Returning 360

Vic Vinegar

Hi, a friend of mine has recently started having big problems loading games (you have to boot a game 15 times sometimes to get it to work) with his xbox 360. He bought it about 6 months ago from an xtravision store and we we're wondering could he take it back to the store to be exchanged or does it have to be sent away to wherever Bill Gates sends broken 360's? He still has the receipt...

Any help greatly appreciated! Thanks

Antigone05

you still have the receipt..your fine. take it back. they will replace it for you as you are covered under irish law for 6 years on electrical goods from retailers.

and just so you know Microsoft have extended the warranty on the 360 to 3 years now.

Vic Vinegar

Quick reply! thats a relief anyway as he didn't want to send it off and be without it for a month or whatever. So, just return it to the store? and there won't be any argument from staff?

Saruman

There might be an argument! Statutory rights are all well and good but few retailers etc will give them to you without a fight. They may insist on the warranty provided by microsoft as opposed to your statutory rights (which is seperate to the warranty).

Vic Vinegar

Hmm.. it says on the receipt that exchanges or refunds can be given on FAULTY
goods returned within 28 days of purchase... what should i do?

rabbitinlights

Within 30 days, Xtra vision have to look after you, after that its Microsoft all the way.

S.

Oryx

It will depend on who you happen on. I cannot see you walking out of the store with a new box straightaway. To be fair, they will need to determine if it is actually faulty. And my understanding of the law is repair replacement or refund at their discretion.

Vic Vinegar

Ok, we have opposing viewpoints already! anyone know for sure someones rights? we don't wanna kick up a fuzz unnecessarily

Kensington

Antigone05 wrote:

you still have the receipt..your fine. take it back. they will replace it for you as you are covered under irish law for 6 years on electrical goods from retailers.

Rubbish. They're not going to hand you out a brand new 360 unit straightaway. It will most likely be sent off to be checked first, and then whatever parts are faulty will be repaired, or if the unit is deemed beyond repair, then they will hand out a new unit. But they're not going to just hand you out a brand new unit without verifying it as being faulty first.

Vic Vinegar

Its says on an irish consumer website that when you buy a product you're making a deal with the shop, not the manufacturer. So that would imply i can return it to the shop.....

Ideo

i take it that you havent seen this then?

http://www.rte.ie/business/2007/0706/microsoft.html

Vic Vinegar

Ideo wrote:

i take it that you havent seen this then?

http://www.rte.ie/business/2007/0706/microsoft.html

Ya i have, but we don't wanna lose the xbox for a month sending it away, thats not the issue!

the_syco

Antigone05 wrote:

you still have the receipt..your fine. take it back. they will replace it for you as you are covered under irish law for 6 years on electrical goods from retailers.

:D:D:D:D:D

I'd love to see where you say that!

/edit
They are within their right to send it back to Microsoft to check was the damage caused by you, was it a manufacturing fault, or an act of god. They will then repair it, and send it back to you.

Also, the first 12 months is the manufacture's warranty, anything after that (eg: extended warranty) would be with the shop.

Ciaran500

mountain lips wrote:

Its says on an irish consumer website that when you buy a product you're making a deal with the shop, not the manufacturer. So that would imply i can return it to the shop.....

Pretty sure after a year any warranty is with the manufacturer and no where in Irish law does it say you are covered for 6 years. It say they must merchantable quality, fit for their purpose, reasonable durable which is completely open to interpretation.

Vic Vinegar

Ciaran500 wrote:

Pretty sure after a year any warranty is with the manufacturer and no where in Irish law does it say you are covered for 6 years. It say they must merchantable quality, fit for their purpose, reasonable durable which is completely open to interpretation.

The 360 is only 6 months old though!

Ciaran500

mountain lips wrote:

The 360 is only 6 months old though!

I was replying generally to some of the things in the thread. Should of left out your quote


Take it back to the shop and they have to do something with it. If you are lucky they will give you a replacement, but they have the right to send it off to MS for you. Just give it a go and see what happens.

goatsplitter

Shame on your mate for buying a crappy xbox in the first place! Shameeeeeeee

axer

OP: you are covered under the sale of goods and supply of services act 1980 as the XBOX360 you bought is not of merchantable quality when it broke after 6 months thus they will fix it for you.

As you bought the xbox from xtravision then they are legally responsible for getting it repaired but you can deal directly with microsoft if you want i.e. its your choice. If you decide to deal directly with microsoft then you cannot claim against xtravision for that purchase if it breaks again - you must deal with microsoft from then on.

Antigone05 wrote:

they will replace it for you as you are covered under irish law for 6 years on electrical goods from retailers.

