Loosing faith in Jol

Dublin Spur

Almost 3 years in chagre now and we still look very loose in important areas.
Don't know how much of the blame can be attributed to Jol, but he definately has a big part to play.

He seems to be a nice bloke, but you need to be much more of a cnut to suceed at the hiest level. It think the Spurs job (expectations) might be too big for him to handle.

We've got two 5th place finishes and that's progress on the previous 10/15 seasons, but does anyone think that Jol can become another Wenger, Ferguson or Moruinho. I just don't think he has it in him to be that sucessful. And if this is true than why should Spurs stick with him. Shouldn't we always be looking to improve.

I-Bleed-White

For the foreseeable future I will stick by BMJ but I can see where the concerns are coming from. Even if I were to agree we needed a change it's always a lot easier to say we need a differant manager than to find one that fits the bill. In one of the other threads I noticed Gus Van H noted. He is a super manager but who wasn't excited by the arrival of Jaque Santini look how he worked out. Who has the premiership expierience to do a better job. Ferguson, Wenger, Mouriniho...don't see any of them taking the job.

It's been pointed out that we haven't got as strong a squad as we are led to believe and if this is true there is a good chance that replacing BMJ would do more damage then good. Even though we have finished 5th two seasons in a row has everone forgotten the cup runs. We may well be UEFA cup champions if it wasn't for a more than dubious penalty decision. We scared the sh1t out of Chelsea in the FA cup.

Lets not get greedy now things are leaning more in our favour than before. We have held on to ALL our star players this season, lets not forget the Carrick hangover at the start of last season. We have alot of injuries but even more potential. I think this season will be bright and it's only just begun.

COYS!

Dublin Spur

Understand what you are saying but if he is not the answer (ie long term sustained sucess) why continue to flog a dead horse and finish 5th or 6th every year. By doing this we are saying that it okay for Spurs to be mediocre.

It's a tricky one, no doubt, I just feel that time time may have come for a change and a bit of a rethink if we are ever going to win a major trophy again.

galinka

Witness Chelsea in Cup and Seville in home leg.

If i had a choice of Jol or Keane i know who i would take. Keane would never tolerate the performance we gave last Saturday a second time.

But we are Spurs - used to settling for 3rd best in London.:mad: for nearly 20 years.

BERBA

Bottom line as far as i'm concerned is BMJ spent £40m over the summer when he knew he needed a left winger and a centre mid player...only 8m took to the field last sat and he left 16.5m (Bent) on the bench...why is he spending this much money on a player to leave him on the bench?...he should be spending the bobs where we need strengthening!

BMJ was on about learning how to protect a 0-0 in the post match interview ...come on !!!..its sunderland were playin!!....he didn't have the bottle to take the risk and throw tarrabht or routledge in to the mix instead going for stalteri / tainio / gardner/malbranque ...players that will never ever win us anything or get us 4th for that matter. Here's hopin that dawson king bale lennon are back sooner rather than later or else were in trouble.
Very disgruntled that we let a good chance of starting with 3 wins before we play utd on aug 26th slip by.

Jol had been harpin on club website how he was unbeaten in the last 3 years of pre-season ....wake up and smell the coffee BMJ!!!...I reckon tomorrow night is a big night for BMJ...sink or swim!...6 pts a must from next 2 home games.

kierano29

Dublin Spur wrote:

Almost 3 years in chagre now and we still look very loose in important areas.
Don't know how much of the blame can be attributed to Jol, but he definately has a big part to play.

He seems to be a nice bloke, but you need to be much more of a cnut to suceed at the hiest level. It think the Spurs job (expectations) might be too big for him to handle.

We've got two 5th place finishes and that's progress on the previous 10/15 seasons, but does anyone think that Jol can become another Wenger, Ferguson or Moruinho. I just don't think he has it in him to be that sucessful. And if this is true than why should Spurs stick with him. Shouldn't we always be looking to improve.

My main concern is who do you get to replace him. The vast majority of the top managers will not work for spurs because of the director of football post and the amount of control he has. In most clubs the DoF position is to take a lot of the non-footy type work off the manager, so he can focus on team affairs. But at Spurs Comolli has a huge amout of control over who we sign. Could you see Ferguson, Mourinho, Benitez, Wenger or any top manager putting up with that? No.

There's also a strong argument for Martin Jol - 2 top 5 finishes in a row(and unlucky not to get CL 1st year), good cup runs last year (robbed out in Seville) and definitely a stronger squad this year(Kaboul,Taraabt,KPB,Bent...ETC).

Let's see what the next couple of games brings, but I think Jol should be given time and I think he's earned it. There's not too many prem teams that would not be affected by losing their 2 1st choice CB and their 2 1st choice LB. I guess we'll know in the next few weeks...


