How to avoid buying a Clocked Car

gbh

Ok I think it's time for a thread like this rather than everyone coming on here saying "I bought a clocked car".

Maybe people would give tips here about how to avoid buying a clocked car.

My first tip is make sure you know who you are buying the car from, their name and address and also that they don't have a bad reputation.

neacy69

Always run a check using www.cartell.ie for irish cars and www.hpicheck.com for an import.

jayok

Well - tough to say this - but buy off a franchised dealer (e.g. Nissan for Nissans, Hondas for Hondas, etc). Only thing is they will shaft you on their prices.

Otherwise import yourself from the UK.

(I can't believe I am advising to buy off a main dealer)

Gary ITR

Look for obvious signs too, like a car with 20,000miles on the clock shouldn't have a worn out seat. Excessive wear and tear on parts that are touched like the steering wheel and gearknob. Also the likes of key scrapes around the locks on cars without remote locking

Anan1

There is one simple way to protect yourself, even if buying privately. Only buy a car with a full, verifiable, service history, preferably with invoices. Call the garages who performed the services, and check that the work was done as stamped. Any car without a FSH should be assumed to be clocked.

OKenora

but buy off a franchised dealer

Like that kia one that just got done for clocking cars last week ? Car dealers are car dealers, big flash showroom or small back street garage it's all the same. they are there to get as much money out of you as possible for the car. A lot of the big respectable franchised dealers started out a lot smaller and some may/have brought the bad habits from those days with them. Franchised dealer has more to lose and you would think less likely to clock or sell clocked cars, but profits are profits at the end of the day.

AVOIDING CLOCKED CARS (some of the less checked, more impression of car points):
1: Check the service history, any missing or none at all be suspicious
2: Check the cars condition, hard these days as interiors do not wear but you may still see wear in larger amounts than you would expect on carpets, steering wheels, gear knobs, pedal covers, control stalks, especially cruise control and radio remotes, and seat bolsters. Beware if the pedal covers look too new or brand new, ask yourself "why ?"
3: Get a HPI/Cartell check, HPI is better as they will guarantee the mileage, cartell won't
4: If it's a BMW get the ECU mileage checked against the key mileage and speedo at a dealers, newer BMW's keep the recorded mileage in the ECU and this cannot be changed but the displayed mileage on the speedo can. Some other cars may do this, but I don't know which ones.
5: Check general condition of components. e.g car says 20k on clock but front brake pads are brand new or totally worn out. At 20k you would expect them to be about half worn and little or no lip on the discs. While this is not an indicator on it's own as the car could have been a city car all it's life with lots of braking it's another indicator as to real mileage. Couple this with many stone chips and it's clear it wasn't a city car so how did the brakes wear so much ?
6: Check the fluids brake fluid/power steering fluid/Auto box fluid (if auto). Most cars say these have to be changed at about 60-72k (less for auto fluid), and if it was a fleet car then this would likely have been done, if it's all spinky and new.......if it's all dirty then suspect it too, but I'd walk away as you will have the bill for changing it anyway.
7: Condition of the keys, worn keys = higher mileage
8: NEVER EVER trust what the seller tells you, it could be true but it may not be. Unless it's firmly documented on paper then take it as false until you see proof otherwise.
9: Try and ascertain what the original use of the car was, not just beleive the seller. If it looks like a reps car then it possibly was and will most definitely not be low mileage. Look for the typical rep things like signs of mobile phone brackets. Signs of personalisation are more likely on a genuine private car than a reps car so look out for the kids stickers (or evidence of) on the back window.
10: If it supposed to be a family car then have a quick look where family crud accumulates, usually behind the rear seats. lots of valeters will not clean the bits you cannot see so run your hand in there for signs that the car actually had the back seats occupied at some time. OK so could be a real clean and tidy family, but it's another pointer to add to the list.
11: Check the gearbox drain plug for spanner marks, again a change at 72k is usual for gearbox oil so a car less than this should show no signs of having this drain plug opened at all. Same for the bolts that hold the driveshafts into the gearbox, gearbox bellhousing bolts and hub nuts if you can see these. Both should show no sign of spanners or having been worked at, unless of course the car had a clutch at some time and again thats a 60k+ job on most cars.
12: Check the cars stereo presets. Are they all tuned to UK stations ? So your one owner 04 D is an import ? Do they fit the profile of the driver that was supposed to own it ? Ok so it proves nothing but it's all info to add to your general impression of the car.