Never heard about 6 years before?
My understanding is that there are no fixed terms as to how long someone can get a replacement or a repair or refund. It is all down to what is fair and reasonable for that product.

If you buy a television for example that comes with a 1 year warranty, that does not mean that you cannot get the tv fixed for free if say the tube goes after 2 years as it is expected that a television should last probably at least 3 years (probably longer) - of course that is if the television was not abused or kept in bad conditions.

I believe it is the same with refunds i.e. if you used a product for 6 months and it broke then it would not be fair to ask for a refund - a repair or replacement would be fair. If it had happened after a month or probably two months max then you could demand a refund. If the same problem happens say twice more then you can claim you have lost faith in the product and can demand a full or partial refund (depending on how long the product was working for).

Vic Vinegar

goatsplitter wrote:

Shame on your mate for buying a crappy xbox in the first place! Shameeeeeeee

Who asked you? if you haven't got anything constructive to say then p**s off.


Cheers others for the reasoned responses!

tvnutz

I work in Xtra-Vision, you will not get a replacement if it is outside 28 days. However since the warrenty with the shop is a year (microsoft then have anotehr year I believe) they have to deal with your faulty console. i.e they send it off for repair. If it can't be repaired they replace it. So basically yes they have to deal with the problem,but they are not obligated by law to replace it or give a refund after those initial 28 days. By sending it off for a repair they are fulfilling the rest of the warrenty. Oh and if you don't have your receipt you are screwed

Vic Vinegar

Where do they send it off for repair? how long does it take?

axer

tvnutz wrote:

However since the warrenty with the shop is a year (microsoft then have anotehr year I believe) they have to deal with your faulty console. i.e they send it off for repair.

Under Irish consumer law the retailer is *always* responsible whilst there is a claim to be made as the consumer has had no dealings with microsoft.

As a follow on from earlier if a consumer decides to contact the manufacturer directly for a repair etc. and they do not get a satisfactory response they can still follow the retailer.

tvnutz wrote:

So basically yes they have to deal with the problem,but they are not obligated by law to replace it or give a refund after those initial 28 days. By sending it off for a repair they are fulfilling the rest of the warrenty.

Yes they are obligated by law to replace or give a refund if the consumer does not accept a repair for a good reason by the SALE OF GOODS AND SUPPLY OF SERVICES ACT 1980. That whole 28 days is rubbish made up by companies to try and limit peoples statutory rights i.e. just because a big company says its so doesn't mean it actually is.

the_syco

axer wrote:

Yes they are obligated by law to replace or give a refund if the consumer does not accept a repair for a good reason by the SALE OF GOODS AND SUPPLY OF SERVICES ACT 1980. That whole 28 days is rubbish made up by companies to try and limit peoples statutory rights i.e. just because a big company says its so doesn't mean it actually is.

Check the warranty. Also, whats a "good reason"? Mainly, when someone tries to shove that at me, I find out at a later stage that they've caused damage to it (smashed screen, entire keyboard missing, all internal circuitry fried by animal pee, etc)

Vic Vinegar

axer wrote:

Under Irish consumer law the retailer is *always* responsible whilst there is a claim to be made as the consumer has had no dealings with microsoft.

As a follow on from earlier if a consumer decides to contact the manufacturer directly for a repair etc. and they do not get a satisfactory response they can still follow the retailer.

Yes they are obligated by law to replace or give a refund if the consumer does not accept a repair for a good reason by the SALE OF GOODS AND SUPPLY OF SERVICES ACT 1980. That whole 28 days is rubbish made up by companies to try and limit peoples statutory rights i.e. just because a big company says its so doesn't mean it actually is.

Thanks man... thats good info, so you reckon i could swing a replacement at xtravision?

jahalpin

As somebody else has already said the retailer is entitled to send the product off for repair. They are not required to replace the item on the spot.

Under Section 12 of the sale of goods and supply of services act 1980 it states;

12.—(1) In a contract for the sale of goods there is an implied warranty that spare parts and an adequate after sale service will be made available by the seller in such circumstances as are stated in an offer, description or advertisement by the seller on behalf of the manufacturer or on his own behalf and for such period as is so stated or, if no period is so stated, for a reasonable period.

It is highly unlikey that a retailer would take it upon themselves to replace a unit of such value without first being satisfied that the damage was not the result of misuse by the consumer.

Vic Vinegar

Just found this... http://www.consumerassociation.ie/rights_retailers.html#yourfault

If true it seems to clear a few things up anyway..

tvnutz

axer wrote:

Under Irish consumer law the retailer is *always* responsible whilst there is a claim to be made as the consumer has had no dealings with microsoft.

