Car Warranty

Pep

hey all,

As dealers only have to give you 3 months warranty on second hand cars, is there any company from which you can buy a "longer" warranty? I suppose its like extra insurance but it might be worth it.

Also can you haggle with car dealers to get extra time on a warranty?

bazz26

Pep wrote:

hey all,

As dealers only have to give you 3 months warranty on second hand cars, is there any company from which you can buy a "longer" warranty? I suppose its like extra insurance but it might be worth it.

Also can you haggle with car dealers to get extra time on a warranty?

Alot of dealers give 6 - 12 months used warranties. It really depends on the age/mileage of the car and who you are buying it from.

If your only being offered a 3 month warranty then try and haggle for a 6 month one or go to another garage and see what they are offering on a similar car.

Toyota, Nissan and a few other main dealers afaik offer up to 12 months warranty on any second hand car irrespective of make that is 8 years old or younger with less than 80k miles bought from them. In other words buy a 02 VW Golf from them and get a 12 month warranty, buy a 02 VW Golf from a VW dealer and he will probably give you only 6 months. That says alot to me about the confidence the VW dealer has in the used product he is selling.

Darragh29

bazz26 wrote:

Alot of dealers give 6 - 12 months used warranties. It really depends on the age/mileage of the car and who you are buying it from.

If your only being offered a 3 month warranty then try and haggle for a 6 month one or go to another garage and see what they are offering on a similar car.

Toyota, Nissan and a few other main dealers afaik offer up to 12 months warranty on any second hand car irrespective of make that is 8 years old or younger with less than 80k miles bought from them. In other words buy a 02 VW Golf from them and get a 12 month warranty, buy a 02 VW Golf from a VW dealer and he will probably give you only 6 months. That says alot to me about the confidence the VW dealer has in the used product he is selling.

I was in a Toyota dealership the other day and had a read of their 12 month warranty and the exclusions that were stated in the warranty. There is not much you could really claim for if you had a warranty problem.

OP, say you could buy an extended 12 month warranty for (notice not "with") your vehicle. Say I had a business that offered to provide you with an extended 12 month warranty (which would be a 12 month warranty from the date you took out the policy for 12 months afterwards), which included warranty in respect of the following components requiring replacement, should your vehicle develop a running problem or alternatively suffer a breakdown:

Engine
All internally lubricated parts inclusive of: pistons, piston rings and pins, crankshaft and main bearings, connecting rods and bearings, camshaft and bearings, timing gear chain and/or belt, rocker arms, shafts and bushings, valves, valve springs, guides and seats, push rods and lifters, oil pump; externally: water pump, mechanical and/or electric fuel pump, oil pan, flywheel, valve covers, engine mounts, intake and exhaust manifolds, distributor shaft, gear, and bushing, engine head(s), engine block, all internal parts within the turbo/supercharger housing, gaskets and seals if damaged as a result of failure of covered engine parts.

Transmission
All internally lubricated parts contained within an automatic transmission and transfer case inclusive of: clutches, bands, pumps, carrier assemblies, internal shafts, (main, intermediate, reaction), thrust washers and bearings, governor, valve body, servo and accumulator assemblies, torque converter, transmission mounts and shift linkage, throttle valve cable, case if damaged as a result of failure of covered automatic transmission parts. Internally lubricated parts contained within a manual transmission inclusive of: main shaft, coupler shaft, all gears, synchro hub assemblies, bearings, shift rails and internal shift forks, input shaft synchro rings and retainers, case if damaged as a result of failure of covered components. Internally lubricated parts within the trans-axle of a front wheel drive including ring and pinion gears, internal bearings, axle(s), and case if damaged by covered components.


Drive Axle
Parts contained within the differential housing including ring gear and pinion gears, bearings, differential housing if damaged by failure of internally lubricated parts, axle, and universal joints.



Air conditioning, cooling and heating
Factory installed compressor, clutch, condenser, heater core, blower motor, fan, and fan pulley.

Electrical & Computer
Starter, starter solenoid, alternator or generator, voltage regulator, windshield washer pump, wiper motors, sun/moon roof motors, trunk lid motor, engine control computer, ignition control module, blower motor, power seat motor, door window motors, power mirror motors, speedometer, tachometer, oil pressure gauge, water temperature gauge. electronic control module (ECM/ECU), ABS, climate control, primary fuel injection, Power train Control Module (PCM).

Sensors
Manifold pressure temperature, throttle position, mass air flow, oxygen, coolant temperature, vehicle speed, camshaft/crankshaft angle, wheel speed (ABS), and climate control sensors.

Steering
Steering gear, power steering pump, steering column shafts and coupling, rack and pinion.

Brakes
Master cylinder, vacuum assist booster, emergency brake cable, brake calipers, wheel cylinders, compensating valve, brake line tubing and fittings.

