Rows of concrete blocks left outside garden walls.

bandit197

Im not sure if this is the right place for this thread but it is relevant. What is the story with people closing off the area between their garden walls and the edge of the road with concrete blocks. Sometimes they even have chains linking them up. I presume this is to put off people parking there but I think this action is very selfish. In an emergency you cannot swerve in this area to avoid a hazard. The issue is more severe for bikers who would almost certainly come off if they hit them. Does anyone know the laws regarding this. Correct me if Im wrong but I believe this area is council property, as it is set out as a condition in a granted planning permission application, to keep the garden walls of new houses back a certain distance from the road. Also, if I have to swerve in an emergency and I damage my car on these blocks, who is liable?

BeardyGit

bandit197 wrote: »

Im not sure if this is the right place for this thread but it is relevant. What is the story with people closing off the area between their garden walls and the edge of the road with concrete blocks. Sometimes they even have chains linking them up. I presume this is to put off people parking there but I think this action is very selfish. In an emergency you cannot swerve in this area to avoid a hazard. The issue is more severe for bikers who would almost certainly come off if they hit them. Does anyone know the laws regarding this. Correct me if Im wrong but I believe this area is council property, as it is set out as a condition in a granted planning permission application, to keep the garden walls of new houses back a certain distance from the road. Also, if I have to swerve in an emergency and I damage my car on these blocks, who is liable?

Your car should stay on the road. Period.

If you have to 'swerve', you're liable for causing damage to anything you impact with.

End of story.

Seth Brundle

I agree with what Gil said. If you need to swerve then you are not paying enough attention to your driving!

bandit197

Gil_Dub wrote: »

Your car should stay on the road. Period.

If you have to 'swerve', you're liable for causing damage to anything you impact with.

End of story.

Your car should stay on the road? so if you are faced with an oncoming truck or car whose driver has fell asleep at the wheel, you would stay in your lane and take a head on collision rather than moving into the tarmaced area in front of a group of houses to avoid it? Sorry lads but that is the most ridiculous statement I have heard in a while.

astraboy

Gil_Dub wrote: »

Your car should stay on the road. Period.

If you have to 'swerve', you're liable for causing damage to anything you impact with.

End of story.

Ya shar far better to plow into the dog/kid that runs out on to the road in front of you. :rolleyes: For once, just once, I'd like to see someone come on this forum and get an answer to their question without the high horse bandits getting hold of the thread. Making stupid statements that a person should never have to swerve is just typical. Yes, ordinarily people should not have to swerve off the road, but you never know what might happen when your out for a drive.

To answer the question, the council owns the public road so people have not right to block parts of it with obstacles.

TJJP

bandit197 wrote: »

What is the story with people closing off the area between their garden walls and the edge of the road with concrete blocks. Also, if I have to swerve in an emergency and I damage my car on these blocks, who is liable?

It could be annoying I suppose, but in the case of an accident as you suggest you could be accused of excessive/inappropriate speed by exceeding the posted speed limit or driving too fast for conditions (the single largest factor contributing to road deaths in Ireland).

In theory one should not be driving so fast as to be unable to stop or take appropriate avoiding action. On the basis that the problem you suggest is outside a house, it’s likely a built up area and it could be subject to a speed restriction of 30kph. In that case it could be difficult to argue you couldn’t stop.

Mind you, I wonder if it’s on the road side, rather than on someone’s land is it an obstruction of the public thoroughfare?

skibum

I know that I would rather hit a concrete block than hit the car that the blocks are preventing from parking there

Run_to_da_hills

I have come across this along Threadneedle Road in Galway where people would park for the Salt Hill air show (:( Awh!!), Residents have placed large rocks on the grass verge out side their houses on public property. It is not only selfish but very dangerous, It could burst the sump of a car or an emergency vehicle unknowingly and lead to an accident with a motorcycle skidding on an oil spillage or a siezed motor. There is only one solution to this problem and is to throw these rocks back over the wall into the gardens of these offenders.

BeardyGit

skibum wrote: »

I know that I would rather hit a concrete block than hit the car that the blocks are preventing from parking there

Nice thread necro there Bandit197.


The blocks are usually put there to stop people parking somewhere they shouldn't - usually on the grass verge outside someone elses house. It's not a parking space, so why should provision be made for traffic to enter the space? And if you have to swerve OFF THE ROAD, damage to your tyres/rims etc should be the least of your concerns.

FFS lads, this isn't rocket science. If you want to take the approach that Run_to_da_hills has, we'd be pulling traffic lights, pedestrian barriers, road signs, street lights, trees and a whole host of other ****e off the footpath, just in case someone needs to leave the road to avoid hitting another car etc :rolleyes: Burst sumps? The least of your worries I should hope.

