Recruitment agencies

rickybutcher

What are your experiences? Good/bad.

I have had a terrible time with recruitment agencies recently, I'm sure that in a lot of cases they just used me to get numbers going to an interview, even though they knew I wouldn't get the job or that there was somebody better qualified going. The fact many agents screen all of their calls and don't bother returning calls or emails is really frustrating, a simple 30 second call or 1 line email with an update - so I can plan for things myself - is all I ask but I rarely get it. It took 1 guy a week to return 3 messages I left for him, he left me waiting more than a week more than he said he would, in the meantime I was in limbo with one or two other positions. He knew I was waiting and he didn't even reply himself, he got another guy in the company to contact me. Extremely unprofessional. In the one instance I knew of somebody going for the same job as me I found out that the recruiter was a lying bastard. I'm sure I wasn't just unlucky.

It is a cut-throat sales environment and that attracts a certain type of person, I accept that, but I just wish they went about their business a bit more professionally and were honest about things.

mikemac

This has been done to death in this forum tbh

flash harry

they should be all shot, every single one of them I say, no exceptions!!!!!

MollyCoddle

No good experiences, seem to be in Cork anyway far too many agencies and not enough jobs. They are all 'urgently seeking temps' but I've never had a days work out of any of them and I have plenty of related experience so I am not a newbie trying to make some cash.

The place is saturated with them.

fguihen

do a search. tons of posts on this exact topic.

Dudess

Yep, OP. There is a huge volume of anti-recruitment agency threads on this site. People can throw up their hands, sigh and mutter "not another one" but it demonstrates that there is clearly something rotten in recruitment agency land. Not all agencies are scammers and some offer an excellent service, but there is obviously a certain proportion that behave dreadfully.
In recent months, yes, I have had a bad experience with a recruitment agency, as has my best mate.
Flash Harry, I understand your frustration at people doing nothing but bad-mouth the profession, but when there are so many infuriating stories, it's understandable - even if unfair - that those who don't have the same insight as you into recruitment, tend to tar everyone in it with the same brush.

the_syco

flash harry wrote:

they should be all shot, every single one of them I say, no exceptions!!!!!

Feeling suicidal?:p:D:rolleyes:

=-=

OP: you get offered a job, take it.

Columbo

Haven't been on this forum for a long time. Anyway, I actually own a small recruitment company. I do know the industry does have a poor reputation and to be honest, sometimes deservedly so. I'd like to think I do things professionally, but I have to hold my hands up and admit, I cannot respond to every application we receive due to the sheer volume. (Though I would like to)

At the larger agencies, it really does become an out and out sales job. Even if a recruiter is not hitting their sales target, if they can show they have been "unlucky" in that they have sent people for an interview but they have been "pipped" at the post, then their manager will keep faith in them as they seem to know what they are doing.

For candidates, it's not easy, but the one piece of advice I would give, is to insist that you are told which companies your CV is being sent to before it has been sent and keep track yourself. Companies use a number of agencies for each vacancy and it then becomes a race to get the CV's in. It's a first come, first serve policy with companies. You could easily end up with 2 or 3 applications for the same job without knowing anything about it.

All in all, I'm not painting a pretty picture about recruitment, but nothing you probably don't already think anyway. But it's not all doom & gloom and if you find a good recruiter that you feel you can trust then it can work for you.

You all have your own personal experiences. I first joined this board because I was made aware that I personally was getting a bit of a hammering here. IMO it was unjustified and it was my client (the hiring company) that was at fault. The problem was the person complaining didn't have the full facts of what was happening internally with the client, and just blamed the agency. What I am trying to say is that sometimes, the agency isn't always at fault. Client's change the goalposts and we are left with the aftermath.

Columbo

Haven't been on this forum for a long time. Anyway, I actually own a small recruitment company. I do know the industry does have a poor reputation and to be honest, sometimes deservedly so. I'd like to think I do things professionally, but I have to hold my hands up and admit, I cannot respond to every application we receive due to the sheer volume. (Though I would like to)

At the larger agencies, it really does become an out and out sales job. Even if a recruiter is not hitting their sales target, if they can show they have been "unlucky" in that they have sent people for an interview but they have been "pipped" at the post, then their manager will keep faith in them as they seem to know what they are doing.

For candidates, it's not easy, but the one piece of advice I would give, is to insist that you are told which companies your CV is being sent to before it has been sent and keep track yourself. Companies use a number of agencies for each vacancy and it then becomes a race to get the CV's in. It's a first come, first serve policy with companies. You could easily end up with 2 or 3 applications for the same job without knowing anything about it.

