OP confused about crash statistics

Niall1234

Saw this on another thread.

According to the RSA, the Gardai and most media outlets, we keep hearing that Speeding is the number on cause for collisions on our roads.

Why is it then that the following PDF states that only 13% of road collisions are caused by speeding:

http://www.nra.ie/PublicationsResources/DownloadableDocumentation/RoadSafety/file,1948,en.pdf

Bee

Niall1234 wrote:

Saw this on another thread.

According to the RSA, the Gardai and most media outlets, we keep hearing that Speeding is the number on cause for collisions on our roads.

Why is it then that the following PDF states that only 13% of road collisions are caused by speeding:

http://www.nra.ie/PublicationsResources/DownloadableDocumentation/RoadSafety/file,1948,en.pdf

Beause the RSA, the Gardai can absolve themselves of blame for their pathetic an unprofessional road safety actions.

Any driver can see the Gardai failing in their duty by observing where they most commonly set up their (nothing to do with road safety) speed traps.

As usual they take the "fish in a barrel approach" and set the speed traps on safe roads to maximise their score rate rather than do anything to catch the real traffic culprits.

The RSA chant of "Speed Kills" is bull droppings. Inappropriate speed kills but of course they only illustrate their own unprofessionalism and narrow mind set in road safety.

Expect a major emphasis on speed related propaganda when the new Cash Cameras are incorrectly installed on safe roads to raise profits and revenue rather than do anything to prevent fatalities

Niall1234

Gardai just love putting speed traps in

1. Areas with 50 kph limit, yet which aren't residential
2. Roads with 80 kph which formally had 100 kph due to new bypasses being built.

Prime places to catch people out but where crashes aren't that likely.

Wishbone Ash

Niall1234 wrote:

we keep hearing that Speeding is the number on cause for collisions on our roads.

Are you perhaps confusing it with the "number one cause of FATAL collisions"?

If the Gardaí are conducting speed checks on busy 'safe' roads then that's a positive thing. It creates an awareness among motorists and is referred to as "High Visibility Policing". There are regularly threads on this forum about the absence of Gardaí on our major roads especially about their absence on the country's busiest road. Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

If the Gardaí were to set up a speed check on a rural road they might catch a few speeders but it would be counter-productive and the general message would be lost . It would be like advertising in a newspaper that no one reads.

A person who speeds on a rural road is also more likely to speed on a national road and vice-versa.

Others regularly complain that speeding fines are a form of stealth tax. If that is so, it's the only tax I know where one can choose whether to contribute or not. Most of the people convicted for speeding offences are travelling at more that 50% higher that the posted limit even though offenders will try to convince others that they were 'just above' the limit.

Anyway, this type of thread has been done to death.

mike65

Where's the "lie" (in a legal sense) exactly?

Mike.

ressem

Note that this 13% is for two vehicle collisions only, where it's dwarfed by "Wrong side of road". So government publicity has been focused on drink driving.

I think that the link has changed to
http://www.nra.ie/Publications/DownloadableDocumentation/RoadSafety/file,3629,en.pdf

Road collision facts in 2004.

Figure 9: Two Vehicle Fatal Collisions in 2004 Classified by
Contributory Action
Went to wrong side of road 40%
Other action 26%
Exceeded safe speed limit 13%
Drove through stop/yield 12%
Improper overtaking 9%
Drove through traffic signal 1%

But this neglects all the other road fatalities. The paragraph on page 5 explains why there is focus on speeding.

Thirty-six per cent of all fatal collisions in 2004 were single vehicle only collisions.
This represents an increase of three percentage points over the 2003 situation.
This collision type, which involves no other road user, is strongly associated with
two causal factors, namely excessive speed and / or alcohol consumption.

Besides slowing down lessens the damage, and doesn't involve waiting on upgrading all the bothareens to do something.

Niall1234

THink about it this way though.

As you claim, Gardai do speed checks on main roads to show that they do speed checks.

But if everyone knows that Gardai don't do speed checks on byroads, then whats to stop them from speeding on them ?

ressem

Niall1234 wrote:

THink about it this way though.