None of the above on it's own really can be taken as a guarantee of anything one way or the other, and a lot of it can be valeted off, but tick a lot of boxes and you can take a good guess. They are mostly all free visual checks too and may eliminate a car from your search before going to get a more costly HPI check on it.

prospect

OKenora wrote:

Like that kia one that just got done for clocking cars last week ?

Was he an authorised Kia dealer? I thought he was selling new Sorentos, but wasn't actually listed as a Kia dealer.

prospect

Here is a question:

Say you bought a car from a dealer, and you are suspicious that it was a UK import, but you obviously do not have its original UK registration. Is there any way to check out a cars history just using the chassis number?

PauloMN

prospect wrote:

Here is a question:

Say you bought a car from a dealer, and you are suspicious that it was a UK import, but you obviously do not have its original UK registration. Is there any way to check out a cars history just using the chassis number?

A Cartell check will confirm whether the car was imported or not, and will give you the previous reg if imported. Many people whine that the Cartell check tells very little, and while I admit I would like to see a mileage record on their database, most of the other information is very useful.

I used a Cartell check for the dodgy car I almost bought - this gave me the UK reg which in turn allowed me to run a UK HPI check, giving me the (real) mileage.

I love the Internet!!!

OKenora

HPI will check on it's registration number (VRM) or on it's VIN number, whichever you provide. Afaik some of their guarantees are not valid unless you provide the VRM and VIN to them as cars in the UK can change VRM but should not change VIN

daedalus2097

I don't know how anyone would touch a car without a service history, seems absolute madness to me. Regardless of mileage (which will look very suspect if there's a couple of years missing or whatever), it'll give you an idea of how well it was looked after, very regular oil changes and all that stuff all help to build a picture of a car that's been looked after. Even if it isn't clocked, it's still possible that the car's never been properly serviced, or has only been serviced when it breaks...

whippet

the only way to be 100% sure you are buying a car that isn't clocked is to buy it new!!!!

Other than that, keep asking questions and do as much research as you possible can .. and check for all the tell tale signs listed above !

gbh

daedalus2097 wrote:

I don't know how anyone would touch a car without a service history, seems absolute madness to me...

I guess people get emotionally attached to a car even if they have only seen it for the first time and forget about all the other details...it becomes a must have car...

bazz26

gbh wrote:

I guess people get emotionally attached to a car even if they have only seen it for the first time and forget about all the other details...it becomes a must have car...

It can happen alright, the heart can rule the head.

bucks

Irish car owners are shockingly bad when it comes to maintaining FSH and even getting receipts so many private sellers wont have most of the above.

UK owners will continue to bring their car to a main dealer for services etc.. and will keep all receipts and invoices etc regardless of cost.... making it easy to review the cars history.

Irish owners will usually bring a new car to the main dealer for the first service and from there on out its usually the local mechanic that will take care of future work, in short the majority of Irish owners dont want to pay for main dealer servicing.

By bringing the car to a main dealer and getting them to read the correct mileage from the ECU is the only way to assure your car has not been clocked.

Churchy

I've been buying cars professionally for yrs.
Only one thing I insist on is history.

Service history is the key to where the car has been and how well its been looked after.

OKenora

the only way to be 100% sure you are buying a car that isn't clocked is to buy it new!!!!

Even thats not 100% true either, been plenty of cases of "demonstrators" driven on trade plates that clocked up hundreds of miles, possibly even thousands, then being sold as "new" with the clocks reset.

If a dodgy car dealer gets near it then there's a chance of it being clocked regardless of age or newness.

Unfortunately the average Irish car buyer is not very savvy about checking a car over properly and quite often is too silly/mean to bother paying for a proper inspection or report having an overinflated opinion of their own ability to judge a bad car. By the time Mr Average spots a car as a bad one the motor trade is calling it a scrapper.

Proof of the above is in the posts already on the forum about buying cars that are clocked, both easily found out about.

TJJP

prospect wrote:

Here is a question:

Say you bought a car from a dealer, and you are suspicious that it was a UK import, but you obviously do not have its original UK registration. Is there any way to check out a cars history just using the chassis number?

If a UK import (or any import?) the former reg will be listed on the Registration Certificate under section J.4.

HPI check the UK reg, but also call the garage in the UK service book if listed, they are usually quite helpful on history.

mickjohnlong

just a quick one about the likes of cartell and auto check and the many other one check the info you get from them it has happend to me and a few people i know where they get the nct info the no of owners infoand if the clocks are in mph or kph they can get them wrong aswell i think the hpi check is the only one who have not gotten it wrong