Motor Tax Rates

BaZmO*

Hi,

I'm trying to find out what are the Motor Tax Rates for a Diesel car as opposed to a Petrol and the rates given on the Motortax.ie website don't seem to differentiate between the two.

Any ideas?

R.O.R

That's because it's based solely on engine size, fuel type / CO2 emissions are not taken in to account (yet)

BaZmO*

R.O.R wrote:

That's because it's based solely on engine size,

Really? I thought a 1.9 Diesel was more expensive than a 1.9 Petrol. No?

fletch

R.O.R wrote:

That's because it's based solely on engine size

Yes...to a point. They charge more for the 1.3 rotary engine found in the Mazda RX-8.

bazz26

fletch wrote:

Yes...to a point. They charge more for the 1.3 rotary engine found in the Mazda RX-8.

Thats the exception rather than the rule though.

Currently motor tax is generally based on engine capacity.

C_Breeze

fletch wrote:

Yes...to a point. They charge more for the 1.3 rotary engine found in the Mazda RX-8.

What a shower of "!4%#*& !!!

obviously never heard of the saying .. "you made your bed and you sleep in it"

JoeA3

BaZmO* wrote:

Really? I thought a 1.9 Diesel was more expensive than a 1.9 Petrol. No?

Nope, its purely down to CC, regardless of fuel type.

prospect

Only based on cc of the engine.

However there can be a difference netween two 1.9L cars, for example:

A Vag 1.9 diesel is actually 1893cc (afaik) which is 1.8 -> 1.9 for tax purposes.
A Fiat 1.9 diesel is actually 1905cc (afaik) which is 1.9 -> 2.0 for tax purposes.

I recently changed my 1.9 Alfa for a 2.0 Toyota, yet the tax remained the same for this reason, the Alfa was 1905cc and the Toyota is 1998cc, so the same tax bracket applies, even though they have different engine capacities.

RobAMerc

prospect wrote:

I recently changed my 1.9 Alfa for a 2.0 Toyota

I thought I could hear someone crying uncontrollably the other night was that you?

Sorry OP.

prospect

RobAMerc wrote:

I thought I could hear someone crying uncontrollably the other night was that you?

Sorry OP.

LOL,

Boot on 147 was to small for baby stuff. Got a RAV4, how macho.:D



Not actually a bad car though. And averaging 38Mpg so far.

Henry Ford III

Be aware that the budget in Nov. may well change all this.

I expect reductions for hybrids, diesels (modern cleaner ones) and ffv vehicles.

Pep

I expect reductions for hybrids, diesels (modern cleaner ones) and ffv vehicles.

When you say cleaner ones in regards to diesel what do you mean? As in old diesels will have higher CO2? What would be regarded as a clean diesel?

C_Breeze

Pep wrote:

When you say cleaner ones in regards to diesel what do you mean? As in old diesels will have higher CO2? What would be regarded as a clean diesel?

Emission standards. EURO3, EURO4 etc etc

Henry Ford III

Yes. 2nd generation common rail diesels and ones with that filter dpf(?) which cleans emissions.

Pep

Emission standards. EURO3, EURO4 etc etc

Where would TDi and TDDI engines fit in? Are they clean or not?

testicle

If only there was some way to search the internet.

Anan1

testicle wrote:

If only there was some way to search the internet.

Henry Ford III

Pep wrote:

Where would TDi and TDDI engines fit in? Are they clean or not?

Tdi have been around yonks. Bepends on which and when.

Tddi. Unlikely.

IncredibleHulk

BaZmO* wrote:

Hi,

I'm trying to find out what are the Motor Tax Rates for a Diesel car as opposed to a Petrol and the rates given on the Motortax.ie website don't seem to differentiate between the two.

Any ideas?

Call tax office

BaZmO*

IncredibleHulk wrote:

Call tax office

Thanks for the advice buddy.

E92

Henry Ford III wrote:

I expect reductions for hybrids, diesels (modern cleaner ones) and ffv vehicles.

I don't know about the Hybrids, remember they already have a(underserved) substantial reduction already. Some of them are going to be very expensive, compared to rivals.


Lets start with the Prius. It pollutes 104 g/km of CO2. Trouble is, that the Mini Cooper D does exactly the same. Or the VW Polo Bluemotion; thats cleaner than either car, with CO2 emissions of just 102 g/km. Now, I know there is change in the air, but what makes the Prius so enviornmentally sspecial that it should get a 50% rebate in VRT, while the paraffin stoves don't?(especially as one of them is cleaner than the Prius)

Or what about the Honda Civic Hybrid? Thats dirter compared to good old fashioned diesel MINI, at 109 g/km.

Actually Honda in the US have decided that instead of a V6 Hybrid as the eco conscious Accord(which has had piss poor sales apparantly), which is what the current Accord uses, the next Accord for the US won't bother with a Hybrid, and have a non Hybrid diesel, which is even cleaner than the Euro 5 emissions requirements.

Keeeping with this theme of supposed enviornemtal friendliness, lets have a look at the Lexus RX400h. At 192 g/km, this is certainly very impressive for a large 4X4, let alone one with a petrol under the bonnet, but the BMW E70 X5 3.0d does 214 g/km, not exactly a CO2 belcher now is it?(even though some eco mentalist fools will tell you that they all(4X4s) produce 500 g/km of CO2). There is no question that the Lexus is cleaner, but is it that much cleaner that it deserves a 50% rebate? I think not.