All in all, I'm not painting a pretty picture about recruitment, but nothing you probably don't already think anyway. But it's not all doom & gloom and if you find a good recruiter that you feel you can trust then it can work for you.

You all have your own personal experiences. I first joined this board because I was made aware that I personally was getting a bit of a hammering here. IMO it was unjustified and it was my client (the hiring company) that was at fault. The problem was the person complaining didn't have the full facts of what was happening internally with the client, and just blamed the agency. What I am trying to say is that sometimes, the agency isn't always at fault. Client's change the goalposts and we are left with the aftermath.

Tom Dunne

Columbo wrote:

What I am trying to say is that sometimes, the agency isn't always at fault.

I think that is a fair and valid point. People, especially here, tend only to complain when things don't go their way. For some reason, people don't start threads to praise recruitment agencies.

I have started to look for a job right now, and I regard agencies as a necessary evil. Despite not having the best of experiences with them, I am dealing with one or two in the hope they will restore my faith.

Any agents out there want to help me look for a job?

eth0_

THe only decent recruitment company I have *ever* dealt with in Ireland has been Net Nation. They are a small company but their service is brilliant and they do strive to match you to a job that suits your abilities.

Compare this to another company we have been using in work to recruit more people for our team. I have interviewed a lot of the people they have supposedly 'screened' and my god, they were either completely socially retarded and unable to communicate, REALLY overqualified or underqualified, and some of them were not truthfully told what the job involved, meaning the overqualified people had their own and our time wasted.

I mean it's not fscking difficult to look at a CV and compare it to a job spec and think 'Ok this guy has been a programmer for 20 years, he's unlikely to stay in a support and systems admin role now, is he?'.

Columbo

eth0_ wrote:

I mean it's not fscking difficult to look at a CV and compare it to a job spec and think 'Ok this guy has been a programmer for 20 years, he's unlikely to stay in a support and systems admin role now, is he?'.

Have to agree. Recruiters need to earn their money by matching skills to requirements of the job. The problem as I mentioned above is the need to generate revenue AND measurements ie number of CV's sent out in a week. If a manager sees a recruiter sending out 25 CV's a week, he will probably be happy, however, what he should be looking at it the number of CV's to interview to hire ratio. If that ratio is good then the recruiter is good at their job.

Columbo

flash harry wrote:

they should be all shot, every single one of them I say, no exceptions!!!!!

Harry, please don't hold back. Say what you mean:)

Dudess

Flash harry actually has a recruitment agency himself and is no doubt starting to get a bit weary from the abuse!

mick.fr

I have my own business myself, not a recruitment agency though, an IT consulting company.

When I post a job asking for skills and experience around Active Directory, Exchange, Security etc...I got resumes from Polish gardeners working in Galway or palette lifters working in Limerick who have designed a website in the past for the university of Numbuktu so they think they know what Windows Server...is.

Of course I do not even bother answering to this type of emails.
Or when the guy sent me an email with mobile phone text message's type, I do not bother answering as well.

I think it is all about quality and your ability to sell yourself.

I would suggest you guys to always send your resume to a job that matches your skills and experience.
If you just got your diploma in IT and apply for a 60k job to be an IT manager or senior system administrator, nobody is gonna answer you.

Assuming you have posted a good resume and that you have the relevant experience, an agency might not contact you as well because they might have found somebody as well already. I would strongly recommend you to always call the agency 2 days after you sent your CV.

Show them that you are here, invite the sales guy to the restaurant, it is worth the investment, that is the way things are working in real life. Eye for an eye.

Hope this help

Columbo

mick.fr wrote:

I would suggest you guys to always send your resume to a job that matches your skills and experience.
If you just got your diploma in IT and apply for a 60k job to be an IT manager or senior system administrator, nobody is gonna answer you.

Assuming you have posted a good resume and that you have the relevant experience, an agency might not contact you as well because they might have found somebody as well already. I would strongly recommend you to always call the agency 2 days after you sent your CV.

From an agency POV this is excellent advice. We get so many CV's in a day. In reality, your CV has 10 seconds to get our attention as a potential match, so make sure it is well presented and that your skill set can easily be spotted. The follow up call is important as well because a) you might have slipped through the net and b) if you haven't been called, you might find out why. (Please keep in mind, companies can be very specific, you may have 4 out of the 5 skills required by maybe the hiring company in insisting on that 5that skill as an essential OR maybe they have put the start date back OR even closed the vacancy off. A lot of things happen that is outside the agencies control, and I can understand how candidates, who don't know the full facts, can get pissed off).

