Age: to tell or not to tell?

Songmeister

I know this has been posted before and I searched and found a few threads but they didn't really answer my question.
I am a 34 year old recent IT graduate (finished up last April) who worked in construction before returning to education.However I have been finding it almost impossible to get employment.

My problem is two-fold: I don't want to move to Dublin (where it seems at least fifty percent of IT jobs are) and I believe my age is putting off a lot of employers.
I know by law that all employers have to be "equal opportunities" but nobody really believes that do they?
I have placed my date of birth on all the CV's I have sent in but on one of the threads I found on the search somebody said you should never put it on your CV.
I have mixed feelings on this as if you don't put it down eyebrows will be raised. They can't ask you in an interview why it isn't there of course but I am sure interviewers will be wondering at the same time.
I look younger than I am and if I put down my dob as some time in 1980-'82 I'd probably get away with it but I hate lying.
However at the same time I desperately want to get a job so I feel I can't win.
The alternative to lying is just to not mention it. If I don't mention it in my CV/interview and get the job they can hardly fire me for not telling my age.
It's still going to look a bit weird on a CV if it isn't there.

prendy

whatever about not tellin them-dont put down the wrong DOB anyway...if you get the job they'l find out anyeway and that wont look very good!!!!
just omit it from CV and if they ask you in the interview so be it!

Songmeister

prendy wrote:

whatever about not tellin them-dont put down the wrong DOB anyway...if you get the job they'l find out anyeway and that wont look very good!!!!
just omit it from CV and if they ask you in the interview so be it!

It's against the law to do that isn't it?

juke

They can ask - but you don't have to answer. Just point out that you believe you don't have to answer that question. In theory, would be very dangerous from a litigation point of view for them to pursue it, as the equality legislation prevents discrimination on grounds og age. In reality....

I see CV's regularly in my work - and they rarely have a dob

God, is 34 old in the IT world?

prendy

It's against the law to do that isn't it?

its not against the law...their perfectly entitled to know what age a person is.
whats against the law is discriminating on these grounds.

Songmeister

prendy wrote:

its not against the law...their perfectly entitled to know what age a person is.
whats against the law is discriminating on these grounds.

Proof that the law is an ass so. How on earth is someone supposed to be able to prove they didn't get a job on the grounds of age discrimination unless he/she is a mind-reader?
Anyway my mind is made up, I am not going to put in the CV anymore from now on.
I d'loaded the CV templates from the sticky and one of them said:
"You should not include your date of birth if you feel that it is irrelevant or might prejudice your chances of being interviewed"
I haven't been able to get a job/interview when I put down my age so if I leave it out then I can't do any worse.
Edit: if they ask me in the interview why I didn't put it down I'll just tell the truth and say it's because I think it prejudiced my chances of being interviewed.

um7y1h83ge06nx

My CV never contains my DOB, I see it as a waste of good space that could be filled with more relevant information.

RosieJoe

prendy wrote:

its not against the law...their perfectly entitled to know what age a person is.
whats against the law is discriminating on these grounds.

I used to do interviews in the last place I worked in and I was told I was not allowed to ask:
The persons age, religion, ethnic background, sexuality, beliefs ...

This is basically because you may be disciminated against any of the above!

AARRRGH

I really doubt age is the problem here.

The company I work in (IT), the average age would be mid-30's, and there's about 40 of us in the company.

Are you looking for realistic wages for your first job? This would be less than 28k.

Songmeister

dublindude wrote:

I really doubt age is the problem here.

The company I work in (IT), the average age would be mid-30's, and there's about 40 of us in the company.

Are you looking for realistic wages for your first job? This would be less than 28k.

In any interview I've never asked for more than 25k. They were all outside Dublin too.

AARRRGH

Songmeister wrote:

In any interview I've never asked for more than 25k. They were all outside Dublin too.

