Aer Lingus unions 48hr Strike next Tueday/Wednesday

mike65

from rte

Almost 500 Aer Lingus pilots who are members of the Irish Airline Pilots' Association are to stage a 48-hour strike next week.

The industrial action is being taken over the pay and conditions of pilots who will be employed at Belfast International airport.

The union says the new pilots will have less favourable terms and conditions of employment.

Union officials say pilots would not be eligible for the existing pension scheme and they could not avail of existing agreements.

The strike is due to take place next Tuesday and Wednesday and all Aer Lingus routes will be affected for 48 hours.

The airline, which is seeking to employ 25 to 30 pilots for its Belfast base, has described the decision as bitterly disappointing, accusing the pilots of attacking customers.

A spokesperson for the company also said the action directly ignores the recommendations of both the Labour Court and the Flynn report earlier this year that the company should be allowed to proceed with opening bases outside the Republic.

How to win freinds and influence people. Not.

Mike.

ongarite

Haha someone in the big Shannon-LHS mentioned that this exact thing would happen.

Transport21 Fan

Is this for real or just chest beating?

ongarite

While I don't agree with the strike at all, for the pilot unions to stand idly by while pilots at new hub in Belfast are hired on lower terms and pay than they are currently on, would erode there future bargaining power and wish to keep the things the same.

Victor

Why base them in Belfast, seeing as they already base people out of Heathrow or would Heathrow be more expensive again?

minikin

shower of knackers!!! have a 7.10 aerlingus flight to italy on tuesday... have worked hard all year, this trip to lake garda has been keeping me going for a while. Really feel like parking in front of some pilots driveway, see how they like it when their lives are fecked with.

KC61

Victor wrote:

Why base them in Belfast, seeing as they already base people out of Heathrow or would Heathrow be more expensive again?

There are no flight crew based in Heathrow. The only flight crew base is Dublin, and possibly Cork. Crews overnight at Heathrow as appropriate.

Cabin crew are, on the other hand, based in Dublin, Cork and Shannon.

Victor

But they do base 2(?) aircraft in London.

KC61

Victor wrote:

But they do base 2(?) aircraft in London.

The aircraft are not "based" as such in London.

There are three aircraft overnight there, one to operate the Shannon service and two to operate the early Heathrow/Dublin services. The Shannon aircraft and the other two rotate with other aircraft on the Dublin/Heathrow route the next day to get back to the Dublin base.

The cabin crew are from Dublin, Shannon or Cork and stay in hotels overnight.

Heathrow is not a base.

jrar

Have the pilots forgotten they are share-holders in Aer Lingus ? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot !

IF Aer Lingus are going to offer competitive T's & C's to Belfast-based staff as befits the N. Ireland marketplace, what skin is it off the Dublin-based pilots noses ? They're still being paid as per the local economy and any pay-agreements applying to this jurisdiction - grounding the company's fleet and losing out on 2 days business at a busy time of the year like this is not going to do anyone any favours in terms of customer service, lost revenue, etc.

Fratton Fred

Sounds like the plots are proving Aer Lingus right in moving out of the "Republic".

Aer lingus will pay whatever they need to and if that is less than they currently pay pilots, then so be it, its called market forces.

markpb

ongarite wrote:

While I don't agree with the strike at all, for the pilot unions to stand idly by while pilots at new hub in Belfast are hired on lower terms and pay than they are currently on, would erode there future bargaining power and wish to keep the things the same.

If they're saying it's unacceptable for a company to pay the going rates in the economy the employees are being hired from, they need a serious health check.

Fun times ahead with the Eircom staff threatening to block the split and sale of Eircom "at all costs and using all means possible". I often wonder what investors buying up old Irish semi-states make of this malarky.

FlutterinBantam

Dermot Mannion promised to pay best of industry rates for pilots hired outside the ROI.
EI pilots have been building up to this for some time and it has all the ingredients to be a bitter,divisive row as the end game for the "old" Aer Lingus begins to kick off.

As usual the long suffering passenger takes the brunt.

Red Alert

Aer Lingus is a private company, I'm not a shareholder in it so frankly I don't care about its management or its pilots. On one hand we have the whingers in Shannon and on the other we have the Mannion vs Pilots sideshow - it's a sorry mess for the airline that has over-concerned itself with Michael O'Leary's antics.

ixoy

I've got a flight for Monday week and now am wondering if my whole holiday is finished before it began, due to the threat of escalation

Do they honestly think this is a proportionate response? To start off with a 2-day strike at peak season and then escalate from there? Thounsads stranded instantly, with many of those customers, I'm sure, already making long term plans on whether they're going to use Aer Lingus again if this is the response from its employees. For the worry I'm already feeling, I can pretty safely say they won't be getting my money again and I'm sure my view is reflected by many of those who were going to be using them in the weeks ahead.

FlutterinBantam

KC61 wrote:

There are no flight crew based in Heathrow. The only flight crew base is Dublin, and possibly Cork. Crews overnight at Heathrow as appropriate.

Cabin crew are, on the other hand, based in Dublin, Cork and Shannon.

I always thought EI had London based cabin crew.... they used to have anyway,must have changed.

bill_ashmount

ixoy wrote:

I've got a flight for Monday week and now am wondering if my whole holiday is finished before it began, due to the threat of escalation

Do they honestly think this is a proportionate response? To start off with a 2-day strike at peak season and then escalate from there? Thounsads stranded instantly, with many of those customers, I'm sure, already making long term plans on whether they're going to use Aer Lingus again if this is the response from its employees. For the worry I'm already feeling, I can pretty safely say they won't be getting my money again and I'm sure my view is reflected by many of those who were going to be using them in the weeks ahead.