I think he deserves more time.

kierano29

Dublin Spur wrote:

Almost 3 years in chagre now and we still look very loose in important areas.
Don't know how much of the blame can be attributed to Jol, but he definately has a big part to play.

He seems to be a nice bloke, but you need to be much more of a cnut to suceed at the hiest level. It think the Spurs job (expectations) might be too big for him to handle.

We've got two 5th place finishes and that's progress on the previous 10/15 seasons, but does anyone think that Jol can become another Wenger, Ferguson or Moruinho. I just don't think he has it in him to be that sucessful. And if this is true than why should Spurs stick with him. Shouldn't we always be looking to improve.

My main concern is who do you get to replace him. The vast majority of the top managers will not work for spurs because of the director of football post and the amount of control he has. In most clubs the DoF position is to take a lot of the non-footy type work off the manager, so he can focus on team affairs. But at Spurs Comolli has a huge amout of control over who we sign. Could you see Ferguson, Mourinho, Benitez, Wenger or any top manager putting up with that? No.

There's also a strong argument for Martin Jol - 2 top 5 finishes in a row(and unlucky not to get CL 1st year), good cup runs last year (robbed out in Seville) and definitely a stronger squad this year(Kaboul,Taraabt,KPB,Bent...ETC).

Let's see what the next couple of games brings, but I think Jol should be given time and I think he's earned it. There's not too many prem teams that would not be affected by losing their 2 1st choice CB and their 2 1st choice LB. I guess we'll know in the next few weeks...


I think he deserves more time.

northlondon17

his choice off midfield is just depressing....!!! piss off tainio...!!! i saw it on sat nd i said "****" without a ball being kicked..:mad: :mad: :mad: i think our forwads nd defence are alright...but

therecklessone

galinka wrote:

If i had a choice of Jol or Keane i know who i would take. Keane would never tolerate the performance we gave last Saturday a second time.

I prefer my replacement managers proven TBH.

Keane might have bollocked the players after Saturday's performance, but where was his creativity? Richardson (who he slated in a ManYoo jersey) on the wing, a 35 year old Yorke in midfield?

Keane was a leader in the pitch, so were Robson and Bruce...would you take either? Mourinho played Conference-level as a player, but he's one of the top managers in Europe. If Jol goes I want proven quality, not another man trying to forge a reputation in management.

What intrigues me is how many people have suddenly lost faith in Jol after one game...I'll grant you, he's had his doubters before this week but the response to Sunderland is OTT. He gets at least until Xmas for me, if we're mid table and struggling then we look at replacements.

For me, Jol's weakness is he can't come up with a plan B...yet...Mourinho made about 8 tactical changes against us in the Cup last year and finally put enough pressure on for us to fold. Once we showed ourselves toothless on Saturday our hosts grew in confidence. There are obvious gaps in our squad, our midfield is too one-dimensional, there's little or no creativity (Lennon will be found out this season and Boateng is unproven) and far too many plodders. Up front we're blessed with four great strikers, but without service they'll always struggle against a well organised defence.

Tomorrow night could be a watershed for us, a convincing win would set us up nicely for another three points on Saturday...a defeat could leave us shattered and pointless by September...:(

KingdomYid

i agree tommorrow nite is big now but i think everybody should calm down a bit and see where we are after ten games or so.If we are in the top 4 or 5 then i dont think i will be complaining,lets just trust MJ for a little bit and stop this over reaction.Please keep the faith there will be better times ahead.

I-Bleed-White

KingdomYid wrote:

i agree tommorrow nite is big now but i think everybody should calm down a bit and see where we are after ten games or so.If we are in the top 4 or 5 then i dont think i will be complaining,lets just trust MJ for a little bit and stop this over reaction.Please keep the faith there will be better times ahead.

Too right

Kold

I think the real problem is that he's paying over the odds for underperforming players and we have no cover (except for in attack..). Ledley is a great player but without him (which has been a while) we have a **** weak core. As we saw on Saturday, our CD is ineffective and our CMFs can't hold ****. I hate to say this 2 seasons down the line but we still haven't replaced Carrick, there is bollocks all distribution and you'd think Jol would've sorted this out by now. That said, I don't see who I'd replace him with, he's gotten us this far and I still believe he'll have us challenging for 4th, the only thing that may let us down in that regard is our depth though. The top 3 talk about injuries but their benches could be starters for us.

hotspur

I don't think that any Spurs fan who knows what he's talking about could claim that Jol is a good tactician. Don't be fooled into thinking that we are just finding it hard to get wingers, the truth is Jol doesn't want to play them. He's a negative coach despite his rhetoric, and he would rather have Davids, Tainio, Malbranque and their ilk on the wing than a Lennon. I mean Jesus the guy even played Lennon behind the strikers in some important games last term.

I like the guy, as does everyone really, but if we are going to spend the money we have I would rather have a top European coach who has succeeded at the highest level, Jol hasn't.