OK. Well you're still a graduate, and graduates can have difficulty finding jobs. I wouldn't start taking it personally (it's my age, etc.) as that'll just slowly make you an angry person

Certainly I think if you were in Dublin you'd have a job no problem.

Could you even start in something like Technical Support just to get some experience while you continue looking for a better job?

Raskolnikov

Songmeister wrote:

I don't want to move to Dublin (where it seems at least fifty percent of IT jobs are) and I believe my age is putting off a lot of employers.

The first issue you've raised is your problem. I know a chap about the same age as you that has just graduated and got thebest job in his graduating class.

He got it in Dublin of course

bigjohnny80

Absolutley entitled to ask you your age

I would not get hung up on it and concentrate on what else it is holding you back, could be a hundred different reasons

cazzy

34 is hardly old .... i know someone who lied about their age on a job application - he was fired when they found out he lied. (It was in the late 90's - we assumed they found out from his tax info but not too sure) It was a financial institution that fired him. He lied cause he was in his early 30's, looked much younger and reckoned he woudlnt get a job if they knew his age as it was a low paid starting job usually filled by recent grads/school leavers.

Dudess

God, we live in such an ageist society, people are actually led to believe that anything above 30 is going to be discriminated against. It's sickening.
OP, I seriously, seriously, SERIOUSLY doubt your age is going against you. You're 31 (maybe more) years below retirement age, in the prime of your life. I mean, really. And the same with cazzy's mate - thinking a financial institution wouldn't give him a job because he's in his early 30s!!! I bet that guy (about 40 now?) realises the ludicrousness of that mind-set. But it's not his fault, nor yours OP. As I said, society is so ageist, we're led to BELIEVE that anything over 30 is old. But we should stand up to it instead of being all passive and accepting - that's only gonna compound the problem.

nesf

You're only 34, it shouldn't count against you in the interview at all. If anything you could play the extra maturity card over your twenty-something colleagues.

You were in construction, got out of it and went back to education and got a qualification in IT, that combined with your age just screams that you're serious and committed to making it in your new field, to me anyway.

leeroybrown

The only situation where I could see age counting against someone who is 34 is where a company want someone 'inexperienced (young) and enthusiastic' to mould to their corporate image. Other than that I reckon that most companies would see maturity and experience in a different area as a positive.

Dudess

And I would refer to 44 as mature, not 34. But yeah, some companies may want really, really young people as they're considered more malleable.

stovelid

I work in IT and being 34 would absolutely have no bearing on interviews. At least 60% of my office is in the 30 - 40+ bracket.


Are you applying for jobs you may not have enough experience for?

Grads take longer to find jobs, that's all. Factor in that you don't want a job in Dublin and it may take a while.

Stick with it!

Songmeister

dublindude wrote: »

OK. Well you're still a graduate, and graduates can have difficulty finding jobs. I wouldn't start taking it personally (it's my age, etc.) as that'll just slowly make you an angry person

I'm already there I'm afraid!

dublindude wrote: »

Certainly I think if you were in Dublin you'd have a job no problem.

Could you even start in something like Technical Support just to get some experience while you continue looking for a better job?

Yeah but most of those jobs pay only 20k at the most. Someone in their early twenties would be delighted with that for their first job but I'm not thinking in terms of a "first" job, I don't want to flit around from job to job and place to place at this stage of my life.
Also, it's OK to say "I'll do tech support for a while until something better turns up."
I know a lot of guys who have said that and years later are still in the same job.

nesf wrote:

You're only 34, it shouldn't count against you in the interview at all. If anything you could play the extra maturity card over your twenty-something colleagues.

Tried it, didn't work.

nesf wrote:

You were in construction, got out of it and went back to education and got a qualification in IT, that combined with your age just screams that you're serious and committed to making it in your new field, to me anyway.

I would have thought so too but it hasn't been any help.