How Strange

Three years ago I was actively looking for work. I contacted alot of agencies in Dublin city (probably 20) over a year and a half. Sometimes I sent my cv in looking to go onto their books other times I replied to job vacancies posted on the net. I got ONE interview in a year and a half. Most agencies hadn't the manners or the professionalism to respond to my initial application or the subsequent phone messages. The ones that did reply set up the ' we need to meet you first' interviews so I took time off work, made an effort and then NOTHING. They would promise you the world while you are sitting in front of them and tell you that you have an excellent and transferable skillset and then you are back in recruitment agency Siberia. They wouldn't take my call and they wouldn't return messages.

Eventually I found one recruitment consultant with a shred of integrity who took the time to actually talk to me, ask me what I was interested in and what I wasn't. I had a job within two weeks.

Last year I went looking again, with alot more experience this time and a more impressive cv, and the same old story. All I got was bullsh*t from everyone of them. 'Oh you're not qualified for this, that and the other, we will put you forward for this type of role instead' or 'I've got a great 6 month contract that I think you should go for' (encouraging me to give up a permanent job for a contract) :eek:

I applied directly to a company for the type of job I wanted and I WAS qualified for and I got it. In fact the company pursued me and the agency that wanted me to take the contract role had this company on their books and never considered me for the positions!

In my experience, they are a necessary evil (emphasis on evil) and it is an industry with very little integrity or professionalism. I found that if they can't squeeze you into one of their yellow pack job roles - customer service or sales (where they get all their commission) then they aren't interested. God help any of us who have a slightly diverse career. If you have to deal with them know your own mind, stick to it and tell them to f*ck off if they try to push you to consider roles that you don't want. Harsh but true and an opinion formed out of a few years looking for jobs (in anticipation of the recruitment agency owner posters who may reply)

eth0_

Columbo wrote:

A lot of things happen that is outside the agencies control, and I can understand how candidates, who don't know the full facts, can get pissed off).

Oh please. Personally i've had several experiences over the years where i've gone to interviews and been embarrassed because the job was nothing like what the recruitment agent told me it would be (this is with different agencies). I know lots of people who have had the same experience.

It is quite simple, recruitment agencies should not be employing salespeople....sorry, 'consultants'...who have zero knowledge of the field they are recruiting for.

I really don't know why companies use agencies, their fees are disgusting considering all most of them do is take a cursory glance (as you just admitted to in your post) and put them forward for whatever role they have open on their computer at present.

Dudess

eth0_ wrote:

I really don't know why companies use agencies, their fees are disgusting considering all most of them do is take a cursory glance (as you just admitted to in your post) and put them forward for whatever role they have open on their computer at present.

Yeah I don't get that either. Is it cheaper than having a HR department or what?

Tom Dunne

Dudess wrote:

Yeah I don't get that either. Is it cheaper than having a HR department or what?

I think it is.

I know in my situation, there were two people in the IT department, one of them was the IT manager. They didn't have the time nor the resources to sift through potentially hundreds of CVs, so they hired an agency. The agency gave them a shortlist of CVs, I was one of those CVs, the rest as they say is history.

It was less painful for them that way.

flash harry

Dudess wrote:

Yeah I don't get that either. Is it cheaper than having a HR department or what?

This is why a HR dept is not sufficient - look at the date this was originally posted:

http://www.recruitireland.com/job/?jobID=6118906&num=25&Company=MICROSOFT&RP=50

If a HR dept with Microsofts resources need help to fill roles, why do you think a smaller company would not?

Bottom line is, if a recruiter gets you a good person, the "disgusting" fee is well worth it in terms of the bottom line. If your HR dept faffs about for months, you've probably lost a hell of a lot more than the recruitment companies fee..........

IRISH RAIL

Oh god its all coming back again, everyone knows I have the most hatred for agencies, can we not have decent employment legislation where people cant be sacked by telephone, or you have to pay for your ppe,
where you get the same rights as a permanant employee and a minimum term before you have to be offered a permanant role.
I know one company who employs agency staff I worked there for 18 months there was guys there for years always watching thier backs in case the axe fell thier way.
if you can keep these guys on for more than 12 weeks you should be made give them a contract.
and what will the agencies tell you. if you keep your head down you never know. sorry utter b**l****, they should be on a par with polititians and con men,
rant over for the moment but Ill be back with more horror stories.

the_syco

IRISH RAIL wrote:

a minimum term before you have to be offered a permanant role.

There are very few IT places that offer permanant roles these days. Sure, I'm in one, but if it's done through an agency, the agency owns you, not the company, thus if the company sacks the agency, you could be gone too.

stepbar

Is it any wonder HR personnel are utterly useless?

flash harry

stepbar wrote:

Is it any wonder HR personnel are utterly useless?

?????