white wine, how long?

Unpossible

I was just wondering how long white wine can last. I was always under the impression that it doesnt last as long as red (eg you can have a red thats years old but not a white of the same age), however someone recently told me that white wine will last just as long as red.

If this is true why do they not put the year on white wine bottles?

My reason for asking is because I plan on buying a few bottles of red and white from the year my kid is born (to give to him when he is older), also because chinese in-laws keep offering me old bottles of red and white wine (which they bought 8 years ago on a whim because they look nice on the shelf, non of them actually drink wine) so I want to know if the whites will be ok to drink.

thanks

rediguana

In general, red wines are more suited to ageing than whites. This is because they have more tannins. Initially, tannins are harsh and abrasive in the mouth but they soften and mellow over time, adding complexity to the wine.

Having said this, most inexpensive, everyday wines - whether red or white - are made to be drunk young.

Splash out on good white Burgundy (French Chardonnay), this can have good ageing potential. (Vintage) Champagne, Semillon, White Rioja, Chateau Grillet (Condrieu / French Viognier), Riesling are all whites that may be aged. The caveat is that any wine that will last the eighteen years until your kid can drink it will probably be very expensive as it will need to be outstanding quality. If you buy cheap versions of any of the above, they will have peaked long before your son can drink it.

It's a good idea, though, buying wines to mark a birth. I was born in 1980, which was a mediocre enough year for wines. My lucky girlfriend is 1978, when Italian, French and Spanish (Rioja) vintages were stellar. She mostly drinks Kopparberg Cider, though, where the harvest date isn't so important

Beruthiel

As I'm a red wine drinker, I know very little about white. The only ones I drink are the sweet white wines like sauternes, monbazillic, muscat and gewurztraminer, they always have the year they were made on them, so maybe you're just looking at crappy bottles?

A quick search on google brings up lots for you to read, here's just one to start with.
But as rediguana said, if I were buying wines to age, they would be red.

Unpossible

rediguana wrote:

If you buy cheap versions of any of the above, they will have peaked long before your son can drink it.

do you mean they will not be drinkable? or that they will just not get better with age? Also are you just talking about whites here?

Beruthiel wrote:

But as rediguana said, if I were buying wines to age, they would be red.

Well Im (clearly) no expert on wine and there is no telling how the kid will turn out so as long as its not horrible (like vinegar) then its ok with me. Its really just a fun thing I have in mind for him/her to have when they get a bit older.

Ill keep an eye out for those whites you mentioned rediguana, can you recommend any reds ? Would a 20euro bottle be too cheap?

Beruthiel

While on our hols in france this year, we were out to dinner and treated ourselves to 20 year old bottle of Chateau Margaux, it was very expensive, €138, but when you're on hols you pretend you're rolling in it and we so wanted to know what something like that would taste like. Sweet jebus I've never tasted anything that good before, honestly, it was superb.
If I were buying a wine to age, I believe I'd spend more than €20.
Go to an off licence that knows it's trade, there's one in Dawson street, they know what they're talking about in there and will advise you.
/edit, do you live in Finland?
You're on your own then

rediguana

Finland is even more expensive than Ireland, I'd imagine you'd need to spend in excess of twenty bones to get a wine capable of developing and improving over two decades. Is your kid already born? 2000 and 2005 were great vintages for Red Bordeaux, one of the best wines for ageing. If the bun is still in the oven, I'll keep my fingers crossed for a good 2007 vintage.

By the way, all quality wines - of either colour - name a year on the label.

What did your relatives give you? If you let me know, I'll make an educated guess as to its likely state after eight years.

Unpossible

By the way, all quality wines - of either colour - name a year on the label.

Well I normally don't go near white wines, and even then I usually don't get wines that are more than say 12 euro (I am only a poor student ).

Finland is even more expensive than Ireland, I'd imagine you'd need to spend in excess of twenty bones to get a wine capable of developing and improving over two decades. Is your kid already born? 2000 and 2005 were great vintages for Red Bordeaux, one of the best wines for ageing. If the bun is still in the oven, I'll keep my fingers crossed for a good 2007 vintage.

Well, to be honest I'm not really knowledgeable about wines I just have gotten a bit of a taste for red wine, so I'm not (for now) too bothered if the wine will greatly improve as long as it doesn't deteriorate, it is just a fun thing to do for the kid. I will look into better wines after reading this thread though and if its an expensive wine he/she will get a bottle when they are 21 and one when they marry (or graduate or whatever), because I doubt at 18 they will appriciate it and will just drink it to get plastered.

I will wait until I graduate and get a job (and re-locate to UK or Ireland) before buying, that way I can get a really good one (like your suggestions). The kid is due late 2007 early 2008, it doesn't matter if either is a good year because I'll do it anyway Do the "better" wines sell the latest years? or do they wait a few before releasing them?

What did your relatives give you? If you let me know, I'll make an educated guess as to its likely state after eight years.