I tried to change my CV to disguise my age but it's no good as other parts of it give away my age anyway (like when I did my Leaving Cert for example).
I am six months on the dole now and getting fairly pissed off. I'm going to the careers fair next Tuesday so maybe something will come up there. Here's hoping anyway.:(

AARRRGH

Songmeister wrote: »

I'm not thinking in terms of a "first" job, I don't want to flit around from job to job and place to place at this stage of my life.

The problem isn't your age, it's that you feel you aren't at the bottom of the ladder again...

Can I ask what county you're in?

Which area of IT would you like to work in?

Dudess

Songmeister wrote:

Also, it's OK to say "I'll do tech support for a while until something better turns up."
I know a lot of guys who have said that and years later are still in the same job.

Nonsense. They could get out of there if they were bothered. Do they have your qualifications? If they do, they're probably in a nice little rut that's too difficult to dig themselves out of.
I don't see why you should not get a job in tech support but all the while keep applying for the position you want. At least you'll be working, getting out of the house - that has to be better than being on the dole. The longer you stay on the dole anyway, the more difficult it will be to go back working - even though you really want a job. Plus, working in tech support will be an extra for your CV. Isn't it far better than having nothing on your CV? Actually, there's a thing: maybe you're finding it hard to get a job because you don't have any work experience. I know, I know, how can you get experience when you can't get a job etc, but a big blank nothing on your CV certainly won't help. Just because you're qualified, nobody OWES you a job. You really just have to take what you can get for the time being, but keep on applying for the position you want.
Some people come out of law training and can't get an apprenticeship, so they work in a bank or whatever - anything to be out there and working. After a while, with perseverence, their apprenticeship comes up.
I did journalism at college and a journalistic qualification alone isn't enough, you have to have work experience too, which means freelance. Therefore I have to do a lot of hanging around for the bits and pieces of freelance that get thrown my way. Thankfully I have a call centre job with very flexible hours which accommodates the freelance work. But the money's dreadful and there's very little security. I would give anything to go off and get a Monday to Friday job in an insurance company, but if I want to get that journalistic/media job, it just isn't an option. Bottom line is I have to be available for freelance so that I'll have work experience on my CV. It's not the kind of profession where I can just work anywhere until something comes up. Yours very much is, and I'm amazed you're hanging around on the dole for the exact position you want - it's not as if you HAVE to hang around, whereas I do, and it can be absolutely miserable. You're wasting money and your life.
So get that tech support job asap.

Songmeister

dublindude wrote: »

The problem isn't your age, it's that you feel you aren't at the bottom of the ladder again...

Can I ask what county you're in?

Cork.

dublindude wrote: »

Which area of IT would you like to work in?

Web development or some kind of hardware repair would be OK too.
We dev. is hard to get into as you need a "portfolio of URL's" that you've worked on and I don't have that. I am putting a site together with that purpose but I have to learn new stuff as I'm doing it which takes time.

Dudess wrote:

I don't see why you should not get a job in tech support but all the while keep applying for the position you want. At least you'll be working, getting out of the house - that has to be better than being on the dole. The longer you stay on the dole anyway, the more difficult it will be to go back working - even though you really want a job. Plus, working in tech support will be an extra for your CV. Isn't it far better than having nothing on your CV? Actually, there's a thing: maybe you're finding it hard to get a job because you don't have any work experience. I know, I know, how can you get experience when you can't get a job etc, but a big blank nothing on your CV certainly won't help. Just because you're qualified, nobody OWES you a job. You really just have to take what you can get for the time being, but keep on applying for the position you want.

I know that. I don't expect a job to walk in the door to me just because I have a degree.

