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Tournament Hand: Help

  • 12-07-2007 12:47am
    #1
    Theresalwaysone
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭


    Game:60euro Freezeout Naas
    Stacks: ~9k
    Main Villain (MV)~27k
    Second Villain (SV) ~9k
    Fish ~6k
    Blinds: Second level, 50/100

    I am UTG+1.

    Folded to me, Look down to see JJ
    Raise to 400.

    Player to my Immediate right (MV) re-raises to 1000
    Absolute Luckbox, has been calling light and hitting all night. I have not seen him re-raise. I am sure he has a big hand.

    Player to his Immediate right Calls (SC)
    A solid player, seems to know what he's about. Playing fairly tight. He calls looking at MV suspiciously.

    And BB Fish Calls
    I know he's only calling becuase he is in the BB, doesnt have a clue.

    I think and call.

    Pot 4,050
    Flop 942 Rainbow
    Action?


Comments

  • #2
    phantom_lord
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,895 ✭✭✭✭phantom_lord


    c/f?


  • #3
    cooker3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,646 ✭✭✭cooker3


    phantom_lord wrote:
    c/f?

    Dot


  • #4
    DeVore
    Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 32,387 Mod ✭✭✭✭DeVore


    I think this one would be greatly affected by my reads. Its not a nice position to be in. I think you could probably have decided PF if any of them had KK/AA and pushed to push QQ out. The flop has brought no info except that you havent hit a set and AK/AQ hasnt hit either. I dont like the situation because this pot is going to be raised on the flop regardless of what they have so you wont get any more info from that either. Push or C/F though because you flat called preflop I doubt anyone is going to buy that you have AA/KK now. Nasty position... I think reads will play a big big part in your next action.

    DeV.


  • #5
    Moneymaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,846 ✭✭✭Moneymaker


    Shove or check/fold. I have a feeling you're behind here though.


  • #6
    Hectorjelly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,696 ✭✭✭Hectorjelly


    No matter what your read here the only play is to check. You get to check and the pfr gets to act. Then the rest of the field will act and you can decide what to do. That is invaluable, as a big worry you have here is another player flopping a set. If the pfr bets and gets action from any other player you can safely fold. If he bets and everyone else folds you can make a decision.

    If you push you will almost only get called when you are crushed, and a lot of times you will run into a car crash were someone flopped a set and theres an overpair, but you could of got away from it had you checked.

    Preflop you should definitely be much more inclined to push because there is now a huge amount in there which makes pushing definitely +EV even against a reasnably tight range. However if you really think he has a big hand (and AK doesnt count as big here) then only check folding here makes any sense.

    Anyone advocating a push as an option here is seriously wrong!


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  • #7
    DeVore
    Business & Finance Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 32,387 Mod ✭✭✭✭DeVore


    Yeah, I thought about it again for a while (its an interesting question) and I am beginning to think you're best option is to catch AK/AQ c-betting or TT pushing, I dont like the situation though and I still say this is a play that you could say "you had to be there to understand"...

    DeV.


  • #8
    Jesus Wept
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,243 ✭✭✭✭Jesus Wept


    Hectorjelly wrote:
    No matter what your read here the only play is to check. You get to check and the pfr gets to act. Then the rest of the field will act and you can decide what to do. That is invaluable, as a big worry you have here is another player flopping a set. If the pfr bets and gets action from any other player you can safely fold. If he bets and everyone else folds you can make a decision.

    If you push you will almost only get called when you are crushed, and a lot of times you will run into a car crash were someone flopped a set and theres an overpair, but you could of got away from it had you checked.

    Preflop you should definitely be much more inclined to push because there is now a huge amount in there which makes pushing definitely +EV even against a reasnably tight range. However if you really think he has a big hand (and AK doesnt count as big here) then only check folding here makes any sense.

    Anyone advocating a push as an option here is seriously wrong!

    top notch post.


  • #9
    Theresalwaysone
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,039 ✭✭✭Theresalwaysone


    Well I did c/f and the MV had AA and the SV had QQ and the Fish had.....wait for it..... A8 ( and stacked off when he rivered his 8)

    It was weird tho, the MV kept betting 1000 after the flop and the other two called. I folded.

    Turn. Was a K. MV bet 1000. Both Called.

    River 8. MV checked. so did SV. Fish Pushed. Both called.

    I WAS SHOCKED that this was the standard of play.


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