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Bring back the Greek gods

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  • 23-10-2007 3:22pm
    #1
    hairyheretic
    Registered Users Posts: 1,257 ✭✭✭


    Found this article posted on another forum I wonder through, and thought I'd post it here.

    Full article at the link.

    http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-lefkowitz23oct23,0,3984103.story?coll=la-tot-opinion&track=ntothtml
    Prominent secular and atheist commentators have argued lately that religion "poisons" human life and causes endless violence and suffering. But the poison isn't religion; it's monotheism. The polytheistic Greeks didn't advocate killing those who worshiped different gods, and they did not pretend that their religion provided the right answers. Their religion made the ancient Greeks aware of their ignorance and weakness, letting them recognize multiple points of view.


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    #2
    WindSock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,239 ✭✭✭✭WindSock


    What about those who celebrate Polytheistic rituals such as human sacrifice? Thats murder in my books.
    And to say that they didn't kill as much out of intolerance in Greek times is poppycock. They were always at war, for instance.


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    #3
    Shiminay
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 28,633 Mod ✭✭✭✭Shiminay


    lol

    When the history of the 20th century is read in several hundred or even a couple of thousand years time, that's what they'll say about us. 2 World Wars, Vietnam, Kuwait, Iraq, etc...


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    #4
    18AD
    Registered Users Posts: 1,821 ✭✭✭18AD


    http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/163

    This seems fairly relevant.

    Maybe not directly related, but hopeful at least. It says that global culture is becoming less violent through time. So maybe despite religion our collective nature is winning out.

    Enjoy.
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    #5
    hairyheretic
    Registered Users Posts: 1,257 ✭✭✭hairyheretic


    boreds wrote: »
    What about those who celebrate Polytheistic rituals such as human sacrifice? Thats murder in my books.

    Are you talking in ancient times or present day?

    If ancient times, pretty much all religions had some degree of divinely inspired violence. I don't think it would require too much effort to find examples of such.

    Modern day, I'm not familiar with any human sacrificing being caried out. Indeed the article itself says

    "There is much we still can learn from these ancient notions of divinity, even if we can agree that the practices of animal sacrifice, deification of leaders and divining the future through animal entrails and bird flights are well lost."
    boreds wrote: »
    And to say that they didn't kill as much out of intolerance in Greek times is poppycock. They were always at war, for instance.

    Yes, they did fight a fair bit, from what I can remember of my greek history, but at the same time I don't recall it being because of religion.


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    #6
    Scofflaw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,283 ✭✭✭✭Scofflaw


    hairyheretic wrote: »
    Yes, they did fight a fair bit, from what I can remember of my greek history, but at the same time I don't recall it being because of religion.

    Land, power, and influence - which included control of shrines - occasionally as a matter of sacred duty (for example the Delphic League, an alliance that protected the Oracle at Delphi, fought a ten-year war against the Phocians, League members who sacked Delphi in 356BC), but never as far as I know on doctrinal matters, so no 'religious wars' in the sense that we know them.

    cordially,
    Scofflaw


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    #7
    WindSock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,239 ✭✭✭✭WindSock


    Ah right. I just got it into my head about violence, not about violence out of religious intolerance in particular.
    I Wonder if it is to do with there being no Sacred texts or Prophet/Messiah ever being born from Greek society? A lot of religious fighting is just down to peoples interepretations of what the Bible/Koran etc says (which in my view were written by man, not God).


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    #8
    Talliesin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,314 ✭✭✭Talliesin


    boreds wrote: »
    What about those who celebrate Polytheistic rituals such as human sacrifice? Thats murder in my books.
    Many Western states kill people to appease their idea of what is right (USA does the most). Hellenic reconstructionists don't.
    hairyheretic wrote: »
    Indeed the article itself says

    "There is much we still can learn from these ancient notions of divinity, even if we can agree that the practices of animal sacrifice, deification of leaders and divining the future through animal entrails and bird flights are well lost."


    Can't say I've any problem with animal sacrifice, not being a vegetarian, though the Greek method of holocaust (destroying the sacrifice by fire) seems a wasteful one to me, compared to most forms where the meat would be eaten afterwards.
    boreds wrote: »
    I Wonder if it is to do with there being no Sacred texts or Prophet/Messiah ever being born from Greek society? A lot of religious fighting is just down to peoples interepretations of what the Bible/Koran etc says (which in my view were written by man, not God).
    Well, if you don't actually give a damn what other people believe, you aren't going to kill them for it, so I think it'd fall down more to the lack of missionary zeal.

    That said, some Ancient Greek cults did perform some murders over matters of doctrine, a particularly notorious case being when the Pythagoreans (not the Hellenic belief mentioned above, but a religion based on seeking truth through mathematical insight) killed someone for developping a proof of irrational numbers existing that can not be expressed as fractions of whole numbers - particularly sad given that now it's not even a very hard proof to arrive at (a bright secondary school child should be able to prove it).


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