Dudess wrote:

Some people come out of law training and can't get an apprenticeship, so they work in a bank or whatever - anything to be out there and working. After a while, with perseverence, their apprenticeship comes up.
I did journalism at college and a journalistic qualification alone isn't enough, you have to have work experience too, which means freelance. Therefore I have to do a lot of hanging around for the bits and pieces of freelance that get thrown my way. Thankfully I have a call centre job with very flexible hours which accommodates the freelance work. But the money's dreadful and there's very little security. I would give anything to go off and get a Monday to Friday job in an insurance company, but if I want to get that journalistic/media job, it just isn't an option. Bottom line is I have to be available for freelance so that I'll have work experience on my CV. It's not the kind of profession where I can just work anywhere until something comes up. Yours very much is, and I'm amazed you're hanging around on the dole for the exact position you want - it's not as if you HAVE to hang around, whereas I do, and it can be absolutely miserable. You're wasting money and your life.So get that tech support job asap.

I'm not hanging around, I look at every single job site every day. I'm not waiting for the exact position I want, in fact I've applied for some really ****ty jobs and I didn't get them either. For instance I applied for one tech support job that paid 18k but I didn't get it as it involved Windows Server and a few other things I didn't have. Getting tech support jobs is not easy either as sometimes if they see you have a degree they won't hire you as they know you are only going to stay until something better comes along.
Also, a lot of tech support jobs require a second language (which I don't have).
You made some good pints in your post though, I'll take them on board.

run_Forrest_run

are you dead set on web dev jobs? Because there are countless other dev jobs that are not purely web dev (desktop application dev for example).

AARRRGH

Would it be worth your while doing some cheapo work for people via http://www.scriptlance.com just to get references and some real world experience?

There are tons of projects there which you could do. Personally I use scriptlance as a "webmaster" (not a programmer) and I wouldn't mind if someone wanted to use me as a reference or whatever.

Songmeister

run_Forrest_run wrote: »

are you dead set on web dev jobs? Because there are countless other dev jobs that are not purely web dev (desktop application dev for example).

I haven't got my heart set on anything at this stage, it's just that if I had a choice that's what I would do.

dublindude wrote:

Would it be worth your while doing some cheapo work for people via http://www.scriptlance.com just to get references and some real world experience?

There are tons of projects there which you could do. Personally I use scriptlance as a "webmaster" (not a programmer) and I wouldn't mind if someone wanted to use me as a reference or whatever.

Thanks for that link, is it more for experienced developers than graduates who know jack **** (like me) though?

AARRRGH

Songmeister wrote: »

Thanks for that link, is it more for experienced developers than graduates who know jack **** (like me) though?

Nope. There's some large jobs and there's loads of little jobs. For example, changing a website layout, fixing a PHP script, that kind of thing.

If you bid cheaply, send a nice PM to the person who posted the project (showing you read their description, you communicate well, and you are able to do the job) you'll have a good chance of getting selected for many projects.

It can only benefit you I reckon...

Songmeister

dublindude wrote: »

Nope. There's some large jobs and there's loads of little jobs. For example, changing a website layout, fixing a PHP script, that kind of thing.

If you bid cheaply, send a nice PM to the person who posted the project (showing you read their description, you communicate well, and you are able to do the job) you'll have a good chance of getting selected for many projects.

It can only benefit you I reckon...

I'll keep an eye on that site so, thanks. I've an interview for a tech support job next week, dunno if I really want to get it tho', depends what they are like in the interview.

parsi

RosieJoe wrote: »

I used to do interviews in the last place I worked in and I was told I was not allowed to ask:
The persons age, religion, ethnic background, sexuality, beliefs ...

This is basically because you may be disciminated against any of the above!

Hmm. And how did you deal with potential gender discrimination ? Close your eyes and get the candidate to talk through a voice distorter ?

neil_hosey

Thats rediculous! I just finished college there in June and was looking for a job for 2 months. I applied for a few places but i noticed a few of them mentioned something like " please DO NOT have your Date of Birth on your CV as we are an equal opportunity employer" I thought this was great.

I was a bit paranoid about where i was from when i was getting a job. But now realise it is stupid. From what my job counsilor told me in college.

More than likely the interviewer will try their best to avoid asking any questions that discriminates against the candidate. Dont put it on the CV, and dont worry about it IMO.

