My brother wants a new computer

PeakOutput

I have persuaded him not to buy from dell as long as I can come up with a decent alternative.

If this was for me I would pick the parts myself but its not so I really want to get things right.

He has 1000euro to spend. That money must pay for monitor, vista(premium) wireless card and preferably a wireless keyboard and mouse.

he wants to use it for general use and playing the latest games. It would need to be upgradeable but i am fairly sure he will not be venturing into overclocking anytime soon.

so i know im being a little lazy not giving you a shopping list I have already picked but im in work so dont have time just yet so any lists of parts you guys can volunteer is greatly appreciated.

*he wants to order next thursday so if he goes with what people here advise ill force him to do a build log so you can laugh at how two first time builders try and get it together*

L31mr0d

personally, i'd wait till the new 65nm core Xbox 360s come out and get that for gaming. Then spend the left overs on a decent SFF C2D/2GB RAM rig with onboard graphics.

With a budget like 1000k hes not going to be able to play the latest games, at least not at anything close to high settings.

Does he have any old computer gear he could sell off on adverts.ie to bump up the budget?

In fairness for my next build i'll be going back to basics on the PC. There are nearly no exclusive games released for PC anymore. Most games are direct console ports as well. Also, with consoles offering online play, downloadable content, upgradeable harddrives, HD-DVD/Bluray players, Media center abilities, streaming video from a PC and the ability to use a keyboard and mouse there is no reason anymore to invest in PC gaming. Also the graphical difference is negligable now between PC and consoles at 1080p. Right now there is NO reason to pay the extra money for a high end PC when you can spend a quarter of that money and buy a console with all the trimmings.

Auvers

are you mad L31mr0d a 360 instead of PC for games, I could understand if you wanted shallow dumbed down games to entertain yourself. As for "exclusive" titles on PCs coming up on the PC what about Crysis or games that already exist Medieval Total war, Supreme commander etc that will never exist on a console

I also have a 360 and only use it for footy\driving games as for FPS its dire a prime example of this GRAW2, where the PC version in infinitely better.

Oh and how about the fact that the 360 even the new 65nm core is still going to sound like a hair dryer in your room and thats without the DVD spinning, also have to pay for MS Live subscription to enjoy online gaming.

PeakOutput

thanks for that l31m iv said it to him and he said it sounds like a good idea and hell have a think. also it helps that i have a fairly fool proof way of getting a cheap console for him.

if he was to buy an xbox and then either build or buy a basic dual core pc for the net and downloading etc would he be able to use the computer monitor for the xbox as well or would a compatible one be way too expensive?

8T8

Really it depends on your tastes both platforms with PC & Xbox 360 there is a good deal of crossover given the Xbox project is largely PC gaming "in a closed box" but the are games unique & better suited to each platform so he should make the decision himself on what he plays the most.

As for the monitor yes you can use the Xbox 360 with it over the VGA interface (you'll have to buy the VGA cable separately). Most displays come with VGA & DVI so you can switch between the inputs with the PC on DVI.

The newer models are a little quieter in operation than the very first ones but not exactly quiet to begin with but with speakers or headphones on you wont really hear it however playing DVD's through the console is another matter and very distracting.

As for the PC a decent enough build will handle most task outside gaming if you go with the Xbox
Core 2 Due E6300
2GB RAM DDR-2 800
500W PSU
Any low end GPU like a GeForce 8400 will suffice for Vista & some video decoding.

dazftw

Auvers wrote:

are you mad L31mr0d a 360 instead of PC for games, I could understand if you wanted shallow dumbed down games to entertain yourself. As for "exclusive" titles on PCs coming up on the PC what about Crysis or games that already exist Medieval Total war, Supreme commander etc that will never exist on a console

I also have a 360 and only use it for footy\driving games as for FPS its dire a prime example of this GRAW2, where the PC version in infinitely better.

Oh and how about the fact that the 360 even the new 65nm core is still going to sound like a hair dryer in your room and thats without the DVD spinning, also have to pay for MS Live subscription to enjoy online gaming.

Exactly my thoughts, I read an article in pc format magazine about pcs destroy all consoles

What about stalker? and bf2 and 2142? I know bf2 is on xbox but its terrible

L31mr0d

DeafVision wrote:

Exactly my thoughts, I read an article in pc format magazine about pcs destroy all consoles

What about stalker? and bf2 and 2142? I know bf2 is on xbox but its terrible

damn I wrote a big dogmatic reply and the screen refreshed and now its gone :mad:

Anyway, the point I was going to make was. The cost to benefit ratio of PC gaming is getting wider with each passing month. The hardware is getting more expensive and the titles exclusive to PC are getting smaller.

New consoles offer all the benefits of PC gaming, and they also offer multiple players on one system, HD playback, media center... etc. Have a look at some of the E3 HD previews of games being released for consoles in the next year. They are simply amazing. I'm also sick of games i'm looking forward to being released not even being put forward to being ported to PC (God of War being one )

On the side of PC games simply being better that simply is not true anymore. We have yet to fully utilize DX9, due to the plethora of different PC configurations programmers have to deal with. Yet we are moving onto DX10. It will be another good few years before we see fully optimized DX10 games getting released, and by then we'll have the new Xbox and Playstation DX10 equivalents. Consoles mean no more patchs, updates, crashs, checking system compatibility, falling behind in hardware and having to fork out 100's to keep up.. the list goes on.