It happened to me before with AL. Vowed never to fly with them again if it all possible, haven't done so since either
I know it's not much consolation but there isn't really anything you can do.

markf909

Anyone hear Dermot Mannion coin a new GUBU on Morning Ireland?

The unions were "delaying confusing obfuscating and filibustering".

Tom Dunne

jrar wrote:

Have the pilots forgotten they are share-holders in Aer Lingus ? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot !

This is the part I just don't get. Do they actually want their own company to go down the swanny? Do they want to generate ill-will among passengers? This reeks of 1980's industrial relations.

I am in the middle of planning next years holidays to the US and I for one will be doing my best to avoid Aer Lingus where possible.

markpb

tom dunne wrote:

This is the part I just don't get. Do they actually want their own company to go down the swanny? Do they want to generate ill-will among passengers? This reeks of 1980's industrial relations.

I guess they're still working on the 1980's assumption that the public will support them and the company will cave in because the government is weak. If you believe that, then you (as a pilot) will be fine and the company will recover so your share are fine too.

jrar

markpb wrote:

I guess they're still working on the 1980's assumption that the public will support them and the company will cave in because the government is weak. If you believe that, then you (as a pilot) will be fine and the company will recover so your share are fine too.

I hope it holds fine for them !! I think they'll find little or no public "sympathy" for well-paid professionals to be voluntarily withdrawing their labour over some self-serving point of principle.....apart of course for the Shannon whingers who will see this as some sort of vindication of their position to date on the Aer Lingus xfer to Belfast.

mickoneill30

tom dunne wrote:

This is the part I just don't get. Do they actually want their own company to go down the swanny? Do they want to generate ill-will among passengers? This reeks of 1980's industrial relations.

Agreed. Aer Lingus is a private company now. The government isn't going to save their asses if they get into financial difficulty.
Lets see, Aer Lingus pulls a route to Belfast because they can make more money from it. Irish pilots pull a strike. That'll make Irish routes more attractive for Aer Linus all right.

bill_ashmount

Just noticed this on the RTE website:

Aer Lingus Chief Executive Dermot Mannion said the starting pay for pilots in Belfast would be €113,000, which he said was very much in line with what is paid in the Republic.


How is anyone expected to survive on only €113,000 a year :rolleyes:

mickoneill30

bill_ashmount wrote:

Just noticed this on the RTE website:

Aer Lingus Chief Executive Dermot Mannion said the starting pay for pilots in Belfast would be €113,000, which he said was very much in line with what is paid in the Republic.


How is anyone expected to survive on only €113,000 a year :rolleyes:

I heard him on Newstalk thismorning. He was saying Captains for €113,000. I dunno what the ranks are for pilots but I was assuming the Captain is the boss of the plane.

Red Alert

The pilots are entitled to withdraw their labour if they like. As shareholder they might also feel aggreived by the chief executive's decision.

FlutterinBantam

Yes its Captains starting salary... generally this would mean 10 years plus flying experience,probably with previous PIC experience .Co-Pilots or First Officers would earn less.

The stumbling block is the "black book" of conditions these dudes carry round.

Mannion wants to start from scratch in the North, these geezers want the "black book" to cross the border and clog the system with such a series of terms and conditions ans seniority issues, Einstein himself could not work with.


she's going to be dirty or will end in a puff of smoke.

mike65

Tis great the way the union thinks its writ should run on a global basis.

Mike.

Tom Dunne

WTF is Michael O'Leary up to, the sneaky fecker:

Ryanair has written to Aer Lingus requesting the EGM to allow the company's shareholders an opportunity to reverse the move to end its Shannon-Heathrow services.
Ryanair Chief Executive Michael O'Leary told a press conference in Shannon that the company would be willing, if requested by the Government, to use its 25% shareholding in the company to retain the Shannon-Heathrow link.

Source: http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0814/aerlingus1.html

I really can't figure out what he is trying to do. Publicity? Check. Piss of Aer Lingus? Check. Piss of the government? Check.

One thing we know for certain, there are alterior motives behind his sudden "caring" attitude towards the peple of Shannon.

You've gotta hand it to him, he's good.

mike65

O'Leary can't loose on this issue, the competition provided by aer lingus vis-a-via Ryanair is tiny it does'nt matter if they are competing on any routes or not. The EGM forces the government to act, will it be willing to stick to its current "assumed" postion?

Mike.

Red Alert

The government are saying on one hand that aer lingus is free to do whatever it likes as a private company. However they are one of the owners (along with the pilots), and it seems that O'Leary is finally showing them up as being indecisive and scared to make waves.

Funny how the government will probably be very quick to be out against the pilots (their fellow shareholder) when interviewed.

dowlingm

The govt should sell it's 25%. You can't be poacher and gamekeeper in a competitive market - same for the likes of ESB Generation and VHI.

I do note in the discussions on pprune.org some EI staff members (allowing for that you don't REALLY know who posters are) supporting the pilots but noting that the pilots allegedly weren't much help when the yellowpack staff were hired and CC, engineers etc. got the shaft. I wonder what the LHR CC are on compared to DUB CC. If it's less, then the flight deck are only getting what the CC already got.