Suspension
Upper and lower control arms, control arm shafts, upper and lower ball joints, tie rod ends, constant velocity joints, (only lubricated joint failure is covered, torn boots at the time of a failure will void this coverage), axle(s), wheel bearings. Coverage under this section is afforded only after the vehicle has been driven 2,000 miles from the purchase date of this agreement.

Seals and Gaskets
Intake manifold, valve covers, heads, oil pan, timing cover, front and rear main seal and camshaft.

I've copied and pasted this from a website I found but what would you reasonably expect to pay for this for:

(A) 12 months???

(b) 24 months???

Pep

Darragh,

For 12 months I suppose less than €400, but it would depend on how much the car I bought was worth in the first place.

siralfalot

I'd be interested in third party warrentys too, anybody know of a company that provides this service in Ireland?

cbyrne

I remember in australia there was a number of companies providing these warranties, esp to backpackers since so many old bangers and vans are bought and sold, not sure if you really got anything much with them when you took out the exclusions... seems to be a few companies in the UK doing these too but haven't come across any in Ireland..

Darragh29

I was thinking of getting into this as a service I could provide through my business. I noticed that there was no such service in Ireland. I suppose it all depends on what people are prepared to pay for it. I see from browsing that you can buy 12 or 24 month warranty's in the US.

cbyrne

Do you have a ballpark figure of what you'd reckon youd have to charge for this? (we won't hold you to it!!)

What about 3/6 month warrenties, I'd say there'd be a lot of smaller gararges/trade dealers that might be interested in reselling such a warrenty on used cars they sell?

Darragh29

I dunno, it would mean finding a balance between the likelihood of you claiming off the warranty you bought and the price that the market would be willing to pay for such a service. I noticed on a similar topic that companies that do windscreen replacement work for insurance companies have clamped down big time on people claiming. I have a customer who got insured through Hibernian and bought windscreen cover but when he went to claim he let it slip that the windscreen was cracked berfore he bought the car and they refused to cover him.

The cost of the product would have to be under 500 Euro I think, because you'd get a lot of problems sorted out for less than that, for example clutch failure, starter motor, engine sensor failure, etc. But if your engine or gearbox went, you could be looking at anywhere up to and over 1500 Euro. I mean what are the chances of you being hit for a 1,000 Euro repair bill within 6 months of buying a car??? I'd think fairly slim, but then and again, after reading some posts on this forum, maybe not. I'd be thinking around 350 Euro would be a starting point for 12 months cover. If you look at it across ten customers, after selling this product to ten customers, you'd have revenue of 3500 Euro. The million dollar question is: how many of those ten customers would use their policy and how much would it cost each time and would any of them use the policy more than once???

Darragh29

cbyrne wrote:

Do you have a ballpark figure of what you'd reckon youd have to charge for this? (we won't hold you to it!!)

What about 3/6 month warrenties, I'd say there'd be a lot of smaller gararges/trade dealers that might be interested in reselling such a warrenty on used cars they sell?

I don't sell any cars but I can't understand sellers that offer 3 months warranty. I think this gives the trade a bad name. Any car that deserves to be on a forecourt should be able to be stood over for at least 6 months I think...

Darragh29

cbyrne wrote:

Do you have a ballpark figure of what you'd reckon youd have to charge for this? (we won't hold you to it!!)

What about 3/6 month warrenties, I'd say there'd be a lot of smaller gararges/trade dealers that might be interested in reselling such a warrenty on used cars they sell?

Just as an exercise, what if I said I would give you a 12 month warranty on your car for 400 Euro, subject to inspection??? Would this be too expensive???

Say I offered a service where I would inspect a car before you bought it and also would provide a 12 month warranty on it through my own business after inspecting it and giving it a clean bill of health. This would mean that you could negotiate a better price with the garage as you would be buying warranty from me and not from the garage/seller. Say I charged 500 Euro for this, which would be 400 Euro for your warranty and 100 Euro for a vehicle inspection (and if I inspected a vehicle for you and failed it, I'd give you another inspection free), would this sound reasonable and value for money??? Think about it, you'd have a car with a clean bill of health and a 12 month warranty with the car should anything go wrong. What ya think???

Jasus, the more I'm thinking about this...!!!

cbyrne

well the figures seem to add up alright, taking the one of 10 people paying 350 giving you 3,500 and how many of them would claim, i'd say damn all, so surely you'd be well covered??

I suppose *most* people are happy enough buying off the garage and don't even want to think about the 'what if'.. and most dealers prob make the money you mention above by selling their own warrenty so they wouldn't sell it on your behalf, its a bit like the 'extended warrenty' at dixons/currys etc.. whoever buys them? (well not me anyway, i dont want to pay the extra and prefer not to thinnk about the what if)...

