Les Paul cost

Ger the man

Hi folks,
Im thinking about buying a 2nd guitar and wanted to ask if people felt that a genuine Gibson LP was worth the money? Yes I know, its a fine instrument and will last the test of time but what are the alternatives?

Karl Hungus

Definetly not worth the money.

The best alternative would to buy a Tokai LP copy, which are made in Japan to a higher standard that the Gibsons themselves.

ungratefuldead

Hi lads,


I own a LP, and I have to say.....definitely worth the money...... I got the standard designed by Warren Haynes keep in mind the old LP specification from the '50.

She is got a fat sound beat all guitar in sustain man.....if you plug her to a Marshall valve head...........man you have to listen her........anyway I still finish to pay it...............I choose it between 10 guitar than I tried ….all LP....anyway I don't know about the Japs maybe cheaper I doubt a better sound......but still don’t' know maybe I will be surprise.

Doctor J

Bacchus, specifically their Duke model. Never played one, but going on the quality of their basses I can't see it being anything other than stellar. Hand made by people who truly understand how to make a great sounding and great playing instrument, I want one and I don't even like Les Pauls. Gibsons are overpriced and their current quality can be questionable.

As the saying goes, Bacchus ftw

Ger the man

Nice

The Freeman

i have played a few gibson's les pauls and they are good but make sure you play one before you buy it, unfortunately in order to do this you have to go in to the shop in town where the prices are was too expensive for a les paul considering you can get them much cheaper of the net, but you could get a 'dud' when buying one over the net

the standards that they throw the les pauls out these days compared to the old days is shocking bad, 'TRUST ME', myself personally at the time i went for a tokai love rock, which is a PERFECT copy of a gibson standard, i paid 800e for it new, and if you keep your eyes on ebay you can get one for bout 500e i'd say secondhand

remember the GIBSON logo is just a name, doesn't make you a better guitarist cos you got one;)
http://www.bebotoday.info/index.php?q=aHR0cDovL3NlYXJjaC5lYmF5LmNvbS90b2thaS1sb3ZlLXJvY2tfVzBRUV90cmtzaWRabTM3UVFmcm9tWlI0MA%3D%3D

Duff_Man

i love gibson les pauls. although the quality now days leaves alot to be desired. your best trying to get hold of an older one. anything from 2003 back are pretty decent. mines a 2006 and mines amazin. then again iv played others from 2006 and they sucked ass. theyre all different man so id advise you to try a bunch if your going to go down the gibson path! its well worth it if you get a nice one though!

Voodu Child

Same as everyone said already, there's guys out there building LP style guitars to a higher quality and lower price than Gibson. I've seen some pics on other forums showing the woeful Gibson build quality in recent years, terrible neck joins and the like.

Edwards seems to be making top-class LP style guitars these days.

Ger the man

Thanks for the info - much appreciated

Johnny Storm

I have read good things about Hamers as an alternative to Gibsons.
Hamer Factory video. Check out the section on the body inlay.
Also Heritage guitars are supposed to be a good Gibbo alternative.

The Freeman

by the way, what a beaut:)

Don1

Heritage are class. Founded by original Gibson staff in the original factory (Kalamazoo, Michigan. Gibson relocated to Nashville Tenessee)and made the way they used to make them, by hand! Getting a loan of one in a few days.

Quattroste

Go Japanese. If you pay the asking price of a new Les Paul Standard but buy a Tokai or Bacchus or Edwards you will get a top of the range Les Paul, beautifully crafted with top of the range electronics, woods etc.

I have a Tokai LS200 that cost me less than the Gibson LP standard that I bought and is far far better. I sold the Gibson after a few months. There are great Gibsons but they command great prices too and do not represent value for money to me.

Nozebleed

Definately take the time to play a gibson sg..they sound almost identical..If you're gona buy an sg buy the 61'reissue..it has a les paul neck..Its basically a les paul different body.

It wasn't me!

SG's sound *completely* different to Les Paul's. Seriously, could hardly sound more different.

Fingers Mcginty

Personally that bacchus is a bit ott for me. Saying that there was a nice black one on Ishibashi a few weeks ago. Looks like she got snapped up though.
As a LP owner i feel that yes Gibbos are a little pricey but if you go out and buy a copy you'll never be truly happy until you get the real thing. Call me shallow but that's been my experience anyways.And yes Gibson has let the quality slip some in recent years but i think they're back on track now ....no?

Karl Hungus

Fingers Mcginty wrote:

Personally that bacchus is a bit ott for me. Saying that there was a nice black one on Ishibashi a few weeks ago. Looks like she got snapped up though.
As a LP owner i feel that yes Gibbos are a little pricey but if you go out and buy a copy you'll never be truly happy until you get the real thing. Call me shallow but that's been my experience anyways.And yes Gibson has let the quality slip some in recent years but i think they're back on track now ....no?