And I'll tell you something else, Astraboy - on Stephens Day I nearly wiped out a dog that ran out onto the road in front of me in Roundwood. Did I try to stop - You bet. But there's no way in hell I was going to swerve anywhere. If I couldn't stop, I couldn't stop, and that's all there was to it. If I'd swerved, mounted the footpath or otherwise, I would no longer have been fully in control of my car and could have done untold further damage....to oncoming traffic in the other lane if I'd skidded, pedestrians etc. If it was a child running out there, I might have done differently - I'm human after all. But I'd rather run over 10 dogs and a cat than risk injuring another person.

Just once, I'd like to come on here and have some of you jesters pay attention to what you're being told instead of reverting to the tired old 'high horse' chestnut.

bandit197

I think I may need to clarify what I meant in my original post, although I thought I had made it clear. I am not talking about areas with kerbs or footpaths, in fact i dont remember seeing these blocks in any of these areas. Mounting a footpath should be
the absolute last resort for any driver trying to avoid a collision. Im talking about our national roads with 100kph speed limits and no hard shoulder.
When planning permission is granted for houses in these areas it is on the condition that the boundary walls are kept back three or four metres from the road edge. It is also stated that this area must be filled with solid material. These clauses exist for a number of reasons,
1. To provide adequate visibility for any drivers turning onto the road from these properties.
2. To keep the area behind the road verge back as far as possible to improve visibility for road users. (the wider the road, the further you can see)
3. To provide an area for road users to stop in an emergency

However, some property owners totally block this area off with conc blocks or decorative blocks with chains linking them together and place them right out to the road edge. I am going to take some photos of these areas in the next few days and post them here to show exactly what I mean.

I believe that when any driver is faced with an emergency, be it an oncoming out of control vehicle, an accident or farm animals on the road ahead of them, or simply a problem with their own vehicle(blowout etc), he/she should be able to pull into this area safely.

I cannot understand the logic of blocking these areas to road users. We all need to use the roads as safely as possible. We need areas to pull in for various reasons. I cannot understand why someone would go out of their way to make things more dangerous.

My questions are,
1. Who actually owns this piece of land, property owner or council?
2. Is it legal to block it off?

AckwelFoley

It in most cases is their property so they can.

PogMoThoin

snyper wrote: »

It in most cases is their property so they can.

It may be their property, but the council states that this area must be filled with a solid material. I know of one person who was told remove chippings from his area, in fact the council removed them when he didn't.

fricatus

bandit197 wrote: »

I believe that when any driver is faced with an emergency, be it an oncoming out of control vehicle, an accident or farm animals on the road ahead of them, or simply a problem with their own vehicle(blowout etc), he/she should be able to pull into this area safely.

Hear hear. Please get off your high horses people. The best of us can need to pull over onto these areas in an emergency. You'll only know when it happens to you.

I was driving from Waterford to Dublin at dusk one March evening when I noticed a small, indistinct object lying on the road. I thought at first it was a dead animal, but I was on it, doing 90 kph, before I realised what it was: a blade off a farmer's plough (there's a subject for another thread...).

I hit it full on and it stopped my left front wheel dead. I only had the momentum of the car plus limited steering to get me up onto the verge, and thankfully it was one of these set-back areas, where the owner had not put concrete blocks. There was no hard shoulder, so had this area been blocked off, I'd have been sitting blocking one half of a busy 100 kph road.

mike65

There is a thread on this board from about two years back which outlines the dangers of rocks/blocks placed on a wide curved drive entrace. Someone lost thier sump almost instantly if I recall right.

Mike.

Alun

While we're on this subject, I'd like to reserve a special little corner of hell for the people who can't be @rsed to get the entrance to their driveways dished properly and then get someone to fill in the gap between the kerbstone and the road with a wedge of tarmac, in some cases sticking out a couple of feet into the actual carriageway. This could cause a car to flip over if you were forced to go tight into the kerb for whatever reason. Grrrrr.

BlackWizard

fricatus wrote: »

Hear hear. Please get off your high horses people. The best of us can need to pull over onto these areas in an emergency. You'll only know when it happens to you.

I agree too. It was the first thing I thought when I seen the replies to the OPs question.

BlackWizard

PogMoThoin wrote: »

It may be their property, but the council states that this area must be filled with a solid material. I know of one person who was told remove chippings from his area, in fact the council removed them when he didn't.

