Maintenance.....

PinkPrincess26

How much is a fair amount ??? we have decided not to go to court about this although i think this is a bad idea as he will be able to default when ever he wants..... Im just trying to keep things calm at the moment.. we've only just sold our house after nearly 7 months of arguing over it..... so i dont need any more crao at the moment at least the closing deal has gone through on the house....

He said he will give €350 a month.... I personally dont think this is enough, after all maintenance is suppossed to cover the cost of everything for the child..... I have a very good paying job myself, so its not as if I would ever depend on this money for anything but thats not the point. he's a dad and has to look after his responsibilities.

My son go's to a creche by the way which is 600 a month and my mam and dad ind my bambino for the other two days a week. and i dont give them, anything as they wont take it off me, I just bring them out for dins ever now and then...

So what does every1 think a Reasonable amount is.....

Nevyn

No, Maintenace from him is ment to cover 1/2 of everything for the child and you are ment to cover the other half, this does not mean the creche fees.

I would suggest that if you are having difficulties that you try a mediation process.

http://www.aimfamilyservices.ie/publications/mediat.htm

metrovelvet

Who's supposed to pay for the creche fees? The creche fairy?

PinkPrincess26

Surely he has to pay for half of everything including the creche fees......

therfore him given 350 would only leave 50 euro to cover half of everything else for our child given the creche fees per month would be 300 each.....

metrovelvet

Why dont you add up the childs expenses, including shelter,creche and medical and then half it and see what it comes out to?

undecided

dont know a whole lot about it really but giving you this story to consider:

My mother married and legally seperated. was awarded by the court 90 punt for herself and 20punt per child by the courts in the mid 1990's.........same fincancial arrangement still stands.

Father ....... a building contractor earning great wage.
Mother....... a stay at home mother until seperation and had to take a minimum wage job.

........ Scenario at present mother is afraid to get divorce because was legally advise that he may take the 90 punt off her and just leave her with 20 punt per wk. by the way theese figures are per wk

........just some food for thought.
hope this helps!

Oryx

My bro pays 150 per week for maintenance of his two kids. One schoolgoing, one not. (Stay at home mum so no creche) Agreed between them and rubber stamped by a court.

Nevyn

undecided wrote:

dont know a whole lot about it really but giving you this story to consider:

My mother married and legally seperated. was awarded by the court 90 punt for herself and 20punt per child by the courts in the mid 1990's.........same fincancial arrangement still stands.

Father ....... a building contractor earning great wage.
Mother....... a stay at home mother until seperation and had to take a minimum wage job.

........ Scenario at present mother is afraid to get divorce because was legally advise that he may take the 90 punt off her and just leave her with 20 punt per wk. by the way theese figures are per wk

........just some food for thought.
hope this helps!

That woman needs to get the maintenance reviewed which is a simple process which the courts will facilitate.

Getting a divorce will not change the fact that her husband or ex husband will have to pay her maintenance.

Basically she should get some legal advice from a solicitor's who works in family law.

The legal aid severces have several and she can apply for thier help.

http://www.legalaidboard.ie/LAB/LAB.nsf/Home?OpenPage
http://www.legalaidboard.ie/lab/lab.nsf/02e1d1523b8b780580256a6900497553/af9793d245a790d880256cde0048af5c?OpenDocument

Khannie

metrovelvet wrote:

Who's supposed to pay for the creche fees? The creche fairy?

Hahaha. I laughed.

OP: 350 a month doesn't sound unreasonable if creche fees are not to be taken into consideration (obviously it's a different matter if they need to be split 50/50. I have no idea what the story is there.). You should try to get the final amount index linked so you don't end up in the 90 punt + 20 punt scenario in 10 years as described by the other poster.

undecided

Thanks for your re my last post. just to let your know but the maintenance was index linked at the time. Father is an extremely powerfull and stubborn man who seems to be above the law. have often wondered if solicitors are being paid off by him

believe me its mot for the want of trying! Even things that the court ordered havent been done!

K-9

I suppose it could be argued that OP has a well paid job and would require a creche anyway so maybe the creche wouldn't come into it.

