Seeding the Munster SFC

K-9

What do you think of the seeding of Cork and Kerry in the Munster SFC. They will now not meet each other until the Final.

Limerick have withdrawn 5 players from the Inter-Provincial panel in protest.

Will it make any difference to the weaker counties in Munster or is it a bad move?

An Citeog

Maybe they should just bite the bullet and only have a Munster final! The Munster championship is in a very poor state and the teams around Cork and Kerry seem to be getting worse. This chances of any other county making the final are now a hell of a lot slimmer and that's certainly not a good thing for Munster football as a whole. No team should be seeded in any of the provincial championships (maybe with the exception of the defending champions). Bad decision in my eyes.

blackbelt

Maybe the Munster Council have been spying on us and are plotting our doom.

In all seriousness,I think the prospect of an open drawer is what Munster needed instead.Hell,they could even have had Cork meet Kerry in the first round and give Limerick a crap of the whip for once.

cruiserweight

blackbelt wrote: »

give Limerick a crap of the whip for once.

I think it is the crap that they are sick of

I can see both sides of the arguement here. But I think one of the problems in Munster is that with there are fewer teams than other provinces there will be an inevitable final. In Leinster where four teams are seeded, it is less predictable, seeding has been based on who made the semi finals the previous years. Using this system teams like Meath and Louth who did well in the qualifiers will not be seeded because they did not do well in the Leinster Championship. Offaly will be seeded though, due to the luck of last years draw. Lets hope them and Wexford are the seeds in the same side of the draw

aidan24326

It's a straight two fingers to the weaker counties in Munster. Why did they need to bring seeding back? Cork and Kerry are going to win Munster between them 95% of the time anyway, there was no need to make this change other than to ensure that we get a Cork-Kerry Munster final every year (i.e all of the time rather than almost all). Am I the only one getting just a little bit bored of Cork v Kerry games? It's a bit like Celtic v Rangers, becoming diluted by too many meetings, and even a Munster final lacks the cutting edge of old now that both teams are guaranteed to progress anyway.

Seeing the likes of Limerick and Tipp getting a shot at it at least introduced a novelty factor. You feel Limerick missed a golden chance though. Now we're back to Cork/Kerry dominance all the way. The Munster football championship is now largely a waste of time, though to be fair it was heading that way anyway, this change only exasperates the problem. The Limerick dual players will be sticking to the hurling that's for sure.

Green Giant

With Cork and Kerry getting an easy passage to the provincial final in comparison to those in the other provinces, it also boosts their chances of going far in the All-Ireland as they have only had one 'big' game while the likes of Dublin, Tyrone and Mayo could have had at least two or three, so it is quite controversial in that case.

While I would hate to see a Cork-Kerry final every year in Munster, the smaller counties down south will still have to face either of the two or, in a rather less likely circumstance, the team that beat one of the top two. To be the best, you must beat the best.

yahoo_moe

aidan24326 wrote: »

there was no need to make this change other than to ensure that we get a Cork-Kerry Munster final every year

that's exactly why they've done it, though, which will make the MFC very manufactured - they're basically trying to prevent a similar situation to this year's Connacht final where you've got an underdog against an established power... under the old system, chances are Limerick/Tipp would have had to beat at least one of Cork/Kerry anyway to win Munster but with this seeding, it just makes sure that that'll happen in a semi rather than in the final so they'll probably have to beat both - which is a bit of a shame really

anyone else think the provincial championships (bar Munster hurling and possibly Ulster football) are quickly losing relevance?

An Citeog

yahoo_moe wrote: »

anyone else think the provincial championships (bar Munster hurling and possibly Ulster football) are quickly losing relevance?

Definitely! And even at that, the Munster hurling and Ulster football championships seem to be quickly losing relevance. The reason is simple though, it's down to the back-door system.