As a follow on from earlier if a consumer decides to contact the manufacturer directly for a repair etc. and they do not get a satisfactory response they can still follow the retailer.

Yes they are obligated by law to replace or give a refund if the consumer does not accept a repair for a good reason by the SALE OF GOODS AND SUPPLY OF SERVICES ACT 1980. That whole 28 days is rubbish made up by companies to try and limit peoples statutory rights i.e. just because a big company says its so doesn't mean it actually is.

Sorry but you are wrong. It does not affect your statutory rights,used to work with a guy that was studying law. A refund within the 28 days,there after the store has to deal with the problem but is only obligated to do so by giving a repair. The store does have to deal with it,but a cash refund after the 28 days does not have to be given out.

the_syco

mountain lips wrote:

Just found this... http://www.consumerassociation.ie/rights_retailers.html#yourfault

If true it seems to clear a few things up anyway..

Just read the entire thing. Interesting. But, to me, it states that if the device is defective, then you may refuse the repair. However, thats only if its defective when you first use it, or if it doesn't work from the moment you bought it. Not 6 months down the line when something blows, that may or may not be a manufacture fault, but could well be caused by the consumer.

[url=http://www.consumerassociation.ie/rights_retailers.html#yourfault]consumerassociation.ie[/url] wrote:

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]It's your fault. The product wasn't made for that purpose[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif][/FONT]Dunno why but the phrase "the coffee cup holder on the PC no longer works" springs to mind

axer

tvnutz wrote:

Sorry but you are wrong. It does not affect your statutory rights,used to work with a guy that was studying law. A refund within the 28 days,there after the store has to deal with the problem but is only obligated to do so by giving a repair. The store does have to deal with it,but a cash refund after the 28 days does not have to be given out.

I never said it affects your statutory rights. I said it attempts to limit your statutory rights. It gives the impression to people that that is the only comeback they can get e.g. a refund or partial refund can be claimed under the sale of goods and supply of services act if for example the xbox is fixed then breaks again and then a replacement is give which also breaks. The consumer has the right to a full or partial refund at that time as they can claim they have lost faith in the product.

axer

the_syco wrote:

Check the warranty. Also, whats a "good reason"? Mainly, when someone tries to shove that at me, I find out at a later stage that they've caused damage to it (smashed screen, entire keyboard missing, all internal circuitry fried by animal pee, etc)

Good reason is where goods have been fixed then replaced and keep breaking i.e. there is some design flaw with the product. It is about what is reasonable. You wouldn't look for a full refund after using a product for 6 months unless things keep breaking or something like that.

axer

mountain lips wrote:

Thanks man... thats good info, so you reckon i could swing a replacement at xtravision?

Maybe but you would have to let them send the xbox to be checked by xbox as it could be your friend's fault that it is broken. The question is why would you want a replacement when a repair would return the xbox to its original condition i.e. the condition before it broke?

Elessar

Antigone05 wrote:

you still have the receipt..your fine. take it back. they will replace it for you as you are covered under irish law for 6 years on electrical goods from retailers.

and just so you know Microsoft have extended the warranty on the 360 to 3 years now.

Well I'll be, looks like he is right!

http://www.euroconsumatori.org/16856v18340d18510.html

Good luck getting retailers to even acknowledge that never mind adhere to it though. Good for any court dealings though.

byte

Elessar wrote:

Well I'll be, looks like he is right!

http://www.euroconsumatori.org/16856v18340d18510.html

Good luck getting retailers to even acknowledge that never mind adhere to it though. Good for any court dealings though.

That article is quetionable, though interesting

After the first 2 years compensation can be claimed against the supplier of the goods only if the consumer can prove that it is reasonable for the goods to last that long. Clearly this does not cover wear and tear faults.

kinda turns the 6 year "warranty" up on its head though, as a vast majority of faults to products after 2 years could be down to wear and tear!

Vic Vinegar

So what about an exchange then Byte? its only 6 months old

Vic Vinegar

axer wrote:

Maybe but you would have to let them send the xbox to be checked by xbox as it could be your friend's fault that it is broken. The question is why would you want a replacement when a repair would return the xbox to its original condition i.e. the condition before it broke?

To answer your question a repair would mean no xbox for a month + the replacement would be a refurb and therefore possibly break again a lot sooner

Ciaran500

mountain lips wrote:

So what about an exchange then Byte? its only 6 months old

Like everyone has said they don't have to give you a new one, just a repair or refurb. But you might be lucky, go back to the retailer and ask.