Involved in accident. What to do?

mikemac

Any advice appreciated, just involved in my first accident and kinda clueless.
At approx 6pm today, I was cycling my Trek 1200 out to Malahide and back.
A nice evening for it.

Near the end of dedicated cycle lane along the promenade, I turned left towards Baldoyle. As you get towards the Coast Road, there is a crossroads.(Warrenhouse Rd and Dublin Rd.)
Traffic was stopped at the lights and I was filtering along my clearly marked and wide cycle lane.

Long story short, a passenger in an SUV flung open the left side door to exit and I slammed into the door and fell on the ground.
My front wheel was buckled and my knee and hand (typing this one-handed) were cut, not badly but steady bleeding for a few minutes.

Made it back home despite my buckled wheel after resting on a wall for a while.
Driver and passenger (I'm guessing father and son) seemed genuienly sorry and concerned. I started laughing, think it was a nervous reaction.
Their joke that I made "tatters of their door" wasn't funny though.:mad:

I have the drivers reg and business card with address and phone no.
Never thought to get witnesses or their insurance company.

I called to my GP practice who open til 9pm and got the wounds cleaned and plasters. Cost €60euro.
I told the driver I'd get my bike checked over and give a call on Monday. Doubt there is much damage but need to be sure.

I called to my local garda station but they told me to go to Howth Garda Station and thats miles away. What happened to PULSE?
My Dad said I've to report accidents immediately but I've no car and can't make out there tonight.
Can making a report wait? Is it neccesary in case the driver denies everything next week?
Don't want much, just pay for my doctor visit, the checking of the bike and any possible damage.
Is that fair?

Any advice appreciated, never in an accident before

Brady

Did you give any of your details to him?

As I have heard a horror story, from a friend of a friend who was in a minor accident.. No one at the scene wanted to do anything because there was no clear person at fault so he didn’t report the accident and thought nothing more off it.

Few weeks later he got a solicitors letter, advising him that legal action will be taken against basically for injuries resulting from the accident!? Which was outrageous due to the fact there was no major damage. Obv he went to the police but guess what the first thing was they asked him "did you report the accident at the time?" he had no leg to stand on! Because he couldn’t prove the damage to the car was insufficent never mind the occupants because it wasn’t investigated/reported.

So beware!

mikemac

Brady wrote:

Did you give any of your details to him?

He didn't ask and I didn't think to give it. As I said, this is all new to me.
So he knows nothing, not even my name, address or mobile no.

I'll call to Howth in the morning, I assumed any station could take a report but my local station didn't want to know

Junior

Ring Howth and explain to someone there your situation and get their name, rank etc ...

Membrane

Sorry to hear that. A quote from the ROTR booklet:

If you or another person are injured and there is no Garda at the scene, the accident must be reported to the nearest Garda station

I know the local situation, you bear no blame, the other party is fully responsible for the accident you described. I think that it would be difficult for the other party to weasel out of his responsibility, but I'm guessing that just in case it could be useful to show your injuries and the damage to your bike to the Guards so that they will be recorded as part of their report. Better do that sooner than later I'd guess, but the doctors bill will give a good indication of the time the accident happened (assuming that the bill is dated).

blorg

Sounds like a minor accident (glad you seem ok) and they seem decent, I'd say give them a call and they will probably sort it out, 60 quid doctor's bill and a new wheel is not a lot in the scheme of things. If you are checked out medically and ok I wouldn't be looking for anything more.

mikemac

Thanks for the replies.:)
Drove my moped out to Howth Garda Station and I have to say that operating the throttle was damn painful. My right hand was very sore.

Made a report and I forget the name of the road but pointed it out on a map.
Garda was very helpful and took all the details and I took his name, rank and number. I hope the driver does not dispute this so the Garda shouldn't be involved again. The garda even agreed the SUV was 100% liable.

Next step is to get the bike checked on Monday. I'm not sure if a new wheel will be needed but a full check will be done.

So worst case scenario, the driver will pay for medical bills, a bike check, and any other damage.
Luckily for him, I'm not going to say "Whiplash, 10 grand please". No fan of compo culture.

robfitz

Sorry to hear that you were involved in this accident.

micmclo wrote:

Near the end of dedicated cycle lane along the promenade, I turned left towards Baldoyle. As you get towards the Coast Road, there is a crossroads.(Warrenhouse Rd and Dublin Rd.)
Traffic was stopped at the lights and I was filtering along my clearly marked and wide cycle lane.

So while cycling in a facility which most people would say is there to improve cyclist safety you were doored... Interesting.

Was the cycle track a factor in the accident, would you normal filter up the inside of vehicles?

Can you take photos of the scene of the accident? I'd like to see them.

Write down in as much detail what happened, and record all the expenses you incur due to the accident.

Also take a note of the width of the on-roadway cycle track and traffic lane (if safe) with a tape measure, also what road signs were used to indicate a cycle track (or other facility).