I know in all my interviews, i was never aasked for a date of birth or where i was from. They just wont do it (in most cases )

And any newly trained interviewers will DEFINATELY trry and avoid then types of questions and stick to the script.

jimmycrackcorm

The op's problem is being a graduate nothing more, nothing less. We don't take on graduates for example.

neil_hosey

The OP's problem (IMO) is that is age will hinder him in any job applications. Nothing got to do about being a graduate! Theres plenty of grad jobs out there in IT. I got one!

AARRRGH

But 34 isn't old!!

um7y1h83ge06nx

dublindude wrote: »

But 34 isn't old!!

Exactly. No-one has asked me what my age is in the interview (why would they do that) and I haven't got my date of birth on my CV.

Going a little off-topic but an interesting story anyway. Was talking to my girlfriend about CVs, she's a primary teacher. Anyway her mother, also a teacher was saying that when she was young the amount of personal details expected in a job application was hilarious.

For instance people would write on their cover letters that they were moving into the area and looking for a job in the school as they were getting married to such and such a fella from the area. That way they were more likely to stay in that school!

Even now, they are advised to put their DOB on their CV. Those Mary I and St. Pat's crowd are strange.

Dudess

neil_hosey wrote: »

The OP's problem (IMO) is that is age will hinder him in any job applications. Nothing got to do about being a graduate! Theres plenty of grad jobs out there in IT. I got one!

Yes, and the point being made is that it's hardly his age. He's 34, the prime of his life.

Piper Tasteless Tundra wrote: »

Those Mary I and St. Pat's crowd are strange.

Very forward-thinking and unconventional all right! My mate graduated from Mary I in 2003 - she said it was like a convent.

Songmeister

Well I took your advice and applied for a tech support position (with Apple in Cork) and didn't get it.
It wasn't anything to do with my age, which is even more disheartening.I didn't even get to do the interview as I went there for an "interview" (that's what I was told over the 'phone) but when I got there they asked me to fill in a sheet with a list of technical questions (on Apple products and general tech support).
The results of it would determine whether I was to be interviewed or not. I must admit I hate Apple Macs with a passion but I still got at least half of them right (I think).
However when they corrected it they told me I hadn't passed so that was that.
I didn't really want to get it but I am now beginning is there any point going for interviews when I can't get a job that I am over-qualified for? (The minimum education required was Leaving Cert).
In retrospect I should have just said "No thanks" when they told me I had to do a technical test after I went there on the understanding that I was going for an interview but I am desperate so I didn't.
I don't know what to do now, it's not looking good for me.

themole

Songmeister wrote: »

In retrospect I should have just said "No thanks" when they told me I had to do a technical test after I went there on the understanding that I was going for an interview but I am desperate so I didn't.
I don't know what to do now, it's not looking good for me.

Lots of companies will require a technical interview at some stage, although most will not do this in the form of a test.

It seems to me that your problem is lack of experience. Did you do work experience through your course? If not some form of internship might be worth a look at.

Dudess

OP, if you're happy to move to Cork, why not try EMC? Located seven or eight miles outside Cork city centre, just past Ballincollig. They're also in Shannon. http://www.emc.com/hr/

Songmeister

themole wrote: »

Lots of companies will require a technical interview at some stage, although most will not do this in the form of a test.

It seems to me that your problem is lack of experience. Did you do work experience through your course? If not some form of internship might be worth a look at.

Yeah I did 6 months work experience with a very reputable multinational. Thought it would be a help when looking for a full-time job but it hasn't made any difference whatsoever.

Dudess wrote:

OP, if you're happy to move to Cork, why not try EMC? Located seven or eight miles outside Cork city centre, just past Ballincollig. They're also in Shannon. http://www.emc.com/hr/

I have applied there more than once but never even got a reply.

nesf

Songmeister wrote: »

In retrospect I should have just said "No thanks" when they told me I had to do a technical test after I went there on the understanding that I was going for an interview but I am desperate so I didn't.
I don't know what to do now, it's not looking good for me.

