Comreg does something

bealtine

http://comreg.ie/publications/capacity_based_pricing_for_bitstream_direction_not_to_launch.583.102758.p.html

Sponge Bob

about what ???

smellslikeshoes

From the document

Capacity Based Pricing for Bitstream/Direction to refrain from launch
1 ComReg 07/69
On August 30th, Eircom announced its intention to launch a new Capacity Based Bitstream
product for its wholesale customers. Eircom stated that it would commence taking orders
for this product on September the 24th.
The Commission for Communications Regulation (ComReg) directed Eircom, on Friday
14th September, not to launch this product and to refrain from taking and processing orders
for this product, until such a time as Eircom demonstrates, to ComReg’s satisfaction, that
it (Eircom) is fully compliant with all of its regulatory obligations, including those arising
from Eircom’s dominance of the Wholesale Broadband Access market.

Kinda surprised by this, Anyone know anything about this new wholesale product and what would being fully compliant mean for eircom?

Sponge Bob

comreg tells eircom to do a load of work to prove something or other to comreg. Thats 'nothing' to my mind ...unless you are eircom !

bk

I'm only widely guessing on this, but I've been thinking that Eircom will eventually start moving to a system like BT have in the UK.

Basically everyone gets "up to" 8mb BB [1] and instead they tier their packages via data usage. For instance BT UK offer:

8mb/s with 5GB cap for £17.99
8mb/s with 8GB cap for £22.99
8mb/s with unlimited cap for £24.99

[1] of course many people don't get anywhere near 8mb/s

This could be an indication of them moving in this direction.

Remember that the easy LLU migration set up system is supposed to be in place at the end of this month. I'm guessing that Eircom will move to something like the above in order to compete with LLU.

Of course this is all just a guess on my part.

watty

Here of course it will mean the same speeds and lower caps (as we have now, but enforced by everyone) at a new price structure.

Sponge Bob

well all we know is that it took comreg 2 weeks to realise they did not understand it so they directed eircom not to launch it till they explained it to comreg.

comreg wil be quite happy once eircom transpose a comma somewhere and will let them run with it .

Tom Young

I'd suspect a net affect on the LLU and equivalence.

mike76

hey

There is this but I ain't sure what it means, can't be a good thing

http://www.eircomwholesale.ie/news/whatsNew.asp?id=41

RangeR

Sponge Bob wrote:

comreg wil be quite happy once eircom transpose a comma somewhere and will let them run with it .

Brilliant. Karma +1

cgarvey

mike76 wrote:

There is this but I ain't sure what it means, can't be a good thing

http://www.eircomwholesale.ie/news/whatsNew.asp?id=41

That's the very product offering ComReg have stopped eircom releasing, for now, I believe.

bk

mike76 wrote:

hey

There is this but I ain't sure what it means, can't be a good thing

http://www.eircomwholesale.ie/news/whatsNew.asp?id=41

So looks like the BT UK product, but with "up to" 6mb/s. I'd thought they'd at least pretend that they could give us "up to" 8mb/s.

Liam Byrne

watty wrote:

Here of course it will mean the same speeds and lower caps (as we have now, but enforced by everyone) at a new price structure.

Not quite "everyone" - only eircom resellers......?

Won't everyone on LLU be completely separate (says he, hopefully) ?

watty

It's not likely to be very many everybodies given costs and backhaul & etc of LLU and number of LLU connections currently. Eircom 96% of DSL?

bealtine

bealtine wrote:

http://comreg.ie/publications/capacity_based_pricing_for_bitstream_direction_not_to_launch.583.102758.p.html

More on this:
http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/news.nv?storyid=single%209230

ComReg delays Eircom’s wholesale product

18.09.2007 - Ireland’s telecoms regulator, the Commission for Communications Regulation (ComReg), has directed incumbent operator Eircom not to launch a new wholesale bitstream product until it can demonstrate it is compliant with its regulatory obligations.
In late August Eircom said it intended to launch a new capacity-based bitstream product for its wholesale customer. Effectively this meant each wholesale customer would be differentiated according to amount of capacity required.

“Eircom were to commence taking orders on 24 September but we’ve asked them not to launch the product until they can demonstrate to ComReg that it is compliant with regulatory obligations including wholesale access,” a spokesman told siliconrepublic.com.