Hungrycol

Sorry to hear about the accident. Filtering gives me the willies for that very reason. Get your bike thoroughly checked over by a bike shop, telling them what happened. Your forks could be bent too.

If you're happy enough that the injuries aren't that permanent then I'd just look for compensation for the Dr's bill, Bike check (and servicing) and any replacement parts arising out of the check.

Just as matter of interest. Were you wearing a helmet? On Saturday a lady fell off her bike in front of me. She broke her wrist and gashed her arm and head quite badly... she wasn't wearing a helmet that would have made a big difference (or gloves now that I come to think of it). She didn't loose consciousness but was going into shock. Fortunately her sister arrived (whom I phoned) just before the ambulance came.

How Strange

OP, I would recommend going to a chiropractor or physiotherapist so they can check your neck and back for muscle damage. A car drove into the back of mine once at a very slow pace and I thought I was fine. Six months later I had whiplash and spent a fortune on chiropractors fees. Its just a precaution and a doctor can't detect muscle damage.

If you get the all clear then the driver should be happy as he won't be getting a bogus claim in a year.

mikemac

Hungrycol wrote:

Just as matter of interest. Were you wearing a helmet?

Actually I wasn't wearing an helmet and 95% of the time I do wear my helmet.
I will wear it always in future as I know I cut my hand off the corner of the door but at a slightly different angle, that would have been my head. Plus I fell on the kerb and a lot of head injuries happen like that.

(I know wearing a helmet is a hot topic here so please don't turn the thread into a debate on that)

Regarding visiting a chiropracter, my neck was stiff yesterday but I may as well get checked. Never thought of that.

robfitz, I don't think I can get you photos as it's a good 10km from here and also I've no camera.
To be fair to DCC, it's an excellent cycle lane, wide and clearly marked. The driver of the SUV did nothing wrong and he was stopped beside it.
Simply, his passenger in the front left seat opened the door without checking his wing mirror and I had nowhere to go.
How wide is the lane?-it's about the width of a car door

daymobrew

micmclo wrote:

robfitz, I don't think I can get you photos as it's a good 10km from here and also I've no camera.
To be fair to DCC, it's an excellent cycle lane, wide and clearly marked. The driver of the SUV did nothing wrong and he was stopped beside it.
Simply, his passenger in the front left seat opened the door without checking his wing mirror and I had nowhere to go.

Is it beside Baldoyle library?
The driver has responsibility for the actions of those in the vehicle - if someone litters from a car the driver pays, if an minor is not wearing a seatbelt the driver gets the penalty points.

Mr. Presentable

Sorry to read about your accident. If you had been in a car you would have contributory negligence as you'd be going too quickly and close to stop in time. Is this not true for cyclists too, or are motorists always wrong?

Del2005

daymobrew wrote:

The driver has responsibility for the actions of those in the vehicle - if someone litters from a car the driver pays, if an minor is not wearing a seatbelt the driver gets the penalty points.

But if the person isn't a minor then that person is responsible. The driver doesn't get points if an adult isn't wearing a seatbelt, once they tell them to put it on. But the driver still has to pay/their insurance for the damage done by their vehicle.

rubadub

nipplenuts wrote:

If you had been in a car you would have contributory negligence as you'd be going too quickly and close to stop in time. Is this not true for cyclists too, or are motorists always wrong?

If he had been in a car- and on the cycletrack he would be in the wrong alright!

It wasnt like he was undertaking cars on a regular road where your point might count somewhat as negligence.

I had a driver swerve ontop of me at the weekend. I was on a clearly marked cycletrack and a car was in front waiting to turn right into an estate, so a car went to undertake him and went onto the cycletrack, then another did the same almost hitting me. This was early sunday, clear roads and they definitely saw me, I know he did since I stuck my fingers up when he overtook and he acknowledged this with a wave back.

Unfortunately it was up a steep hill and I just missed out on abusing the kunt at the lights.

Mr. Presentable

rubadub wrote:

If he had been in a car- and on the cycletrack he would be in the wrong alright!

No no no. That's not what I'm saying. If two lanes of cars, inside stopped, outside moving, and a car in the inside lane opens a door the car in the outside lane is supposed to be in a position to avoid hitting it. I'm not saying the cyclist is wrong either, I'm just asking is the motorist always at fault when there's a cyclist involved.

garo

I'm just asking is the motorist always at fault when there's a cyclist involved.

I think that is a rather inflammatory way of putting things, particularly on a cycling forum. To answer your question, in case you asked it seriously, no of course not. If a cyclist runs a red light and gets hit by a car that was crossing on a green, the cyclist is at fault. Use your common sense and read the ROTR.

Turner

micmclo wrote:

Thanks for the replies.:)
Drove my moped out to Howth Garda Station and I have to say that operating the throttle was damn painful. My right hand was very sore.

Made a report and I forget the name of the road but pointed it out on a map.
Garda was very helpful and took all the details and I took his name, rank and number. I hope the driver does not dispute this so the Garda shouldn't be involved again. The garda even agreed the SUV was 100% liable.