Having said all that, I do wonder why no-one is doing it in Ireland..

cbyrne

the other thing is you say 'subject to inspection', surely this wouldn't be feasible, unless you were only doing local.. expecially if you got lots of requests..:D

I'd say it'd have to be something sold over the phone or 'net

Darragh29

cbyrne wrote:

the other thing is you say 'subject to inspection', surely this wouldn't be feasible, unless you were only doing local.. expecially if you got lots of requests..:D

I'd say it'd have to be something sold over the phone or 'net

The problem with that would be that if it wasn't subject to inspection, you would have people buying a car with a problem like an ECU or an engine of a gearbox problem, taking out a warranty in the full knowledge that they would be using it after a few weeks or a month. If you were not doing in on a "subject to inspection" basis, it would have to be rated on the year and mileage of the car (this is how it is done in the US from the website's I've looked at), so the older the car and the higher the mileage, the higher the cost of the warranty.

I wouldn't really be into selling something like this through main dealers or other sales outlets as they are mainly vested interests who have their own warranty products in place. If I was going to do this at all, I'd offer it as an additional product that could be bought along with a vehicle pre-purchase inspection in the context of a private seller and a private buyer. This is where the product would be most useful as a buyer in this situation has absolutely no cover in the event of a problem. I'm also amazed in Ireland at how few people get a vehicle inspected before they decide to buy. You can see everyday on this forum how many people have problems subsequent to a private purchase and also buying from a car sales outlet and I havae yet to hear one person with a problem saying that they got the vehicle inspected before they decided yo buy...

Darragh29

cbyrne wrote:

the other thing is you say 'subject to inspection', surely this wouldn't be feasible, unless you were only doing local.. expecially if you got lots of requests..:D

I'd say it'd have to be something sold over the phone or 'net

I'd be into selling this on the net or over the phone but I would concentrate on selling it to private buyers who have a real need to have a vehicle inspected and also a warranty provided. I think this is something that is really absent in the market... **** it, I'm gonna start this up! Decision made!

Pep

Darragh29

That sounds like a good service, would you consider supplying it for cars that have run the course of the sellers warranty? It would really just be extra insurance for people.

Darragh29

Pep wrote:

Darragh29

That sounds like a good service, would you consider supplying it for cars that have run the course of the sellers warranty? It would really just be extra insurance for people.

I suppose I would. I don't see any reason why not. I'd concentrate most though on where it would deliver a very meaningful benefit for customers as it would be easier to sell there. It is easy to sell a product like this to a private buyer who is probably dubious about buying privately in the first place. The person who is driving a 05/06 motor is probably still allied to the main dealer and probably wouldn't trust anyone but a main dealer to fix a problem should one arise. Maybe if I introduced a product like this to where it was most useful, in particular a private buyer and a private seller, and it worked out there, I'd consider pushing it on another front. I'm planning it for the private buyer and seller at the moment. What I'll be doing is targetting a private seller for a pre-purchase inspection and a 6-12 month warranty. I'll also target the seller because a car that has been given an independent clean bill of health mechaniclally and has a 6-12 month independent warranty must be easier to sell than a car that doesn't have this, I think...

paddy reilly

What about if you bought the car from an auction sold as seen. it would be nice to take someone with you to inspect your prospective purchase and if you buy it give you a 12 month waranty. But id pay no more than 500 euro for this.

Darragh29

paddy reilly wrote:

What about if you bought the car from an auction sold as seen. it would be nice to take someone with you to inspect your prospective purchase and if you buy it give you a 12 month waranty. But id pay no more than 500 euro for this.

I'd be happy to stand over any car once I inspected it. I know I can't "guarantee" a car purely in the basis of an inspection as something can go wrong at anytime, but what I'd be looking for would be things like ECU/ABS and Airbag lights working and going off when engine started, no oil leaks, evidence that the car has not been run into the ground and has been serviced, no steering or suspension problems, no emissions problems (I'd get a mobile SUN emissions 3 gas tester to check catalytic converter and lambda sensor functionality and to iliminate any fuel ignition and excess oil consumption problems, also to check for exhaust inward O2 leaks). The only problem with a car at auction is that you can't test drive it, something that you can do when it comes to a private sale/purchase.

Nanor

Check out http://www.warrantydirect.ie

Sterling prices but they provide cover for southern Ireland. You pay the repairs to the garage of your choice, and they reimburse you.

Henry Ford III

Pep wrote: »

...As dealers only have to give you 3 months warranty on second hand cars....

The don't have to give any warrantry at all afaik. "Sold as seen" cars exist.

jimmycrackcorm

Nanor wrote: »

Check out http://www.warrantydirect.ie

Sterling prices but they provide cover for southern Ireland. You pay the repairs to the garage of your choice, and they reimburse you.

I can see this as a nice benefit to add when selling a car privately for a quick sale.