Leitrim shafted (again) by Constituency Review Commision

il gatto · 31-10-2007 5:59am #1

Leitrim has again got a raw deal in the latest re-jig of constituencies. According to Michael Comiskey, who narrowly missed out on election, and several political analysts, these changes make it even more unlikely that Leitrim will have a representative in the next Dáil.
Do the powers that be simply not care, or is there some sort of vindictiveness?
I believe due to the limited number of Dáil seats, and the fact that some densely populated constituencies were under represented, they decided to split an "unimportant" one to make a seat extra elsewhere. I'm not sure because each change makes another one in the next constituency. Whatever the reason, the whole thing is a disgrace:mad:

nanook · 01-11-2007 10:22pm

well said. It was never going to happen, a Leitrim representative after the reshuffle of the county. North roscommon is larger than south Leitrim as is North Leitrim vs. Sligo.

Not a good state of affairs at all

Victor · 01-11-2007 10:37pm

I'm quite sure Leitrim isn't the only community of 29,000 without a TD.

il gatto wrote: »

Do the powers that be simply not care

No they don't.

Leitrim people whinged they didn't elect a Dáil representative (in theory Leitrim can have 6) and then went and split their vote in the Seanad election and didn't elect a senator either. If you don't help yourselves, why do you expect others to help you? Did Leitrim people complain when they had too many TDs and Senators in previous years. Oh no.

Speaking of the Seanad. Leitrim (28,950) had 22 votes in the Seanad election (about enough for one Senator). The Carrigaline area of Cork (population 77,198) had 7. Beware what you ask for.

Oh, out of this exercise, all that the people of Leitrim have learned is how to send e-mail spam. Did it occur to any of ye to actually make a proposal to the Commission instead of just doing pre-scripted objections?

nanook · 02-11-2007 6:28am

what would you expect from a Jackin

il gatto · 02-11-2007 1:15pm

Victor wrote: »

I'm quite sure Leitrim isn't the only community of 29,000 without a TD.No they don't.

Leitrim people whinged they didn't elect a Dáil representative (in theory Leitrim can have 6) and then went and split their vote in the Seanad election and didn't elect a senator either. If you don't help yourselves, why do you expect others to help you? Did Leitrim people complain when they had too many TDs and Senators in previous years. Oh no.

Speaking of the Seanad. Leitrim (28,950) had 22 votes in the Seanad election (about enough for one Senator). The Carrigaline area of Cork (population 77,198) had 7. Beware what you ask for.

Oh, out of this exercise, all that the people of Leitrim have learned is how to send e-mail spam. Did it occur to any of ye to actually make a proposal to the Commission instead of just doing pre-scripted objections?

I wasn't speaking of the Seanad, as that particular body is as much use as a chocolate teapot to a constituency which elects a member. And besides, you're not comparing like with like. An area like Carrigaline has a high population density meaning an elected representative is from your immediate locality. Over a whole county with a population a third of the one you mentioned, a single representative is less effective.
Whinging is a very strong term when in reality, electing a T.D. would have meant people voting against the party they thought best able to run the country. Apart from it being unlikely that enough people would abandon their preferred party for the good of the county, such an approach is hardly in the best interests of democracy.
The theory of being able to elect 6 is such a far fetched one that I needed bother responding to. In reality (which is where it counts), electing one member was made extremely difficult, and the result was a failure to do so.
As for spam e-mails, I neither sent nor received any, so I can't comment.
As regards making representations to the Commission, that body has publically stated that over half of the representations made to it were from County Leitrim.

muffler · 02-11-2007 4:07pm

Victor wrote: »

I'm quite sure Leitrim isn't the only community of 29,000 without a TD.

Agreed but is that the peoples fault?

Victor wrote: »

Leitrim people whinged they didn't elect a Dáil representative

Link please. Im sure they were like most other areas as above who voted but didnt get a TD elected. I would call it expressing disappointment but certainly not whinging as you put it.

Victor wrote: »

If you don't help yourselves, why do you expect others to help you?

So they didnt vote then

Victor wrote: »

Beware what you ask for.

Meaning what?

Victor wrote: »

Oh, out of this exercise, all that the people of Leitrim have learned is how to send e-mail spam.

Whats all this about. Can you explain?

Victor wrote: »

Did it occur to any of ye to actually make a proposal to the Commission instead of just doing pre-scripted objections?

So you know for a fact that nobody from Leitrim contacted the Commission - Have you glass balls Victor

Victor · 02-11-2007 8:54pm

il gatto wrote: »

I wasn't speaking of the Seanad, as that particular body is as much use as a chocolate teapot to a constituency which elects a member.

Better than nothing. Apparently Leitrim once had 3 senators and a TD. We elect individuals, not county GAA shirts.

And besides, you're not comparing like with like. An area like Carrigaline has a high population density meaning an elected representative is from your immediate locality.

Not necessarily. I don't know the particular spread of TDs in Cork South Central, but in more urbanised areas it can take as long or longer to reach a TD's office. But these days we have things like post, telephone and e-mail.

Over a whole county with a population a third of the one you mentioned, a single representative is less effective.

How so? North Leitrim is much more accessible to Sligo than it is to Carrick-on-Shannon. You can't even drive directly from North Leitrim to South Leitrim. What use is a TD in Carrick-on-Shannon to someone on the Donegal border?