I have no idea, I only brought two of the bottles back to europe and they are long gone. It was just some chinese brand of wine that they had picked up in their travels around china years ago and it looked like the company was relatively new. The bottles were just a few of the things her relatives would just "unload" on me from various parts of china, but thats another story

happy_acid_face

When you say a €20 bottle of wine do you mean to keep for 21 years? If that's the length of time you want to keep it for then you will have to start saving!

Alot of people ask here about wines that they can keep for when there child growns older. But the truth of the matter is, its not as easy as one would think to keep a bottle of wine for that long. I dont want to rain on you're parade but there is a few questions you have to ask yourself first. Where will you keep it? How will you keep it at a reasonably stable temperature? How will you stop it from from getting too cold or too hot? Will where you put it be out of bright light? Will it be keep on its side? Will it be keep away from strong smells? How would you feel if when you open the wine in 21 years time and it ended up spoiled or corked?

As you can see there is alot to think about when keeping wine. But it is DEFINATLY not impossible! If you are serious about this you should probably think of investina a good bit more money.

21 years is a very long time. So if you want a white and a red, i'd advise instead of buying one of each buy 6 of each. That way you have 12 bottles and chances are some of them will have kept for th length of time.
Unfortunatly, you can't just walk into an Off Licence and pick up a bottle of wine that is 20, 30 or 50 euro and expect it too last for 21 years. All wines have a life expectancy. Most wines we see on the shelf probably only have 4 to 6 years before they past there peak but some will go as far as 10. After that the wine starts to lose its taste and decrease in value.

I'm sorry if this sounds very negative, i just want you to know whats involved...

The best advise i would give you would be this... If you are really serious about this don't rush into anything. Save up some money waiting until after the baby was born. You could even leave it for a few years before you buy it. At the end of the day you are lookin for a wine that has the same vintage (year) your child was born. If you buy them five years from now you will still have to look after them a futher 16. The wine will be 21 years old just like your sibling.

Unpossible

The best advise i would give you would be this...

good advice thanks, waiting for a year or two does seem like a good idea as the whole thing is not as simple as I had thought.

rediguana

In the long term, wines don't stay static; they either age and develop, or (peak and) fade. I know that to most people this will seem stupid and OTT for what's essentially a 750ml bottle of alcholic grape juice. But, given the occasion (birth of your scion), if it's worth doing at all, it's surely worth doing right.

Forget Ireland or the UK if you want to get your money's worth, wait til you go to France (or other wine-producing continental countries). Tax etc kills booze purchases here.

If your kid happens to be born in an awful vintage, it's not such a huge issue. You can expect to buy your wine at a hefty discount relative to a good year and, for top producers, there will be sufficient vinification expertise available to still make a great wine. You will need to spend, though, to have something worth drinking when I'm 48 (ie. a VERY long time away!).

Some countries, such as Spain, will age the wine for you. The better Spanish wines (Reservas, Gran Reservas) are only released after a number of years, so that they are ready to drink. Spain is rare, though. For French wines, the onus is on the drinker to store and age the wine. If you buy a 2005 St. Estephe, it's still nowhere near being ready to drink. Being clever doesn't work, either - if you come across a 1990 St. Estephe, you can be sure those long years of retail storage have been factored into the price and you will have to pay a mint for it. So choose your poison - high price or lengthy storage. This is a generalisation and a simplification but is still worth remembering.


Happy Acid Face made some relevant points but I don't think that storage need be such a trauma. Just keep the bottle sideways, away from light, noise, strong smells, vibrations etc. Bottom of a closet is fine, forget the attic as the temperature fluctuates too much.

It's tempting to just get the wine a few years after the kid's birth but it's not as romantic. Offsetting that is the fact that you'll have more cash and possibly more wine knowledge three-to-four years down the line so you can make a better decision and afford a better wine.

Buying 6 or 12 bottles is fine if you can afford it, but what student can? If all the wines are the same, they should age similarly, though at least the risk of a corked / oxidised bottle is deftly dealt with.

Save up your cash, walk into a fancy wine shop and ask for a Left-Bank Bordeaux and a Meurseult from the relevant year. Tell them you want to age it. Do some internet research first, to minimise the chances of being taken advantage of. To further hedge your bets, plant an oak the year your son or daughter is born. If the wine turns out to be poison, at least you can point to that woody leviathan in the back garden to show them that the tree says 'I love you' even if the wine doesn't.

There'll be other children, it's not like the Nordic countries don't need them

Unpossible

It's tempting to just get the wine a few years after the kid's birth but it's not as romantic. Offsetting that is the fact that you'll have more cash and possibly more wine knowledge three-to-four years down the line so you can make a better decision and afford a better wine.

yep, you guys have convinced me that this is the better option.

There'll be other children, it's not like the Nordic countries don't need them

Well we will more than likely be moving back to Ireland for a few years before moving back to her country, so poor finland will have to get someone else to bulk up their ranks