Flukey

After the final whistle of this year's Connacht final, if you asked the winners if they thought it has lost its relevance, you'd know what answer you'd get. The same could be said for Westmeath and Laois in Leinster in 2003 and 2004 and Kildare back in 1998. The various provincial championships are not all level, but they are all relevant. They are only looked on as being irrelevant if a big power wins. If Limerick won the Munster Football Championship next year, do you think they'd regard it as irrelevant? Waterford's first Munster Hurling Championship win since the 1963 a few year ago meant an awful lot to them. Offaly's first ever Leinster Hurling title in 1980 was a major triumph. Clare's Munster Football title in 1992 and their Munster Hurling title in 1995 are two more of many examples where a provincial title was deemed to be extremely relevant. Many of those victories were greeted with as much delight as winning an All-Ireland.

All over the country there are lots of counties that can aim for a provincial title realistically, even if an All-Ireland is unrealistic. A provincial title can give them the confidence to build and go on for a go at an All-Ireland. After their first Leinster in 1980, Offaly won the All-Ireland in 1981. They've won 3 more since, and since that 1980 breakthrough, they have spent most of that time at or near the top table of Hurling. One of the nice things about the provincial championships is that at the end of the overall championship in September, there is more than one county with some trophy to show for it. Scrap the provincial championships and all the counties would have to aim for, would be Sam or Liam. That would rob many counties of something they can now realistically aim for.

In relation to the Munster issue in particular, it should most certainly be an open draw. The same should go for each of the other provinces. As my previous paragraphs explain, I don't think we should get rid of the provincial championships altogether in favour of a national open draw, but each province should definitely have one.

KevIRL

And the crazy thing about it is the only county to vote for this proposal apart from Cork and Kerry was WATERFORD! Just as we were starting to get our act together, with a more favorable draw this year me may even have made a Munster Final, little hope of that ever happening now

Sometimes turkeys do vote for Christmas

aidan24326

KevIRL wrote: »

And the crazy thing about it is the only county to vote for this proposal apart from Cork and Kerry was WATERFORD! Just as we were starting to get our act together, with a more favorable draw this year me may even have made a Munster Final, little hope of that ever happening now

Sometimes turkeys do vote for Christmas

Yeah that is baffling that Waterford would vote for a seeded system. The mind boggles. Personally I don't think there should be a seeding system in any province, everyone should start equal. The Kerry chairman welcomed the move, there's a surprise.

Flukey makes a good point about retaining the provincial championships, I think they still have some merit in football but in the hurling they're now completely irrelevant, even the Munster championship isn't what it used to be and Leinster is a dead duck. The hurling championship doesn't really start now til the quarter finals.

Daysha

If anyone bought todays Tribune, theres an article by the chairman of the Munster Council explaining the reasoning behind it.

Dapos

deise59 wrote: »

If anyone bought todays Tribune, theres an article by the chairman of the Munster Council explaining the reasoning behind it.

Wat did he say? money reasons? I can see why limerick, clare etc are so pissed with this seeding system. but i also think that if a team want to win a provinical final they shoul dbe prepared to face the best teams ie both kerry and cork. I personally would prefer an open draw with the provinal winners giving the shorter route to thf final, i.e. 2 games semi- and final. This way we could possibly have kerry and cork playing in the first game and limerick, clare, waterford and tipp battle away for a place in the final. there would also be a good chance every year of cork and kerry meeting in the final anyway with this system. Of course a major problem with this is that there could be a seriously one sided munster final.

I was at the munster final this year and i thought it was a great match and occasion. I can see why people may get bored with cork v kerry games but i don't, thats what rivalry is all about.

grenache

I am absolutely seething at this disgraceful decision by the Munster Council. They are single handedly trying to destroy football in the province's weaker counties. Cork and Kerry do not need to be seeded at all; before 1991 they carved up Munster between them. And with this ridiculous return to the old system, you can be sure the days of Limerick, Tipperary or Clare reaching the final, are numbered. I know a few of the Limerick players personally and they feel totally betrayed by the Munster Council, and rightly so. Had Limerick made the breakthrough in 03 or 04 then i doubt this seeding system would have been introduced.

I have written to each of the three county boards who voted against the seeding proposals, urging them to boycott next years Munster championship. Its the least Cork and Kerry deserve!