The move to halt the launch of the service was welcomed by the Association of Licensed Telecommunications Operators (ALTO) which said the move would have once again impacted on competition in the marketplace.

It is believed the move would have made bitstream — effectively reselling Eircom’s broadband product — more attractive than local loop unbundling (LLU) services, a direction the industry has been campaigning to move in for some time.

“Once again we see an attempt by Eircom to shape the market to its own advantage and that of its retail arm” said Liam O’Halloran, chairman of ALTO.

“The biggest seller of bitstream is Eircom so it beggars belief that it could be so blatant in its attempts to favour its own business with this product.”

According to O’Halloran, if capacity-based bitstream is introduced it will also have a detrimental effect on the LLU market.

“Eircom has opposed tooth and nail the development of LLU and is providing the service under regulatory obligation only.

“Because the pricing of the product is capacity-based, it reduces the cost of bitstream and makes LLU less viable as a business model.

“If this product is not to distort the market, we will need to see a reduction in LLU pricing in order to maintain market competitiveness”, O’Halloran said.

By John Kennedy

mike76

Still don't understand whether com reg blocking it is a good or a bad thing, if it's bad for operators but good fo me do I care? - seems to be what the guy is suggesting - that it's bad for LLU. Do I care? Should I? Anyone care to enlighten?

bk

mike76 wrote:

Still don't understand whether com reg blocking it is a good or a bad thing, if it's bad for operators but good fo me do I care? - seems to be what the guy is suggesting - that it's bad for LLU. Do I care? Should I? Anyone care to enlighten?

It is bad for the customer in the short term but very good for the customer in the long term.

It would seem that Eircom wanted to launch a product where everyone gets "upto" 6mb/s *, instead of the current scenario where Eircom have three different products at 1m, 2m and 3m, they would have three products all at 6m and instead charge differently for three different caps (e.g. 10Gig, 20Gig, 30Gig).

This is how BT in the UK operate. This makes LLU based 8m products a lot less attractive as the high wholesale price of LLU would mean that LLU operators couldn't compete with Eircoms cheaper 6m small cap product that most people would likely to sign up for.

This would strangle the birth of LLU in Ireland.

LLU is vital for good competitive bb in Ireland. If LLU takes off in Ireland, we could in the long term of a situation like in France where most people get 24mb/s, 100 channel digital TV and phone for about €30 per month over LLU, this is what Eircom are trying to stop.

* of course the vast majority of people won't get more then 1 or 2m, the 6m "upto" isn't a guarantee.

mike76

How can LLU operators offer 24mb, I thought they were able to offer up to 8mb? Does this mean I'm going to be denied a 6mb because there's games going on between comreg and eircom?

Tom Young

Actually some operators have requested these products of eircom wholesale and as such it has upsides and down sides. The main down side is the push it creates to take more. It stands to go against LLU markets to, so the current ARO - LLU takers possibly won't want it. It would be a decent offering to try help reduct certain costs to Wholesalers.

SkepticOne

mike76 wrote:

How can LLU operators offer 24mb, I thought they were able to offer up to 8mb? Does this mean I'm going to be denied a 6mb because there's games going on between comreg and eircom?

If they install ADSL2+ equipment they can go up to 24 mb for users close to the exchange.

bk

mike76 wrote:

How can LLU operators offer 24mb, I thought they were able to offer up to 8mb?

ADSL can go up to about 8m, ADSL2+ can go up to 24m.

Most LLU operators with relatively new gear (Smart, Magnet, etc.) and pretty much all LLU operators abroad use 24m gear.

Of course you won't get the full 24m, but a decent line in an urban area should be able to get about 16m.

mike76 wrote:

Does this mean I'm going to be denied a 6mb because there's games going on between comreg and eircom?

Yes, but it is worth it, it means you might be able to get 10 - 20m BB in the near future instead of being stuck with 6m BB and an awful low cap for an awful long time.

Don't forget about the caps, unlike the current scenarios, the caps will definitely be enforced under these products.

What is the point of 6m when you will use up your cap in just one or two days if you actually use the 6m?

It is just a marketing ploy by Eircom, they know that most ordinary people don't understand or know about caps and instead just look at the top speed and price when comparing packages.

I'd rather have Smart 3m with an unlimited cap then Eircom 6m with a 10Gig cap any day.