Next step is to get the bike checked on Monday. I'm not sure if a new wheel will be needed but a full check will be done.

So worst case scenario, the driver will pay for medical bills, a bike check, and any other damage.
Luckily for him, I'm not going to say "Whiplash, 10 grand please". No fan of compo culture.

Does not matter a flying fcuk what the garda thinks.. If it goes to court its the judge who will decide. A garda only brings all the evidence of the incident in front of a judge for him to decide.

Generally if you hit something they say you should have been able to stop in the distance you could see clear...what if a child had wandered out in front of you.

I am not saying you are at fault... but from experience if you hit something you are at fault (only experienced this where the driver was the driver of a motor vehicle, not sure about a bike) .

For your info i have been present at maybe <=100 road traffic contested accident court cases.

the boss of me

Generally if you hit something they say you should have been able to stop in the distance you could see clear...what if a child had wandered out in front of you.

Surely the OP was able to stop in the distance he could see to be clear,till the door opened and robbed his braking distance.
I think the OP has an open and shut case here and if compensation is not offered he should pursue the matter through either the drivers insurance company or by instructing a solicitor to act on his behalf.

Compensation culture is one thing, but if the OP has suffered a genuine injury and his property has been damaged through someone elses' negligence, why should he feel guilty looking for compensation ?

milod

OP, having had direct experience of a road traffic accident, here's what to do:

Add up all the expenses associated with the accident including medical, bike repair, time off work etc etc. Make sure you see a doctor and get him/her to record all injuries, however slight, associated with the accident.

Present the SUV owners with a bill and give them an opportunity to put right the stupidity of their actions

If they don't agree, then approach the PIAB directly, or ask your solicitor... (http://www.piab.ie/). This is where the medical report is required.

This is the solution for those of us who don't subscribe to the neckbrace and compo culture, and is fair to both parties.

Finally, IMHO, SUV driver deserve no favours. They're a blight on the road and in my own anecdotal experience, most likely to run you into a ditch.

blorg

rubadub

Chief--- wrote:

Generally if you hit something they say you should have been able to stop in the distance you could see clear...what if a child had wandered out in front of you.

Very simple, if the child appears at a distance shorter than your braking distance and reaction time for a given speed then you will hit them. Same goes for the open door. A child could pop out from between cars on the road and onto a cycletrack 1ft away from me. For a braking distance of 1ft I expect my speed should be 5mph or maybe less. Does this mean I should go 5mph all the time, for fear of cars opening doors 1ft away from me?

mikemac

I started this, thanks for advice so far. Maybe someone else will find it useful in future too as I'm sure I'm not the only noob at all this.

I hear what you're saying Chief about leaving enough brakeing distance to stop for hazards ahead but if all cyclists do this, we may as get off and walk when there is stationary traffic alongside cycle lanes as there is not much you can do if a passenger door opens in front of you if you are going at even a moderate to slow speed.
Rubadub explains it better I can.

milod wrote:

Present the SUV owners with a bill and give them an opportunity to put right the stupidity of their actions

If they don't agree, then approach the PIAB directly, or ask your solicitor... (http://www.piab.ie/). This is where the medical report is required.

I'm not saying the exact final bill but it's less than €200, suprisingly small. Combination of getting the bike checked and doctors fees, painkilling tablets I bought and one taxi trip. I've receipts for everything.
My finger is still killing me anytime I lock a door or type on a keyboard but it'll wear off in a week or so.

I emailed a list of everything to the driver. His address was on the card.
I've left three voicemails on his mobile and when I call his office I just get his colleagues and l've not been called back yet.

Would the PIAB cover damage to property? If it's for injuries only then that's realy only half my costs.
Contacting a solictor and telling to sue for €150? I'd be afraid that'd be too small an amount for any solictor to bother with a case like mine.

I could contact the gardai and tell them to get the insurance details.I made a report on the night.

Sorry for all the questions.:)

milod wrote:

Finally, IMHO, SUV driver deserve no favours. They're a blight on the road and in my own anecdotal experience, most likely to run you into a ditch.

QFT!

blorg

The PIAB will include expenses for the bike, yes.

But the driver would be looking at a sum in the thousands for your pain and suffering on the finger if you take the PIAB route so you don't really need to worry about it being "half your costs." The medical costs/property damage are in addition to the settlement.

Good on you for being reasonable and _not_ rushing to screw the driver over this (although I'd leave it a few weeks until you are _sure_ it is not serious and your finger is getting better) but go straight to the PIAB and get a settlement of a few grand if he is not willing to cough up the €200.

cunnins4

blorg wrote:

Good on you for being reasonable and _not_ rushing to screw the driver over this (although I'd leave it a few weeks until you are _sure_ it is not serious and your finger is getting better) but go straight to the PIAB and get a settlement of a few grand if he is not willing to cough up the €200.

Exactly, make sure you follow this up. Don't let him get away with it.