Personally I enjoy building and overclocking equally as gaming, which is why i'm sticking with PC's for now. But for somebody looking for a PC for purely gaming, think again and ask yourself are the dribble of PC exclusive games worth the huge price tag you'll have to pay to play them?

Auvers

L31mr0d wrote:

On the side of PC games simply being better that simply is not true anymore. We have yet to fully utilize DX9, due to the plethora of different PC configurations programmers have to deal with. Yet we are moving onto DX10. It will be another good few years before we see fully optimized DX10 games getting released, and by then we'll have the new Xbox and Playstation DX10 equivalents. Consoles mean no more patchs, updates, crashs, checking system compatibility, falling behind in hardware and having to fork out 100's to keep up.. the list goes on.

I know where your coming from but I have heard this argument time and time again the facts are consoles shelf life is approximately five years and by 2010 the 360 and P3 will be surpassed by at least two generations of PC hardware.

PC gaming will always be the pinnacle of gaming, you can keep your "overpriced" churned out "style over substance" console games and I will continue with glorious Medieval Total War 3 and Crysis 2.

L31mr0d

Auvers wrote:

I know where your coming from but I have heard this argument time and time again the facts are consoles shelf life is approximately five years and by 2010 the 360 and P3 will be surpassed by at least two generations of PC hardware.

PC gaming will always be the pinnacle of gaming, you can keep your "overpriced" churned out "style over substance" console games and I will continue with glorious Medieval Total War 3 and Crysis 2.

each to their own I guess. All i'm saying is next time you are thinking of blowing 1500e on a new PC and there is a 400e console out. Work out what games you will be playing on that PC in the next year before ITS shelf life has expired, and ask yourself is it worth it to pay over 3 times as much for a PC which has a shelf life of about a year before games outgrow it, to play a handful of games. Or to go for a console which will last you 5 years at least and be able to play the plethora of console exclusives coming out and have all the benefits of PC gaming AND all the benefits of console gaming.

Arguing the content of console games is also a moot point as i'm sure fans of the FF series, shadow of the colossus and god of war to name a few would beg to differ with you.

PeakOutput

Auvers wrote:

I know where your coming from but I have heard this argument time and time again the facts are consoles shelf life is approximately five years and by 2010 the 360 and P3 will be surpassed by at least two generations of PC hardware.

"overpriced"

these two statements just dont add up man.

I can buy an xbox for 400euro which as you say will last me until 2010 at least whereas if i buy an 8800 graphics card for the same price and build a computer around it it will be out of date even faster.

the pc can be a better gaming machine BUT it is in no way better value than a console.

Auvers

PeakOutput wrote:

these two statements just dont add up man.

Ok I just used that as an example I think MS said there going to release there new console around 2011

PeakOutput wrote:

I can buy an xbox for 400euro which as you say will last me until 2010 at least whereas if i buy an 8800 graphics card for the same price and build a computer around it it will be out of date even faster.

so a new xbox console with all accessories and xbox live subscription and €70-€80 games that’s going to add up to serious wedge of cash in anyone book. Anyway the 360 is not renowned for its reliability, so I couldnt say it would last you to 2010.

And you dont have to buy an 8800 gfx card, you could just go ahead and buy a c2d with 2xgigs of ram and a 7900gt than you could play most new games at 1280 x1024 with full detail and maybe a bit of antialising.

PeakOutput

by the way i love pc gaming and will be building a pc for gaming when i get the money together BUT they are not as good value for money over the same length of time as a console

so if my bro decides against a console cheap pc option what would be the best build he could get do you people think and what would it be capable of?

Auvers

ok enough of my fanboy ranting sorry guys just very board at work today.

Heres a quick list I knocked up for you Peak, it could do with some revising but its just to give you a look at what you can get for €1000 from Komplett.

311799 Antec Sonata II Miditower, Black w/450W PSU

329215 Club3D GeForce 7900GS 256MB GDDR3, PCI-Express, HDTV-Out, S-Video Out

301116 Corsair Value S. PC4200 DDR2 2048MB Kit w/two matched Value Select 1024MB

323508 Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3, P965, Socket-775, ATX, SATAII, GbLAN, DDR2, 1xPCI-Ex16

334049 Intel Core 2 Duo E4400 2GHz Socket LGA775, 2MB, BOXED w/fan

324781 LG 19" LCD L194WT TCO-03, Silver 1440x900, 5ms, 2000:1, DVI/VGA

330707 Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium Eng OEM DVD 32bit

325546 NEC DVD±RW burner AD-5170 IDE Black OEM, DVD+R/+RW/DVD-R/-RW (Dual layer)

332072 Samsung SpinPoint T166 400GB SATA2 16MB 7200RPM

TOTAL €1,036.90

dazftw

Consoles will never better a PC in terms of performance but PC's will never better consoles in terms of price/performance ratio

Depends what your into really?

My friend has a 360 and a crap pc, ive a pretty decent pc with no console.. but I have an offical xbox 360 joypad for my pc so I have xbox games on my pc.. Lost Planet?

Improvisation FTW!!!!!