As you claim, Gardai do speed checks on main roads to show that they do speed checks.

But if everyone knows that Gardai don't do speed checks on byroads, then whats to stop them from speeding on them ?

I've seen speedchecks on N and R grade roads.
So for the rest we depend on personal and community responsibility (which shockingly enough works for some), fear of being stuck behind a tractor, anti-speed publicity and anti-vehicle potholes.

Wishbone Ash

Niall1234 wrote:

if everyone knows that Gardai don't do speed checks on byroads, then whats to stop them from speeding on them ?

Speed checks are occasionally placed on these roads. There are occasional threads here from drivers caught speeding on rural roads and complaining that the Gardaí should be "checking the main roads where everybody is speeding".

(Recently, a boardsie was complaining about being 'done' on a back road in Co Clare at 2am).

BendiBus

Looking at those statistics, it seems the number one cause of crashes is crap driving (speeding, drinking, ignoring signs, bad overtaking). So blame the instruction/testing regime, or blame drivers.

Tackle the cause of accidents. Much more effective (but less satisfying?) than blaming the Gardai.

Chris_533976

Went to wrong side of road 40%

Although this is unforgivable, I wonder what percentage of this is people getting frustrated in a convoy stuck behind a tractor on a windy single carriage road with no overtaking opportunities?

Zoney

Niall1234 wrote:

According to the RSA, the Gardai and most media outlets, we keep hearing that Speeding is the number on cause for collisions on our roads.

Presumably because the other categories of accidents have worse results at higher speeds? It's basic physics.

OK - "cause for collisions" isn't logical. But speed is surely the most critical factor in most accidents?

lostexpectation

why would people go to the other side wrong side of the road?

would speeding be a subpart of this?

or not because improper overtaking is listed there too, so its not about bad overtaking...

Yoda

I think they should publish statistics on which cars are death-traps and which are not.

Victor

That file has been moved as the NRA site has been redesigned. http://www.nra.ie/Publications/DownloadableDocumentation/RoadSafety/file,3629,en.pdf In any case, the newer 2005 figures are here: http://www.rsa.ie/publication/publication/upload/2005%20Road%20Collision%20Facts.pdf

Went to wrong side of road 40%

Although this is unforgivable, I wonder what percentage of this is people getting frustrated in a convoy stuck behind a tractor on a windy single carriage road with no overtaking opportunities?

No, its essentially that the driver failed to keep the vehicle on their side of the road, whether through drink / drug / fatigue, inattention, distraction or other cause of loss of control.

Yoda wrote:

I think they should publish statistics on which cars are death-traps and which are not.

Well there is the rating system EuroNCAP http://www.euroncap.com/home.aspx - although this deals with laboratory tests, not forensic examination after an incident. There may be a difference due to how cars are used and driven.

BrianD

Bee wrote:

Beause the RSA, the Gardai can absolve themselves of blame for their pathetic an unprofessional road safety actions.

Any driver can see the Gardai failing in their duty by observing where they most commonly set up their (nothing to do with road safety) speed traps.

As usual they take the "fish in a barrel approach" and set the speed traps on safe roads to maximise their score rate rather than do anything to catch the real traffic culprits.

The RSA chant of "Speed Kills" is bull droppings. Inappropriate speed kills but of course they only illustrate their own unprofessionalism and narrow mind set in road safety.

Expect a major emphasis on speed related propaganda when the new Cash Cameras are incorrectly installed on safe roads to raise profits and revenue rather than do anything to prevent fatalities

this is a load of old cock and bull and people love to perpetuate the myth to cover for the fact that they weren't looking where they are going and paying attention.

I would agree that the Gardai need to do more speedtraps in more diverse locations. Anybody who believes that speed traps are positioned to create revenue simply is in cloud cuckoo land.

Also are speed limits aren't that different to those in other countries so I don't what the fuss is about. There was a whole debate about speed limits on HQDC's this week and failure of the minister to review them. he was right there is nothing to review as there damn all dual carraigeways that are in need of review.

in any case the difference between a 100km journey at the higher speed limit is only 10min so hardly worth the effort.

People who disregard the speed limits are the real culprits.