Now, lets turn to the Lexus LS 600h. It pollutes 219 g/km of CO2. Now when one considers, that this is from a 5 litre V8 S-class type car, it sure is a very impressive result, but it is still easily bettered by a petrol Audi A8(admittedly a 2.8, but Lexus says that the LS600h will give V6 economy and the 2.8 A8 is a V6) with 199 g/km, which is amazingly considerably better than the 3.0TDi A8(at 223 g/km). The LS600h is also more polluting than the 730d/730Ld(another 6pot, admittedly diesel)210 g/km and 212 g/km respectively, and mere 1 g/km better than the Merc S320 CDi.

Now technologically(engines related anyway), the Lexus is streets ahead of any of these cars, indeed the Lexus makes the rest look like cars from pre historic times. And the Lexus is a 5 litre V8, and the cars its being compared to are 3 litre 6 pot diesels or a 2.8 V6 petrol.

But the Lexus is, at present entitled to a 50% reduction in CO2 because its a Hybrid, when there are diesels out there which are better for the enviornment, or so close that it hardly matters, or even old fashioned petrols which are quite a bit better.


There are plenty of Petrols and diesels out there which can match, and in some cases beat the CO2 emissions of Hybrids, but these are a lot cheaper to make. Hybrids as they are, are expensive anyway, so as always I'm willing to be proved wrong, but I just don't see where the savings are going to come from.


EDIT: I'm only after realising that its Car Tax rates that were being mentioned here, sorry about that, yes I would definately concur with Henry Ford III, there will be substantial reductions for Hybrids, and the other cars mentioned above by me as regards Motor Tax.

I interpreted the word Motor Tax as including VRT, very sorry about that.

TJJP

Not likely to be retrospective. Current rates will remain for pre January '08 (or '09?) cars. Only new cars are expected to be included under the new CO2 based system. See consultation doc at:
http://www.environ.ie/en/LocalGovernment/MotorTax/MotorTaxConsultation/

rowanh

e92, one reason for hybrid cars to get the vrt reduction and not lower emmission cars is that it gives an incentive to buy the hybrid cars which is the long run is a good thing as it will help electric cars come about.

daedalus2097

It's well known that hybrids have more work to do when they're running on the engine, what with having to charge all those batteries and carry them around. But they do have a major advantage when they're sitting still in traffic when they'll be producing 0g of CO2. Maybe this is the main reason they get the breaks - to reduce pollution in congested cities at peak times?

E92

rowanh wrote:

e92, one reason for hybrid cars to get the vrt reduction and not lower emmission cars is that it gives an incentive to buy the hybrid cars which is the long run is a good thing as it will help electric cars come about.

But unless electric cars are charged up by a power source that uses solar panels, then its no more enviornmentally efficient than a normal car, which defeats the purpose.

Electric cars produce no pollution when they are being driven, but when they are being charged up from a fossil fuel source(i.e normal electricity) they most certainly do produce quite a bit of pollution, and unlike in a fossil fuel car, using things like the radio will drain the power of an electric car much faster, as the electricity has to provide all of these things(in a fossil fuel car the useage of a radio makes such a small difference to fuel consumption they can't measure it). Also in an electric car, they are at their most efficient when they are stopped or moving very slowly(they are very inefficient at higher speeds), most unlike a fossil fuel car, which is at its most efficient at Motorway speeds.


As regards Hybrids, there is the issue of supposed fuel efficiency, I'm not going into it again, it has been discussed several times here already, but basically many Hybrid owners report that they are not anything like as efficient as the official mpg figures would have you believe.(the Prius is repeatedly said to average the mid 40s in terms of mpg, a long way off the claimed average of 65.7 mpg). Hybrids are only efficient in traffic and at low speeds, because the engine doesn't need to be working there. Everywhere else they are no better than a conventional car.

The examples of the cars I mentioned above sure are a lot less efficient in the Urban mpg cycle than a Hybrid(which is town driving), but a heck of a lot moreefficient than a Hybrid in the Extra Urban cycle(which is out of town and Motorway driving).
So its swings and roundabouts.

Is pollution in out of town driving 'worse' than in town pollution? I mean CO2 pollution is exactly that, whether its created by driving slowly in toewn, or driving quickly out of town on Motorways. No matter where its produced, its still going to cause enviornmental damage.

richie_rvf

....and the cost of disposing of these hybrid cars!!

thats why I drive a 5.0 V8 :rolleyes:

E92

richie_rvf wrote:

....and the cost of disposing of these hybrid cars!!

thats why I drive a 5.0 V8 :rolleyes:

So true. There are alledged issues about the supposed enviornmentally friendliness(or rather the lack of it) of the energy required in making all the batteries and other complex equipment that a Hybrid needs to function.

rowanh

E92 wrote:

But unless electric cars are charged up by a power source that uses solar panels, then its no more enviornmentally efficient than a normal car, which defeats the purpose.

.

Well first off that is incorrect, cars running on coal powered electricity is more enviromentally friendly than running cars on petrol.

Secondly and far more importantly there is nothing stopping cars being run on alternative energy other than the stupidity and shortsitedness of mankind.

If you have an electric car and want to power it with alternative energy simply switch form the ESB to airtricity its cheaper and completly reliable..

richie_rvf

http://www.pistonheads.co.uk/news/default.asp?storyId=16687