I heard of that too. The council are VERY picky with what happens around houses where the road is. I know a guy that had to redesign his entire home because he didn't take into account that there were restrictions on what he could build near the road, like a wall. It cost him a pretty penny, but at least it's a redesign and not a rebuild.

Can't say I've ever seen the concrete blocks on the side of roads. I remember a few granite like blocks with chains. They were in the garden though.

parsi

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

I have come across this along Threadneedle Road in Galway where people would park for the Salt Hill air show (:( Awh!!), Residents have placed large rocks on the grass verge out side their houses on public property.

I've often felt like doing that outside my own gaff when the match spectators come down and park on the verges. They don't seem to mind leaving them rutted even though its the residents who have to pay for their upkeep & repair.

JHMEG

Gil_Dub wrote:

Your car should stay on the road. Period.

kbannon wrote: »

If you need to swerve then you are not paying enough attention to your driving!

FFS:rolleyes:

What about the lad who is unsafely overtaking coming against you on your side of the road? It's happened to us all.

Leave the high horses outside please.

Run_to_da_hills

parsi wrote: »

I've often felt like doing that outside my own gaff when the match spectators come down and park on the verges. They don't seem to mind leaving them rutted even though its the residents who have to pay for their upkeep & repair.

Why don't you just fill it in with concrete

Vain

Seen it done outside a house on a country lane with room for only one car on the road.. Bit of a joke really.. I was actually thinking of going back that night and taken them all outa the way.. One of the blocks had half of it missing so guess some poor person took it off with the side of there car.. Didnt go back to move them tho dont want to be getting caught in the long hand of the law:eek:

meathstevie

Any object that could cause serious damage or injury should not be left at the side of the road unless there's a need for it being there ( ESB posts, traffic signs, crash barriers at schools, etc etc ). Someone constructing his/her own little anti-tank barrier should be disallowed. If you feel you need to cordon off your little patch of grass at the roadside there's proper stuff there to use as in the little plastic posts on a rubber bushing that'll give way in a collision. You could even use short lenghts of narrow diameter wavin pipe and stick them in the ground. In short, anything made of a relatively "soft" material that will easily give way or break in case of a collision or emergency.

Run_to_da_hills

Some of these embedded into the ground would be more attractive than concrete blocks and at least they can be seen.

Wishbone Ash

In my experience, it's not done to prevent parking but to prevent trucks/tractors from encroaching on a nice grass verge when they meet another large vehicle on a narrow road. A 30 tonne tipper will make shit of a nice lawn especially in winter.

littlejukka

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

In my experience, it's not done to prevent parking but to prevent trucks/tractors from encroaching on a nice grass verge when they meet another large vehicle on a narrow road. A 30 tonne tipper will make shit of a nice lawn especially in winter.

most places i've seen it it's 6 feet from a solid wall with nothing but gravel or tarmac in between. it's selfish and stupid, no excuse for it.

Wishbone Ash

littlejukka wrote: »

most places i've seen it it's 6 feet from a solid wall with nothing but gravel or tarmac in between. it's selfish and stupid, no excuse for it.

I'm not excusing it - just explaining it. But I take you point. It's really nerdy when there is nothing to damage.

There is a certain homeowner not too far from me. He lives next door to a commercial premises and doesn't like people using his entrance to turn so he placed loads of ugly scaffolding and traffic cones outside his entrance to block other drivers (and it blocks himself also). His whole entrance is like something from Bagdad. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face!

S.I.R

had this issue outside my house but ifi suspect any is going to park outsaide it i confront them , if they still dont move the car , im not going to watch as something may or may not happen to it.

astraboy

Gil_Dub wrote: »

Nice thread necro there Bandit197.


The blocks are usually put there to stop people parking somewhere they shouldn't - usually on the grass verge outside someone elses house. It's not a parking space, so why should provision be made for traffic to enter the space? And if you have to swerve OFF THE ROAD, damage to your tyres/rims etc should be the least of your concerns.

FFS lads, this isn't rocket science. If you want to take the approach that Run_to_da_hills has, we'd be pulling traffic lights, pedestrian barriers, road signs, street lights, trees and a whole host of other ****e off the footpath, just in case someone needs to leave the road to avoid hitting another car etc :rolleyes: Burst sumps? The least of your worries I should hope.

And I'll tell you something else, Astraboy - on Stephens Day I nearly wiped out a dog that ran out onto the road in front of me in Roundwood. Did I try to stop - You bet. But there's no way in hell I was going to swerve anywhere. If I couldn't stop, I couldn't stop, and that's all there was to it. If I'd swerved, mounted the footpath or otherwise, I would no longer have been fully in control of my car and could have done untold further damage....to oncoming traffic in the other lane if I'd skidded, pedestrians etc. If it was a child running out there, I might have done differently - I'm human after all. But I'd rather run over 10 dogs and a cat than risk injuring another person.