Well, it's understandable that they'd want to hire people with some degree of technical knowledge about the product they'd be doing tech support on.

Songmeister

nesf wrote: »

Well, it's understandable that they'd want to hire people with some degree of technical knowledge about the product they'd be doing tech support on.

True but I was told I was going for an interview, not a technical examination.
If I'd known that I would have revised before it.

Dudess

Hmmm. I can understand your frustration all right. Just wondering: are you being pro-active enough? I mean, do you send an application online and leave it at that, or do you ring HR directly, or department managers? Sometimes I wouldn't even bother with HR.
What about doing that (if you haven't already). And even calling in to places that are convenient to where you live.
I also don't trust job websites. Any applications I've sent via them have been fruitless. And I've always met the criteria. So when one of the companies advertised a second time, I actually called into them and got the job.

Songmeister

Dudess wrote: »

Hmmm. I can understand your frustration all right. Just wondering: are you being pro-active enough? I mean, do you send an application online and leave it at that, or do you ring HR directly, or department managers?

When I first started applying for jobs I rang them up to ask if they got my application. Usually what happens is the person takes my number and says "I'll get him/her to get back to you" but of course they never do.
I got sick of that so since then I usually email them back to ask them did they get my application. Some reply, some don't.
I've become used to the breath-taking arrogance and ignorance of HR departments.

Dudess wrote: »

What about doing that (if you haven't already).

Not sure if there is much more I can do

Dudess wrote: »

And even calling in to places that are convenient to where you live.

Calling in person is wasting time I don't have.

Dudess wrote: »

I also don't trust job websites. Any applications I've sent via them have been fruitless. And I've always met the criteria. So when one of the companies advertised a second time, I actually called into them and got the job.

I don't trust them either. That's interesting about calling in person and getting the job, although I'd be afraid they will think I'm some kind of a nutter if I do that.

Edit:It's OK to say "Do this, do that, blah blah" but when you bang on a door for so long you get dis-heartened after a while and just can't be bothered. Also I am convinced that when they see "Worked in construction for 9 years" on a CV they immediately bin it. Equal opportunities my arse.

Dudess

Songmeister wrote: »

I've become used to the breath-taking arrogance and ignorance of HR departments.

Couldn't agree more. Over the past year I have applied to SO many places and there is often a major lack of communication between HR and individual departments. So why not whittle things down and try to contact the department manager? HR departments often aren't even aware of e.g. temporary vacancies. And sometimes positions aren't advertised, so if a particular company springs to mind, why not ring them on spec.

That's interesting about calling in person and getting the job, although I'd be afraid they will think I'm some kind of a nutter if I do that.

Why on earth would they?! I really don't think they would. In fact I think it would come across as quite positive - the fact that you have the initiative to take it a couple of steps further. And it shows major enthusiasm. Desperation? Well it depends on how you broach it. But if there's a job going, there's a job going, so it's not like it would be completely random. Although I once called into an insurance company completely on spec and I asked the receptionist if she knew of any work going. She said she'd call someone from HR, I said only if it wasn't too much trouble (no harm in politeness) and the girl who came out practically fell over herself to chat to me. It didn't go any further as I was looking for part-time and they only had full-time, but I definitely got positive vibes from her. There were loads of jobs going and they weren't even advertised on the website. So always look a bit deeper. Don't take anything as gospel.

It's OK to say "Do this, do that, blah blah" but when you bang on a door for so long you get dis-heartened after a while and just can't be bothered.