Whinging is a very strong term when in reality,

electing a T.D. would have meant people voting against the party they thought best able to run the country. Apart from it being unlikely that enough people would abandon their preferred party for the good of the county,

Hey, we'd all love to get two votes, but we don't. Is there any guarantee that Leitrim would actually elect a TD anyway instead of voting along the usual party lines?

such an approach is hardly in the best interests of democracy.

Explain your definition of democracy.

The theory of being able to elect 6 is such a far fetched one that I needed bother responding to.

As I said, Leitrim once had 3 senators and a TD.

As regards making representations to the Commission, that body has publically stated that over half of the representations made to it were from County Leitrim.

Indeed, but many using the above or very similar wording.

stepbar · 02-11-2007 10:09pm

How so? North Leitrim is much more accessible to Sligo than it is to Carrick-on-Shannon. You can't even drive directly from North Leitrim to South Leitrim <SNIP> What use is a TD in Carrick-on-Shannon to someone on the Donegal border?

The same could be said of someone living on the Cavan border. But hey these days we do have things like post, telephone and e-mail ya know...

So a few hundred indentical submission isn't whinging? Can you tell me how constructive these submissions are?

http://www.constituency-commission.ie/submissions/Sub07_174.pdf
Yada Yada Yada.......

The wording used in these submissions were quoted directly from the Leitrim Observer. People were encouraged to make their opinion known in an uniform fashion as a method of protest, more than anything else. A number of detailed submissions were made - I do know Marian Harkin, Leitrim County Council, Cormac O Suilleabháin / Save Leitrim Campaign all made submissions. There were more but I don't have the names to hand.

All of the above come Marian Harkin (with other peopel names typed in) => spam.

So Marian Harkin is not allowed to send an email on behalf of one of her constituents?

Hey, we'd all love to get two votes, but we don't. Is there any guarantee that Leitrim would actually elect a TD anyway instead of voting along the usual party lines?

In fairness, you would hardly vote for FF if you voted for FG all your life? vice verse or whatever. John Ellis topped the poll on South Leitrim votes alone and I can guarentee that he would have done the same in North Leitrim had the opportunity presented itself.

As I said, Leitrim once had 3 senators and a TD

So? What has that to do with anything?

Edit by muffler: Please refrain from posting within a quote

il gatto · 02-11-2007 10:18pm

A pointless dissection of my post. If you want to go down that route, I'll answer each question you've posed.
We elect representatives, not GAA shirts. Very true. And I would would like to see T.D.s do their job of legislating, not trawling for goodies for their home town, but in reality that's all most T.D.s do and if you don't have one, your screwed.
It doesn't matter if a Cork south central member is hard to reach due to traffic. He is still from the area he represents. Not the next county. These days we have loads of ways of contacting people, not one as effective as meeting face to face.
Roscommon town is not more accessable to Carrick than Sligo. South Leitrim has existing links to Sligo. South Leitrim's hospital is in Sligo, as is it's hospice, it's department of agriculture office. Their nearest I.T. is in Sligo. There's many people living in south Leitrim who work in Sligo. The old constituency reflected the natural state of the region.
One person (or a few) sending spam does not reflect on the rest of Leitrim people concerned with their fate in the government of the country. I don't know if they make any suggestions, as I'm not going to read them. Pointless.
We do have two votes, or three,four etc. That's how porportional representation works. I said I didn't think enough people would cross the party divide, but then I suppose why should they when no other area needs to do that to have a single representative in the Dáil?
I not definig democracy. That's just pedantic. I just said it's not good for democracy to elect, as you said, GAA shirts, at the expense of voting for the best government to run the country.
Leitrim may have had three Senators and one T.D. but I'm afraid referring to a past state of representation has no bearing on the current state of affairs, other than suggest that it's in some way fair to leave the county bereft of a represenative because twenty years ago they were over represented.
I did not hear whether the representations made to the Commission were spam. They didn't state that anywher I read. It could be true.

Victor · 02-11-2007 10:35pm

stepbar wrote: »

How so? North Leitrim is much more accessible to Sligo than it is to Carrick-on-Shannon. You can't even drive directly from North Leitrim to South Leitrim <SNIP> What use is a TD in Carrick-on-Shannon to someone on the Donegal border?

Please don't misquote me.

stepbar · 02-11-2007 10:56pm

Victor wrote: »

Please don't misquote me.

Excuse me? You may not be able to drive directly across Lough Allen but you sure as hell can drive from South Leitrim to North Leitrim. You'd have it sound like the road ended at Lough Allen :rolleyes: :rolleyes: As that had anything to do with the orginal topic Victor :rolleyes: but I thought I would point that out while I was at it.

@ Muffler - Why did you snip part of my post? Is there a problem

muffler · 02-11-2007 10:59pm

Victor wrote: »

Please don't misquote me.

OK. Thats sorted.

And just to remind others (although we dont normally have this problem here) do not post comments within a quote - use the quote option if you wish but post your comment separate from it - outside of the quote tags

muffler · 02-11-2007 11:00pm

stepbar wrote: »

@ Muffler - Why did you snip part of my post? Is there a problem

You can read cant you? - I have now given the reason twice

stepbar · 06-11-2007 8:05pm

Victor seems to have gone all shy

Leitrim shafted (again) by Constituency Review Commision

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