Just once, I'd like to come on here and have some of you jesters pay attention to what you're being told instead of reverting to the tired old 'high horse' chestnut.

First of all, traffic lights etc are normally in 50Kph zones, so the evaisive action necessary in an accident is less and the damage will also be far less if your unfortunate enough to hit one. He is talking about 80/100Kph roads. There is no excuse for this behavior other then pure selfishness.

As for braking for an animal, swerving for a child, I think all of us would do the same. But there are other reasons to swerve off the road, or even a need to pull over slightly/halt off a narrow backroad as a truck/tractor is approaching. I've had to do it many times near where I live. If everyone has obstacles outside their houses it would be extermely difficult, as well as dangerous to me and my car on dark evenings. Rows of concrete blocks don't light themselves up too well.

As for "the old high horse chestnut" I referred to it as its true. You were up on your bloody high horse living in some fantasy motoring land. I drive in the real world and realize one cannot predict what will happen around the next corner. The selfish acts of a few further reduce the margin for error on these roads and if you don't see the danger your the jester.

PogMoThoin

Spotted this myself on the Pontoon/Knockmore rd in Co. Mayo. Just imagine the damage you'd do if you were unfortunate enough to hit one. They hadn't even the decency to paint them a bright colour to protect the motorist. Photograph and shame them I say.

bbam

Ì know that for some time (~12 years) in Cavan it is required that this verge is required to be tar & chip or tarmac so the grass verge is not allowed.
My understanding is that this is considered part of the public highway, obstructing will leave the owner liable of any damage caused.

bandit197

PogMoThoin wrote: »

Spotted this myself on the Pontoon/Knockmore rd in Co. Mayo. Just imagine the damage you'd do if you were unfortunate enough to hit one. They hadn't even the decency to paint them a bright colour to protect the motorist. Photograph and shame them I say.

Nice pic Pog, Im with you on the name and shame. I spotted one myself today across from a SCHOOL:eek: I cant really think of a place that is more likely to have the odd driver taking evasive action, even with a reduced speed limit. I presume it was to stop parents parking there when dropping the kids off. Selfish w@%*er would prefer people to park on the road to let their kids out.
I didnt have time to get a photo today but Ill be back tomorrow and Ill get pics.

galwaytt

first of all, and to answer the OP's question - report it to council - both the planning office, the roads dept - and the safety officer.

That space is not legally allowed to be 'fenced' off in any manner - this is a condition on the planning permission. It doesn't make any difference if you 'own it or not' - the space is required to be left vacant.

If you do have to take evasive action, you are perfectly entitled to use the space, and if you suffer damage, etc, then you should sue the ass off the owner's..............

Seth Brundle

Out of curiosity:
1. have you seen the planning decision or what makes you confident that it mustn't be 'fenced off'?
2. is it fenced off or decorated?
3. what law requires it to be left vacant?

galwaytt

ooh, that's an easy one, built my first house and moved in in 1997, and just did it again in 2007. The condition attached to the planning permission states (off my head, btw.........), that a space 3m x 10m be provided adjoining the public road.......in the interests of traffic management..etc etc.

By fencing it off, you are not making the space available to traffic. By not making it available, you are in breach of your planning permission. In fact, if you were selling your house, and the blocks were there, you couldn't sell it either - the engineer couldn't legally give you a cert of compliance with planning permission.

That's without even looking at the fact that the objects used to 'fence' the space are not CE approved...........it's just a court case waiting to happen.

meathstevie

Don't care about planning. The owner of that place should get their gaffe dynamited..those yokes are fatalities waiting to happen. Too F8ckin mean to even buy a couple of reflective strips to put on those bloody rocks. There isn't even a clear defined boundery between the anti-tank fortifications and the road !!!

bandit197

I seen some good examples today

craichoe

If you have a problem with them, just call the council and inform them. They'll give the owner a period of time to remove them and if not they'll remove them for him

astraboy

Maybe its to stop Pikeys parking outside their house! Seriously though these are dangerous and need to be reported.

fabsoul

astraboy wrote: »

Seriously though these are dangerous and need to be reported.

+1

JHMEG

Jeez, you go to the trouble of building a castle, complete with turrets and towers, and then you go an ruin it with those yokes.

Altho 2 houses in the area with the same things.. someone has a little local industry making them.

bandit197 wrote: »

Omcd

Some property owners may be misinterpreting the requirement to fill the space with solid material to meaning fill it with solid rocks:D.

