Can i be done if

danger mouse

Ok say if a Garda drives up to me and im standing outside my car with the keys in my pocket and the door locked and says he's doing me for not having tax (out by a day) NCT or L plates...Can i be done even though im not even driving the car or had no intention too..He also wanted to do me for drunk in charge of a vehicle even tho the keys were in my pocket and the car door locked, i passed the breathalyzer anyway. were do i stand?

d22ontour

It's hardly his fault you misplaced/deliberately took the l plates off, nor got the nct done.

:rolleyes:

phog

Was the car on a public road? If yes, he can charge you for not having and not displaying a valid tax disc. BTW, I think traffic wardens can do you as well.
Bit mean if he does you for one though - did you do something to attract his attention?

biko

This is prob better in Legal discussion forum but I believe that you cannot be charged unless you're actually in the car. This is my opinion.

Then of course the garda can argue you were about to drive it and it's word against word in court...

gibo_ie

if the car is on public property and you are the owner then yes they can do you for no tax or NTC. Not for no L plates though as you may have time to put them up before you drive away. As for drink driveing, not unless you were in the front seat (dont have to be moving either) even sleeping in the car can get you done, so sleep in the back if drunk!!

billy the squid

parked on a public road with no L plates. were you about to get into the car without a fully licenced driver with you? he can do you for that as well if he likes.

the boss of me

Yes you can be prosecuted for not having tax or NCT , if the car was in a public road. Doesn't matter if it was parked at the time.

Also you could be done for either being "in control of a vehicle while under the influence" as you had the keys, or for attempted drinking and driving.

JohnnyStones

the boss of me wrote:

Yes you can be prosecuted for not having tax or NCT , if the car was in a public road. Doesn't matter if it was parked at the time.

Also you could be done for either being "in control of a vehicle while under the influence" as you had the keys, or for attempted drinking and driving.

Can't see how the Guard had the right to give you a breathalyzer test?

The keys were in your pocket and the car door was locked weren't they?
that sound's very strange i know you passed the test but even so!

danger mouse

what if I wasn't the named driver...lol Yeah how can he do me sure i wasn't driving the car without NCT or tax or L plates..He also wants too do me because the Addy on my DL is different from my new address...All this because I asked a lad that got out of an un marked car in plain clothes for ID after he stuck his hands in my pocket and took my phone and wallet without Showing me ID or saying **** all....I thought i was being robbed FFS.

biko

I guess this is gonna turn into one of those "You had to be there" threads?

danger mouse

biko wrote:

I guess this is gonna turn into one of those "You had to be there" threads?

It shouldn't really...A garda from the NBCI refused to show me ID...He then got in a huff and tried to too do me.... (His words not mine)

indough

Like people said you don't have to be driving the car as regards to tax, if it's on a public road then you can get done.

Wertz

danger mouse wrote:

It shouldn't really...A garda from the NBCI refused to show me ID...He then got in a huff and tried to too do me.... (His words not mine)

Then you're already fighting a lost battle. You pissed off a detective, now mr Uniform is going to do you with everything he can....and your word will count for f*ck all when it gets to court.
Drug search? What was the context?

Jesus Wept

danger mouse wrote:

Ok say if a Garda drives up to me and im standing outside my car with the keys in my pocket and the door locked and says he's doing me for not having tax (out by a day) NCT or L plates...Can i be done even though im not even driving the car or had no intention too..He also wanted to do me for drunk in charge of a vehicle even tho the keys were in my pocket and the car door locked, i passed the breathalyzer anyway. were do i stand?

He wanted too did he?? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

He wanted to see if you were drunk, in charge of a vehicle.

danger mouse

Wertz wrote:

Then you're already fighting a lost battle. You pissed off a detective, now mr Uniform is going to do you with everything he can....and your word will count for f*ck all when it gets to court.
Drug search? What was the context?

he had no right searching me...I was standing on a main street (Stephens green) In fairness when i passed the booze test all the tool could do was check my tires when i passed..I was not acting suspicious at all...I asked him for a reason for conducting a search under the miss use of drugs act..He could not present a suspicion for any offence.

DonJose

I'd like to see more police presence on the streets. I've driven 40,000 KMs over the past 18 months and have never been stopped at a checkpoint. Everywhere I go I see people on mobiles, every 5th car I pass displays an out of date insurance/tax/nct. Are traffic warden able to write tickets for no insurance/tax/nct, if not they should, they should also be able to given penalty points.

Wertz

danger mouse wrote:

he had no right searching me...I was standing on a main street (Stephens green) In fairness when i passed the booze test all the tool could do was check my tires when i passed..I was not acting suspicious at all...I asked him for a reason for conducting a search under the miss use of drugs act..He could not present a suspicion for any offence.

