Help me if you can I'm feeling down

fuzzbox

1/2 6-max
Hero is like 32/24 or something.
Villain is 17/9/2.5

Effective stacks 280

Earlier, villain stacked hero when hero hit a straight and villain called flop and turn and backdoored a flush.

Preflop
Hero opens to 5 with QQ, villain calls, shorty blind calls

Flop (16)
8 6 3 r
chk, hero bets 12, villain calls, bb folds.

Villain has mostly just folded to CBs

Turn (40)
4o

hero checks (!!), villain bets 33, hero calls

River (103)
8
hero checks, villain bets 75 quickly, and hero?

Macspower

HERO should have stack-a-donked the turn maybe?

I call now.....

BTW if you don't mind me asking I notice in some of your posts you seem to open for 2.5bb's (ie 5). Is that your general opening ammount.... is it a strategy?....... and why?

thanks,

Mac (love your titles as usual;) )

NeoSlicerZ

Why open to 5?? Just curious as it seems pretty small to me. I vary between a fold and a call... leaning more towards a fold, though MUTBS tells me he has a house.

spectre

I think I call, he'll often turn up here with 99-JJ, 55 and 45

cardshark202

Call but lead turn. Don't see any reason to check there, esp if you've been playing very aggressive

coillcam

Man you wrote the book on extracting value when I stumbled across this forum.

Made hand: create pot (raise to 7/8 PF) and protect hand, you don't want em' in cheap. Pot would be $22+ so now you can bet $17 on flop, more value yayh!

Bet when ahead. On flop for value and protection and the same for the turn.

As played I am calling connolly station on the river.

opr

I call.

Fuzz : Interested to hear why you check the turn here ? Is this just to mix things up or do you think he range is sufficently narrow after calling the flop that no value is gained by betting ?

Opr

fuzzbox

spectre wrote:

I think I call, he'll often turn up here with 99-JJ, 55 and 45

Do you really think that? Or are you just justifying a call?

fuzzbox

opr wrote:

I call.

Fuzz : Interested to hear why you check the turn here ? Is this just to mix things up or do you think he range is sufficently narrow after calling the flop that no value is gained by betting ?

Opr

Ok, first let me say that I would normally bet.
Now, the board is 863r, and I have raised pre, and he has called me on the flop. The flop is pretty drawless, so its fairly unlikely that he has a draw, so his range is kinda polarised towards TT/99/sets, with the odd 77/55 thrown in, and a very few 89s and 87s kinda stuff, but not too much. Thus, I'm usually Way ahead or way behind.
I didnt really think he would pay me off if I used a bet/bet/bet line.

So I checked the turn, and he bet, and i called.

Now I checked the river 8, and he insta bet big. I dont find that ppl bet big v.often on the river at these levels with < 1 pair, so I ask the question - should I call?

Ste05

I'm playing pretty badly at the moment and tilting, but I would tilt call using the excuse that we induced bluffs by check calling the turn and checking the River.

But I'm starting to think people float alot less then I give them credit for, but it's a pretty nice flop for a float and then to try and win the pot later, from a loose aggro opponent like your stats would indicate. Although I don't know what level thinking he'd be playing at.

fuzzbox

Ste05 wrote:

I'm playing pretty badly at the moment and tilting, but I would tilt call using the excuse that we induced bluffs by check calling the turn and checking the River.

But I'm starting to think people float alot less then I give them credit for, but it's a pretty nice flop for a float and then to try and win the pot later, from a loose aggro opponent like your stats would indicate. Although I don't know what level thinking he'd be playing at.

I think this is a nice flop for a LAG to float Vs a TAG, but not the other way around.

spectre

fuzzbox wrote:

Do you really think that? Or are you just justifying a call?

ya but I'm a complete station.

If I thought he'd flat call on the flop with a set I'd fold but his agro factor indicates otherwise.

opr

Yeah i liked the line as you said i don't think we get 3 steets of value from the hands in Villian range that we beat.

My only problem here with checking is that usually we would be hoping he might bluff a % of the time. As you say villian very rarely floats the flop and with very few draws it means he can't really show up on the river with air or a draw.

I think this means that if we do check the turn we should always be folding the river against a B/B line from Villian as surely we lose value from hands like 9,9/10,10 that may have called a 3 barrel. Because if we call the river its effectively a 3 barrel hand only difference being that we allowed Villian fire the last 2 barrels with the range he wanted which is mostly hands that have us beat.

So i change my mind and fold

Opr

valor

i just keep betting here, and as played I think its a marginal fold

why are you opening for 5?

Hitman Actual

valor wrote:

why are you opening for 5?

Is Fuzzbox the villain???

Killme00

fuzzbox wrote:

villain bets 75 quickly, and hero?

How quicky? The speed of the bet can also tell you if he is bluffing, but you know this.

The size of the bet? We have to call 75 to win 181 (stating the obvious). I like two types of bluffing bet, a small bet which looks like it wants a call can be scary and can induce a fold...or the pot sized bet which speaks for itself. This 75 is an intelligent bet half way between pot and a small value bet which to me screams 8 or better.

i am folding this river and am clearly overthinking this hand

fuzzbox

Results:
I folded

I think I should have bet the turn. I think my line wasnt so great after all.

Ho hum