More seriously though, property owners with grass verges adjoining the roads may (I'm not totally sure) have an obligation from the council to maintain them, which could be difficult if they are contantly ploughed up by traffic and this may be the motivation for people to put out these obstructions - but maybe they should have a hard surface there instead.

Maybe loosly related, or maybe slightly off topic, but I find it irritating where property owners put a pair of white lights on their gate posts at the side of dark unlit roads - they are so easily confused with oncoming headlights and have nearly lead me astray on a number of occassions - if people really think they need to light up their gate posts so that they can find them, then they should be legally required to use amber lights or some other colour that cannot cause confusion to motorists.

mike65

This subject has just been raised by an e-mailer on Moncrieffs Newstalk show.

Mike.

Turbulent Bill

meathstevie wrote: »

Any object that could cause serious damage or injury should not be left at the side of the road unless there's a need for it being there ( ESB posts, traffic signs, crash barriers at schools, etc etc ). Someone constructing his/her own little anti-tank barrier should be disallowed. If you feel you need to cordon off your little patch of grass at the roadside there's proper stuff there to use as in the little plastic posts on a rubber bushing that'll give way in a collision. You could even use short lenghts of narrow diameter wavin pipe and stick them in the ground. In short, anything made of a relatively "soft" material that will easily give way or break in case of a collision or emergency.

+1

There shouldn't be a problem cordoning off your own land to stop people parking or using it as part of the road surface, but the barrier should be collapsable and well marked.

Snake Nose

bandit197 wrote: »

Im not sure if this is the right place for this thread but it is relevant. What is the story with people closing off the area between their garden walls and the edge of the road with concrete blocks. Sometimes they even have chains linking them up. I presume this is to put off people parking there but I think this action is very selfish. In an emergency you cannot swerve in this area to avoid a hazard. The issue is more severe for bikers who would almost certainly come off if they hit them. Does anyone know the laws regarding this. Correct me if Im wrong but I believe this area is council property, as it is set out as a condition in a granted planning permission application, to keep the garden walls of new houses back a certain distance from the road. Also, if I have to swerve in an emergency and I damage my car on these blocks, who is liable?

I have no idea what you're talking about, and I can't even picture it - pics??

mikemac

Snake Nose wrote: »

I have no idea what you're talking about, and I can't even picture it - pics??

Sigh :rolleyes:
Look at the pics in Post 36 on page two

Snake Nose

micmclo wrote: »

Sigh :rolleyes:
Look at the pics in Post 36 on page two

Ah okay - my apologies. No wonder I've never seen it - it seems to be exclusive to the countryside. I presume it's so people don't crash into their wall!

javaboy

Just use delineators that bend easily but are also likely to leave nice scratches in paintwork. Discourages casual use of your grass verge by cars/trucks but would not cause injury in the event of an accident.

CPG

Gil_Dub wrote: »

Your car should stay on the road. Period.

If you have to 'swerve', you're liable for causing damage to anything you impact with.

End of story.

You are a complete and utter $%^&$%&%$&$

gogs2006

when i moved into my current house i had some drainage work to finish..on the roadside we discovered the remains of a stone wall that had been covered with earth to form a small ditch...

i rang the local council and they knew nothing about it there was no evidence of it on plans..
nobody even came to view it:rolleyes::rolleyes:
unfortunately the machine driver clipped it and demolished it;);)

as a home owner i was'nt going to be responsible for obstructing the roadside.....

PogMoThoin

Got another pic 2day on my travels, this time in Ballintubber, Co. Mayo on a very fast piece of road. What really pisses me off is the fact that the county council probably tarmaced this area for these people. I'm convinced its a form of greed for land, like what saw in The Field........every inch is precious.......Ignorant Fcukers

fricatus

bandit197 wrote: »

I seen some good examples today

Hahahahaaaa! Did you ever see anything more pathetic? Typical bloody Irish, building a big castle and huffily not allowing anyone to drive - even momentarily - on the tarmac in front. A good kick in the a55 is what they need. And we think the English are bad for that sort of thing.

I live in a tiny house but in a very nice - though crowded - area of Waterford city. Anyone at all can park outside my house, and believe me they do. I can't understand this "The Field" mentality that people in the country have. If you don't want people pulling over onto "your land" then don't build a big house in the country! Anyway who cares? It's not like they're parking along your driveway, is it?

Back on page 1 I described my accident. Thankfully the house owner on whose land I ended up didn't have those bollards in place, but if they did, I'd have had no idea they were illegal. Thank you OP for raising this. If I have occasion to swerve onto a verge like that again, and I hit bollards, I will be straight on to my solicitor!