Thing is, he doesn't really have to....he just needs to have a suspicion that you may be carrying contraband. That suspicion can be formed from the area you were in at the time, the presence of other people thought to be involved in the supply of said contraband, or indeed your own behaviour at the time. He doesn't have to tell you what got his suspicions raised.
He does have to tell you that he's conducting a search under the misuse of drugs act and has to present his ID within a reasonable time (not necessarily before he conducts the search AFAIK).
Reagrdless, you'll be done for the tax/NCT, some would say rightly so....don't give cops cheek next time....as much fun as it is, ultimately they hold the power and can wield it as they see fit....if you piss them off they're obviously going to make life difficult for you.

UpcomingStudent

dont you get a few days to put up a new one?

Wertz

Any cop can radio the station, have the reg entered into the database and be told how long tax/NCT has been up...excuses like "it's in the post" or "the dog ate it" aren't going to carry much water if the documentation has lapsed for much longer than a few weeks...

faceman

sounds all a bit odd to me. Coppers dont just come up to punters and pull dirty cop stuff for nought?!

danger mouse

Wertz wrote:

Thing is, he doesn't really have to....he just needs to have a suspicion that you may be carrying contraband. That suspicion can be formed from the area you were in at the time, the presence of other people thought to be involved in the supply of said contraband, or indeed your own behaviour at the time. He doesn't have to tell you what got his suspicions raised.
He does have to tell you that he's conducting a search under the misuse of drugs act and has to present his ID within a reasonable time (not necessarily before he conducts the search AFAIK).
Reagrdless, you'll be done for the tax/NCT, some would say rightly so....don't give cops cheek next time....as much fun as it is, ultimately they hold the power and can wield it as they see fit....if you piss them off they're obviously going to make life difficult for you.

I didnt give the lad cheek in fairness. I thought i was getting robbed in fairness.

Exit

DonJose wrote:

Are traffic warden able to write tickets for no insurance/tax/nct, if not they should, they should also be able to given penalty points.

Yes, traffic wardens can write tickets for no insurance and no tax. I don't know about NCT.

limklad

danger mouse wrote:

Ok say if a Garda drives up to me and im standing outside my car with the keys in my pocket and the door locked and says he's doing me for not having tax (out by a day) NCT or L plates...Can i be done even though im not even driving the car or had no intention too..He also wanted to do me for drunk in charge of a vehicle even tho the keys were in my pocket and the car door locked, i passed the breathalyzer anyway. were do i stand?

Do not get work up about the Tax been out by one Day, the Judge would throw out that case to give you leniency, on first offence at worst. Just show that you did try to get the car taxed, once the Tax office sent you out the Car tax form. After all you can never get away with not taxing your car, because the next time you tax the car you will have to back-date the car unless you get a form sign by the guards stating it was off the road during that period it was not Taxed.
As for L Plates, They are supposed to be displayed only when a Provisional driver is actually driving the car. As you stated, you were not driving the car. But get them and have them displayed. If you get into an accident and have Comprehensive insurance and if they found that out you are not covered, only third party costs only, and your will be done for not having L plates displayed.
Since you did not get into the driver seat or put the key into the ignition then he had no right to breathalyzer you and he broke the law. Report him as it was illegal, one it was not a check point and two you did not drive the vehicle, did he give his name and division to you?

4) A member of the Garda Sı´ocha´ na, who is on duty at a check-point,
may stop any mechanically propelled vehicle at the checkpoint
and, without prejudice to any other powers (including the powers
under section 12 (inserted by the Act of 2003) of the Act of 1994)
conferred on him or her by statute or at common law, may require
a person in charge of the vehicle—
(a) to—
(i) provide (by exhaling into an apparatus for indicating
the presence of alcohol in the breath) a specimen of
his or her breath, or
(ii) accompany him or her or another member of the
Garda Sı´ocha´ na to a place (including a vehicle) at or
in the vicinity of the checkpoint and there to provide,
by exhaling into such an apparatus, a specimen of his
or her breath, or
(b) to—
(i) leave the vehicle at the place where it has been
stopped, or
(ii) move it to a place in the vicinity of the checkpoint,
and
keep or leave it there until the person has complied with
a requirement made of him or her under paragraph (a).
(5) A member of the Garda Sı´ocha´ na for the purposes of making
a requirement of a person under subsection (4) may indicate the
manner in which the person must comply with the requirement.
(6) A person who—
(a) refuses or fails to comply immediately with a requirement
under subsection (4)(a) or (b)(i) or such a requirement in
a manner indicated by a member of the Garda Sı´ocha´ na
under subsection (5),or
(b) without reasonable excuse, refuses or fails to comply
immediately with a requirement under subsection
(4)(b)(ii) or such a requirement in a manner indicated by
a member of the Garda Sı´ocha´ na under subsection (5),
is guilty of an offence and is liable on summary conviction to a fine
not exceeding \5,000 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6
months or both.