Back on track? If the track is to try and spend more money on advertisements and endorsements than on building an instrument that is in any way good. There's absolutely no shortage of horror stories out there about Gibson's ridiculously crap quality control, and I really do begin to wonder if they make any good instruments any more, as it all seems to be duds.

I've a friend in the states who bought a new Gibson Flying V to find that the nut was cut so poorly that the high E just slipped out constantly, and there were already hairline cracks in the headstock.

As for not being happy with a copy and having to get the real thing? I'd say that if you bought the real thing, you'd end up with an incredible dissapointment, and wonder what on earth attracted you to said brand name in the first place!

Gibson is just a name riding it's former glory.

Nozebleed wrote:

Definately take the time to play a gibson sg..they sound almost identical..If you're gona buy an sg buy the 61'reissue..it has a les paul neck..Its basically a les paul different body.

I don't mean to be rude, but you really shouldn't be offering advice when you can't tell the difference between such hugely different sounding guitars.

mloc

Have you considered a strat? I mean they both have 6 strings, a neck, a body... some pickups... more or less the same...

... I joke, I joke. I have a 5ish year old Gibson LP standard, and I love it. I would certanly recommend trying different models before settling for one, as like any good guitar, it'll cost you a fair bit. I have heard rather a lot about falling standards, but I'm afraid I haven't been in a market for a Gibson for a while so I can't really comment.

Karl Hungus

mloc wrote:

Have you considered a strat? I mean they both have 6 strings, a neck, a body... some pickups... more or less the same...

Yeah, or he could get one of these. It's pretty much the same again, 6 strings/neck/body/pickups, practically identical to a Les Paul.

Ger the man

Thanks for the jokes! Already have a US strat and am very happy with it, I would consider getting another one. I tried a gibson explorer last night and really liked it.

judas101

them there bachusseses look sweet. mmmmmmmm.

NeMiSiS

I have two.. a 1991 and a a backup 03 Gibson LP.
The 91 is fantastic, sounds great, plays great, feels great,real true Gibson... there are only one or two guitars I have played that I could honestly compare it.

The 2003 is a nice guitar.. different beast alltogther though.. great build quality.. nice weight.. but different sound.. but that's down pickups etc.. but if I was getting another (which I will ) second hand.. I would aim to get something 90's ish..

I would not buy one brand new, and if I was it wouldn't be in this country. Go secondhand, and you wil get good value, you will also get to try loads of them.

If you are going the Jap route I would go with Edwards, I have had the oppurtunity to play a lot (about 30) amount of Tokai's and Edwards guitars, and I would say the quality of the edwards stuff is better.

TK

deaddonkey

here is why a gibson les paul is a waste of money
both are gibson les paul standards
seriously, anyone who tells you they're worth it after this is full of it
gibson are ripping you off




top neck joint is LP standard

if you've got 2k to spend on a guitar, spend it on a company that will source light weight woods and not have sloppy fit and finish
don't buy a gibson guitar

and anyone who tells you a LP and an SG sound 'completely different' is a tool
they sound different. quite similar, but different. not 'completely different'
a LP and a strat sound completely different. an SG and a gretsch sound completely different
SGs have a slight more of a kick in the midrange, they honk a bit more
completely different is a load of tripe.

feylya

Deaddonkey, do you have any proof that they are actually kosher Gibsons? I've seen those pictures before and the last time I checked, they might have been Epiphone's or Chinese knockoffs

Ger the man

With a dodgy history of quality control Im not willing to part with the best part of 2,000 euro. Its a Fender US Deluxe for me.

Doctor J

Don't limit yourself to the big American brands. There are plenty of manufacturers who are making better guitars but don't have the history to fall back on. If you really want a great twin humbucker guitar, then investigate Patrick Eggle guitars. They're made in England and you'll get a top of the range mondel second hand for about a grand or so. My Eggle is the best guitar I've ever played and nothing comes close in terms of sound. I'm sure Fey will tell you about his. Keep an eye out on ebay.co.uk for the Vienna and Berlin models and you will get a guitar worthy of the price tag and better, I'll wager, than a Gibson.

There are also the likes of Bacchus and Navigator in Japan who hand build guitars of truly impeccable quality. They shame the likes of Gibson with the quality of guitars they put out, just do a bit of research and check them out, se what people have to say about them. There is more than the big F and th big G out there for someone who wants to play a great guitar rather than just own a brand name.