Tell me about it. Remember I was saying to you I do freelance radio journalism? I just had a look at when I posted that - it was late last Thursday night. By Saturday afternoon I had made up my mind to give up. I was working an awful job in a call centre for three hours a day (purely because this was the only job I could find with enough flexibility) and taking whatever scraps of freelance were offered to me - I actually felt on a par with a dog being thrown a few miserable bones now and again. A year of non-stop waiting around and rejection had me absolutely broken. It's really not good for one's sense of self-worth. I was just drifting and putting my life on hold. So I am now seeking admin work - anything to keep me going and give my life some sort of structure. And if a media job comes up I'll go for it, if it doesn't, well it's not meant to be. I've done one interview for an admin position - went well. Absolutely delighted. No regrets whatsoever. A bit disappointed the journalism thing didn't work out after doing a very tough masters in it, but sod it, I'd prefer to keep my sanity and be contented than any more of that soul-destroying freelance ****e. Plus, I was only focusing on radio (never planned to do print - worked in a newspaper for four years and I'm not cut out for the toughness of it) but I've decided to cast the net wider - so I'm gonna look into communications/marketing type jobs, and news websites. And if I end up in an insurance company or whatever, I'll try and write articles on the side.
But yes, I understand 100% the frustration - it's heartbreaking. I was actually feeling really angry and... bitter to be honest about it last Friday night. A few drinks made me feel better but by Saturday morning I was feeling worse than ever so I decided to do myself a favour. Can't tell you the relief.
However, there are far more jobs in your field than there are in journalism - But I'm not trying to trivialise your experience and I know that this is probably one of the most infuriating factors - all these jobs... so why can't you get one? You're considering the tech support thing, what about casting the net even wider? Would you be able to do web design? Software engineering? (Sorry if I'm way off - I'm just assuming these are things that are connected with I.T.) What about companies/organisations like banks, universities, local authorities? I know you're seriously fed-up and worn-out from it but you're holding yourself back a bit - e.g. saying you wouldn't call into a place directly. And feeling that you just can't be bothered any more due to the frustration - perfectly understandable but then what do you do?

Also I am convinced that when they see "Worked in construction for 9 years" on a CV they immediately bin it. Equal opportunities my arse.

Don't know whether that's true but maybe put a note on your CV. At the moment, while I'm applying for admin jobs, I have to explain my change in direction, so that's what I've done.
Maybe put something in like: "For nine years I worked in construction, which helped me gain skills in x, y, z (also put in details of any promotions, specific achievements). Then I decided I would like to change career direction." It may not seem much but it kind of "bridges the gap".
Also, did you do a work placement on your I.T. course? Have you any bits of relevant work experience at all? If you have, it's likely you've mentioned them on your CV, but just in case...

azezil

I spent 4 years trying for IT jobs outside of the Pale, its just a waste of time I couldn't even get the most remedial of jobs, came to Dublin 4.5 years ago and walked into them with minimal effort, in fact, any of the jobs I've gotten were offered to me purely based on my CV.

AARRRGH

Dudess wrote: »

I also don't trust job websites.

I think that's a pretty big statement, but I know what you mean.

There are certainly plenty of bogus jobs on the job websites. Certainly the agency ones anyway.

I work in recruitment somewhat, and the best thing to do if you see a job you like is to apply for it via the job website, and follow up your job application with a telephone call one or two days later...

With company (not agency) jobs you can be pretty sure they're real.

AARRRGH

Songmeister wrote: »

I've become used to the breath-taking arrogance and ignorance of HR departments.

Their arrogance is often surpassed by their laziness...

Songmeister

azezil wrote: »

I spent 4 years trying for IT jobs outside of the Pale, its just a waste of time I couldn't even get the most remedial of jobs, came to Dublin 4.5 years ago and walked into them with minimal effort, in fact, any of the jobs I've gotten were offered to me purely based on my CV.

It must be ****-hot so!You are not wrong though, a guy in my year had a fairly poorly put together CV (in my opinion) but he got offered two jobs in Dublin (after an interview admittedly). He also had a 1:1 which was a help no doubt.

Dudess

OP, Siemens in Cork has a load of vacancies. Have a look at www.siemens.ie