If you got into the car and attempt to drive it, I would agree with the Garda to convict you for that alone, as you are a Safety risk to others, Not only to road users but whoever you crash into.

biko

I think traffic wardens should carry a big hammer with them. If anyone parks badly, out of NCT or such - BANG goes the windshield.
You're not likely to repeat offense then... (hammer can also be used on middle aged business men/women parking on double yellow in flash beamer)

An Citeog

limklad wrote:

Do not get work up about the Tax been out by one Day, the Judge would throw out that case to give you leniency, on first offence at worst. Just show that you did try to get the car taxed, once the Tax office sent you out the Car tax form. After all you can never get away with not taxing your car, because the next time you tax the car you will have to back-date the car unless you get a form sign by the guards stating it was off the road during that period it was not Taxed.
As for L Plates, They are supposed to be displayed only when a Provisional driver is actually driving the car. As you stated, you were not driving the car. But get them and have them displayed. If you get into an accident and have Comprehensive insurance and if they found that out you are not covered, only third party costs only, and your will be done for not having L plates displayed.
Since you did not get into the driver seat or put the key into the ignition then he had no right to breathalyzer you and he broke the law. Report him as it was illegal, one it was not a check point and two you did not drive the vehicle, did he give his name and division to you?

If you got into the car and attempt to drive it, I would agree with the Garda to convict you for that alone, as you are a Safety risk to others, Not only to road users but whoever you crash into.

I see you chose to ignore the fact that he had no NCT on his car! :rolleyes: Whatever you want to say about it, the likelihood of being stopped and searched by a member of the NBCI is very low, unless there's some sort of reason for it.

Dave!

DonJose wrote:

I'd like to see more police presence on the streets. I've driven 40,000 KMs over the past 18 months and have never been stopped at a checkpoint. Everywhere I go I see people on mobiles, every 5th car I pass displays an out of date insurance/tax/nct. Are traffic warden able to write tickets for no insurance/tax/nct, if not they should, they should also be able to given penalty points.

I don't think I've ever seen another car's insurance/tax/NCT disk...... do you turn around and look at them as you pass them on the road, or is it the parked ones that you scope out?

Just curious layk

limklad

An Citeog wrote:

I see you chose to ignore the fact that he had no NCT on his car! :rolleyes: Whatever you want to say about it, the likelihood of being stopped and searched by a member of the NBCI is very low, unless there's some sort of reason for it.

NCT is not worth mentioning, it is a farce, I have seen one car putting out more smoke than a hundred chain smokers and till pass the test :eek:
If you tax your car online, They do not ask for it number.

cormie

You're allowed tax a car any day of the month after the expired month. I was stopped at a checkpoint before and asked about my tax and said this to the lady and she just told me to make sure I don't let it go past that month.

If nobody is driving the car, then it doesn't need L plates. L plates should only be up if being driven by a driver on a provisional license.

As far as I know, it's not an offence to have an expired NCT disc on a public road.

pretty-in-pink

cops can be randomly dirty.

I was told by a cop (when I was 16) that there were "ways" I could get him to buy me and my mates drink, and not do anything if we were drunk n disorderly after drinking it.

copacetic

danger mouse wrote:

I didnt give the lad cheek in fairness. I thought i was getting robbed in fairness.

do you normally ask mugggers for ID? your story has more holes in it than the plot in an episode of the a-team..

Trojan911

danger mouse wrote:

All this because I asked a lad that got out of an un marked car in plain clothes for ID after he stuck his hands in my pocket and took my phone and wallet without Showing me ID or saying **** all....I thought i was being robbed FFS.

Why didn't you leg it when this happened. Get to the nearest phone & diall 999 alleging robbery?

Plain Clothed Officers have to ID themselves & give legitimate/resonable grounds before conducting a search. Your options are:

Go & find out what station he was attached to & put in a complaint.

Go to to the Ombudsman.

Go to a solicitor.

Do nothing.

You could be looking at an unlawful search.

TJ911...

danger mouse

copacetic wrote:

do you normally ask mugggers for ID? your story has more holes in it than the plot in an episode of the a-team..

He told me he was a garda as he stuck his hand in my pocket. Any other holes you want cleared up...I then asked to see his ID and instructed my bro to call pearse street garda station when he refused to show it. Anyway, your man seen a passing garda van and called it other and still refused to show id even in front of other uniformed gardai. I dont see how you could think my story has holes in it...

