or a doctor.

If you're confident that playing with things will make up for this in your life then go ahead....

(before anybody calls me cynical I'd like to point out that I've worked as an engineer for 20 years and rose to a fairly senior engineering manager level in a large engineering based comapny, so I do know what I'm talking about).

Funny thing is, I still love the engineering side of my job.

godtabh

Redjeep! wrote: »

Hmmm engineering....

No other profession is probably less well respected, misunderstood and underpaid. You'll be patronised by newly qualified accountants who think that they're better at maths than you, assumed to be one step above the person who empties the bins by sales and generally thought of as a glorified electrician/ bricky/ plumber by the rest of the world. (Not that I want to be critical of any of these roles).

Personally I have told, no make that strongly advised, my sons not to even consider it and to go off and be something like a lawyer or a doctor.

If you're confident that playing with things will make up for this in your life then go ahead....

(before anybody calls me cynical I'd like to point out that I've worked as an engineer for 20 years and rose to a fairly senior engineering manager level in a large engineering based comapny, so I do know what I'm talking about).

Funny thing is, I still love the engineering side of my job.

How long ago was that?

I've never experienced that. To be fair architects (some but not all) dont value an engineers input as much as they should.

IN the jobs I work in I could safely say that the as a member of the design team my relevant experience and expertise is widely welcome.

Redjeep!

This was up to today.

In fairness this was in a specific branch of electrical/ electronic - it may be that in other disciplines you get more respect.

I think that if you work in a small practice it's probably different as well rather than a larger firm (i.e. thousands of employees).

tywy

Asbad wrote: »

Civil eng = harder course but generally results in more money then other engineering discipline.


Honestly though, pick what YOU would like to do.
I mean, there is no guarentee that you will be making a 6 figure income if you got a degree in civil eng or Electronic. By picking the course you want to do, theres more of a chance you will enjoy the course + More of an interest in getting the qualification + More of a chance you will enjoy future work in that area.
Going on the notion that your doing a course specifically because theres a slight chance you will earn more money is pretty reckless and I cant imagine anyone advising it

Civil = arts of engineering :P

Elec is way harder that Civil imo... Elec has way more hours and is way more theory based.

Also with the points thing, the points for Elec in UCD go up and down, they let any person with a B3 in honours maths in, as long as they have the other requirements for the uni. So in my year the points were 330 because someone got 330 including his B3 in honours maths. The median for Elec Eng is 460 or something like that. It's quite a difficult course, there's good money to be made in Electrical I think because there aren't many qualifying, only 2 in final year this year. Also what is the world talking about these days, what to do when the oil runs out, it's all about renewable energy. You work towards a breakthrough in that and you're minted!

N1njapirate

Because many people aren't interested about studying electronics. Sometimes it isn't about the money.. :S

godtabh

tywy wrote: »

Civil = arts of engineering :P

Elec is way harder that Civil imo... Elec has way more hours and is way more theory based.

Also with the points thing, the points for Elec in UCD go up and down, they let any person with a B3 in honours maths in, as long as they have the other requirements for the uni. So in my year the points were 330 because someone got 330 including his B3 in honours maths. The median for Elec Eng is 460 or something like that. It's quite a difficult course, there's good money to be made in Electrical I think because there aren't many qualifying, only 2 in final year this year. Also what is the world talking about these days, what to do when the oil runs out, it's all about renewable energy. You work towards a breakthrough in that and you're minted!

Points are to do with how many people want to do the course. If 10 people want to do the course it would be low points. If 150 wanted to do the coruse it would be high points.

But I do agree civil is the easiest out of the lot

Ishindar

i did electrical eng in kevin st and 15 years later its still giving me a very comfortable living. elec/electronic is a very tough course. i find that eng gives u big advantages in life in many ways outside work. u can do almost any diy job yourself. u can fix pretty much anything. your problem solving abailities are way above average.

steifanc

eoghan h wrote: »

Hey
Just wondering why Elec Eng is like 200 points less then Civil????
Are Civil Engineers paid more or is civil a better engineeribg degree??

....I'm confuzzled

My career guidance teacher told me that when the building industry in Ireland slows down, there are going to be far less jobs for Civil engineers....She have a clue what she's talking about???

there is a big difference in the points because the drop out rate is high for ele eng and the pass rate low

steifanc

steifanc wrote: »

there is a big difference in the points because the drop out rate is high for ele eng and the pass rate low

No, as was said in this thread that the points are a reflection of the people applying for the course, not the course itself.

-asdfgh-

Krieg wrote: »

Civil eng = harder course but generally results in more money then other engineering discipline.


Honestly though, pick what YOU would like to do.
I mean, there is no guarentee that you will be making a 6 figure income if you got a degree in civil eng or Electronic. By picking the course you want to do, theres more of a chance you will enjoy the course + More of an interest in getting the qualification + More of a chance you will enjoy future work in that area.
Going on the notion that your doing a course specifically because theres a slight chance you will earn more money is pretty reckless and I cant imagine anyone advising it

I heard that electronic is meant to be the hardest followed by process and chemical. I heard civil is meant to be the easiest

dan_d

Okay so I'm a bit late to this discussion, but I'm 2 years out of UCD and i did civil. The points difference is simple....there's about 30 people in the elec eng classes and about 75 in the civil.Obviously civil is way more popular. Hence points are higher. Also, usually the people who do engineering really want to do it, they don't just settle for it coz they couldn't think of anything else to do. Many people in my class had way over 560 points, but they were doing a course that only required about 420 points.The fact that you know you want to do engineering is most of the battle!
Elecs have way more hours, but at the end of the day, any engineering is not an easy degree to get. Also civils have (or had anyway) a work placement in 3rd year, which is a huge advantage. Also, be under no illusions...Ireland is one of the only countries in the world who simply does not recognise engineers for what they are.Anyone can call themselves an engineer...the real engineers in this country are never heard from.But you'll be respected in pretty much every other country.Money-wise...no better than most.Civils are beginning to slide a bit but we have some serious construction to do for infrastructure in this country so technically there should be engineering jobs for many years to come. You are not going walk into a job that pays a fortune, but you can do very well for yourself if you're prepared to work(same as anything).There does tend to be extras though...company cars/vans, travel allowance, living expenses, particularly if you're working on site. I will say that the few electrical engineers that I know have all had to go abroad to find jobs. Then, if you're a civil, you can go to places like Dubai, or Australia, where they are shouting for engineers, and make a fortune.
That's probably mainly totally unhelpful, but it's honest. UCD's degree is a very good one, as is UCGs. Good luck!!!

life_is_music

I have civil in UCC down as my first choice. Think im gonna change it to Energy Engineering (new course in UCC). I found out that civil in UCC doesnt have a work placement - major turnoff.