Ger the man

Just looked at the patrick eggle site, nice alright - cheers Doc!

Doctor J

They're savagely expensive new, but second hand, they're not really a big name brand so they go for ridiculous prices. In my opinion, they're at least as good as PRS, I'd say better, and definitely a step or two above the Gibson's I've played... and I'm typing this with a Gibson on my lap

How soon are you looking to buy? There's nothing really up on ebay at the minute except for a badly overpriced Berlin, but if you give it a couple of weeks something interesting should come up.

Ger the man

Hi Doc,
Gonna buy in the next week or two. Not a big fan of e-bay though, I know a few lads who thought they got genuine Gibson LP'S. I hadnt the heart to tell them they were conned, (3 screws on the truss rod cover). Another was changing the strings and the pickups fell out!! Kinda raises my suspicions about other copies being sold as the real thing?

Doctor J

There aren't any copies of Eggles, that I've seen. They're not a big enough name. Plus, you're going to be buying from the UK, most likely, and should go through Paypal, so you're not going to get screwed. They are such great guitars and, given the price of Gibsons, PRS's and the like, unreal value.

If you do choose the Eggle route, there's a thread here where the real Eggle obsessives list Eggles on ebay. If there's a fake, these guys will spot it. Plus, if you have any doubts, you can PM any of us here for a second opinion. Do a search for a thread by a fellow called Zoton, who went with an ebay Eggle, his reaction to his guitar says it all

deaddonkey

feylya wrote:

Deaddonkey, do you have any proof that they are actually kosher Gibsons? I've seen those pictures before and the last time I checked, they might have been Epiphone's or Chinese knockoffs

they were originally posted on the gibson site to highlight the differences between the standard and historic series
they're legit.

NeMiSiS

Ok so here's a question. I have three grand to spend, reccomend me a guitar, it may be second hand. Please
Humbuckers, and LP style of guitar for rock/metal/blues.
Thanks
TK

Doctor J

Three grand and a Les Paul shape?

Either Bacchus

http://deviser.co.jp/bacchus/

http://www.digimart.net/gk_detail.do?instrument_id=DS00229814

http://www.sonicsystem.co.jp/webguitar/bacchus_gtr.html

Or Navigator

http://www.digimart.net/gk_detail.do?instrument_id=DS00266914

http://www.digimart.net/gk_detail.do?instrument_id=DS00260656

and a bit of blurb about both

http://www.guitarsjapan.com/ESPinfopage.html
http://www.guitarsjapan.com/bacchusinfopage.html

NeMiSiS

http://www.digimart.net/images/1140/DS00229814_1.jpg - That's pretty amazing.
TK

Doctor J

I have two Bacchus basses and they really are just about perfect, better than anything else I've played, just really really what you want in a bass. Great, great instruments. If you dig the hollowbody thing there's a Bacchus Duke Box (basically LP with F-Holes on the u-box for €580 (not a typo ) before shipping and taxes. No pics as yet, but I'm sure they'd mail you some. I imagine it looks along the lines of one of these. Mail em and see. For that money, less than a grand in total, you really can't go wrong.

http://www.digimart.net/gk_detail.do?instrument_id=DS00251642

Giblet

Buy nice second hand Les Paul. You'll get a good price and a good guitar. My '95 Les Paul cost me 1300 euro.

Doctor J

For that money you should be getting a great guitar

Asiaprod

Yamaha SG 2000, played my friends and its amazing, I also used to own their SG 1500.
Here is a 1970 red one on ebay for 200$
http://cgi.ebay.com/Yamaha-Vintage-GUITAR-SG-2000-Electric-Santana-RARE_W0QQitemZ140128778502QQihZ004QQcategoryZ2384QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

cantdecide

my 2c as a LP std owner is that a musical instrument is worth more than it's monetary value. if you have a hankering for a LP, get one (not studio or special- i call these teaser models).

just poney up the dough and enjoy it. practically speaking resale for the reps is usually not good, so i'd prefer to be lumbered with (ideally used but pristine) overpriced genuine artical than the sensible rip-off good value. it will become more than an asset, it becomes part of you...

Don1

This thread is making me reeeeaaaly mad! I want to be in such a position, i.e. looking at Les Pauls and bacchus stuff, but alas I blew €1700 on my second hand G&L. :mad: Don't get me wrong it's a great guitar, but for that dough I could've got something absolutely amazing.

OP I would love a real LP but for the money with their current dodgy reputation I'd go Japanese.

NeMiSiS

My current fav is this baby http://www.guitarsale.com/Gibson-57-Goldtop-Darkback-i226222.music ...
Seriously considering it, but 57 neck is a bit of a baseball bat..
TK