I hate when people put up their garda horror stories and others say "a sure you must have been mouthing off or something" could people not think for a second that maybe some garda are **** and you dont even need to have mouthed off for them to be pricks and try to **** you over.

The feaker even tried to nick my phone. He gave me back my wallet but wouldn't hand back the phone. After reading my text messages going through my contacts and last dailed numbers might i add...He said he already returned it...I could see it in his hoody pocket and got my bro to ring it..He did this in front of 4 uniformed gardai...lol i reckon he was drunk or something because it was all very bizarre.

Leeby

I have an appointment to get my NCT in three weeks, in the meantime I can't insure my car as I don't have a valid NCT (though they've told me they'll cover me for the day of the NCT so I can get to it), without insurance I can't renew my tax. My house doesn't have a front garden so my car is parked on the road outside, from what I'm hearing in this thread does this mean that if a garda came along I could be prosecuted despite the fact that I have no intention to drive my car til all this is sorted?

humanji

copacetic wrote:

do you normally ask mugggers for ID? your story has more holes in it than the plot in an episode of the a-team..

George Peppard is rolling in his grave because of that remark

muppetkiller

Trust me Cops don't do people for kicks, the paper work involved isn't worth the fun ..to say otherwise is just nonsense.

The Hill Billy

OP - Go on the offensive if you want to get satisfaction. Call Harcourt Street - ask to speak with the Duty Sargeant, explain what happened & read him the riot act. Tell him that it is not acceptable to be stopped & physically searched by an officer who did not identify himself & thet you wish to complain in the strongest possible terms about the abuse of your civil liberties. Follow up with a written complaint to the Garda Ombudsman.

And get your tax & NCT sorted while your at it.

The_Hustler

You're not allowed to tax your car till it's up anyway. As someone else said when you tax it any day of the month you are taxed for the entire month. You can even tax it for the month during the first week or so of the following month.

That is an issue you can check with the Motor Tax Office, but they'll tell you they don't care about the NCT, that's an issue fully with the guards.

danger mouse

Hill Billy wrote:

OP - Go on the offensive if you want to get satisfaction. Call Harcourt Street - ask to speak with the Duty Sargeant, explain what happened & read him the riot act. Tell him that it is not acceptable to be stopped & physically searched by an officer who did not identify himself & thet you wish to complain in the strongest possible terms about the abuse of your civil liberties. Follow up with a written complaint to the Garda Ombudsman.

And get your tax & NCT sorted while your at it.

I got a complaint form in the post from the ombubsman today...Gonna fill that in and send it off.

declanoneill

The_Hustler wrote:

You're not allowed to tax your car till it's up anyway.

I've got a tax disc winging it's way to me that says otherwise. The motor tax office sends out reminders and lets you pay online before your current tax expires.

matt-dublin

faceman wrote:

sounds all a bit odd to me. Coppers dont just come up to punters and pull dirty cop stuff for nought?!

yes they do, i got arrested for being drunk and disorderly when i hadn't even had a drink!

prendy

I have an appointment to get my NCT in three weeks, in the meantime I can't insure my car as I don't have a valid NCT (though they've told me they'll cover me for the day of the NCT so I can get to it), without insurance I can't renew my tax. My house doesn't have a front garden so my car is parked on the road outside, from what I'm hearing in this thread does this mean that if a garda came along I could be prosecuted despite the fact that I have no intention to drive my car til all this is sorted

yes thats exactly what there saying...there must be a reason your nct is up(not saying its your fault but in alot of cases it is)
NCT can be done anytime before its up so thats what theyl say to you. very unlikely youll get done tho!

How Strange

If your nct is out of date you can not even park your car on a public road. You can be fined for it. If you fail your nct and have to do it again you get a form showing that it failed and the next date so you can then drive the car.

Before you could buy your tax disc on line, the county council offices would not give you a tax disc until the first day of the next month so if your disc expired on 31st Oct you couldn't get the new disc until 1st November. That has all changed now with the online system.

radiospan

UpcomingStudent wrote:

dont you get a few days to put up a new one?

I think you have a few weeks?

I only got my tax renewal in the post on Monday, and the old one was up at the end of September.

January

You have a month from the date of expiry on your tax to renew it. I got this from a Garda source.

cormie

adrieanne__x wrote:

You have a month from the date of expiry on your tax to renew it. I got this from a Garda source.

Yup, as I said above too in a more confusing way

This particular person sounds like an ass if he was going through your text messages and everything, that would infuriate me:mad: Hope he's made an example of. Good luck!