I think if it goes to court you have to submit a statement of means, both parties, and its decided from that. Me ex was about €250 a week in debt every week from hers! so shows you you can't really go on them either.

Anyway I pay €450 a month. Childminder is €150 a week. I do think this is one of the area exes find difficult to agree on. The one paying saying well I have to rent/buy a place for the child, run a car, pay maintenance, live and have some sort of life as well. On the other side, well what is a fair amount? You could argue 1/2 rent/mortgage, 1/2 running of car, 1/2 childcare etc. etc. ?

I have heard the average is about €85-90 per week if not married.

Nevyn

undecided wrote:

Thanks for your re my last post. just to let your know but the maintenance was index linked at the time. Father is an extremely powerfull and stubborn man who seems to be above the law. have often wondered if solicitors are being paid off by him

believe me its mot for the want of trying! Even things that the court ordered havent been done!

IF that is the case he is in contempt of a court order and there is a due process for that which can be undertaken.

esmeralda

I see no mention here of what the father earns and if with his half of the house and his capacity to work he has been able to reasonably re-establish himself accommodationwise (not easy in Dublin, I'm presuming that you have been able to do so from your comments). And how much time does he spend looking after the baby himself - absolutely none at all?????? And if it is absolutely none at all is it because he is unwilling or because the baby is so young it simply isn't practical??? If he is living the high life while you are shouldering all the responsibility that is terrible, but I think more information is needed before reaching any tentative conclusions as to what is fair and what is not. The best suggestion so far came from metrovelvet about totting up the cost of looking after the baby and dividing it in half, but I would add to that taking a look at each parent's situation (has either been given parental or other help with their accommodation, has either got a much better-paying job?).

Carrigart Exile

what access does the father have?

K-9

esmeralda wrote:

I see no mention here of what the father earns

And no mention of the mothers earnings other than she has a good income]

esmerelda wrote:

and if with his half of the house and his capacity to work

Same as she has 1/2. His capacity to work hasn't been mentioned though I'm sure if it was a serious issue it would have been mentioned.

esmeralda wrote:

he has been able to reasonably re-establish himself accommodationwise (not easy in Dublin, I'm presuming that you have been able to do so from your comments).

Fair comment which does have to be taken into account. If ex is entitled to 1/2 rent./mortgage is non custodial parent entitled to be allowed for 1/2 his/her rent/allowance as circumstances have changed and maybe they are also for the benefit of the child?

esmeralda wrote:

And how much time does he spend looking after the baby himself - absolutely none at all?????? And if it is absolutely none at all is it because he is unwilling or because the baby is so young it simply isn't practical??? If he is living the high life while you are shouldering all the responsibility that is terrible, but I think more information is needed before reaching any tentative conclusions as to what is fair and what is not.

Does sound from his suggestion of €350 per month that
maybe that is not the case, and it has not been mentioned so far. Though as you say, we shouldn't reach conclusions!

[quote=esmerelda[]
The best suggestion so far came from metrovelvet about totting up the cost of looking after the baby and dividing it in half, but I would add to that taking a look at each parent's situation (has either been given parental or other help with their accommodation, has either got a much better-paying job?).[/quote]

Also parental help with the better paying job, or just with a good qualification, never mind better paid?

What about less paid but more time with the child because of the other parental situation. Who helped in that situation? Thats a lifestyle choice that mighn't be agreed between both partis. Or maybe closer to home, less travelling, less time away from home but same or lesser pay? How do we value that contributuion.

Very difficult situation and not necessarily gender specific.

PinkPrincess26

re money is pretty much the same....... He sees our son when he feels like it, we have set days but he never sticks to them.. especially at the weekend.... When he does bother to turn up i just let my son see him because he wants to see his dad.....

I am back at home living with parents till I get something sorted ..... he has bought a one bed apartment with help from the money from the house we sold....... i could afford to buy a two bed place although money would be fairly tight but I could only do this if I knew for certain daddy would help pay half of creche fees which you can never be certain of that...... i couldnt afford mortgage bill then creche as well on my own.......
He keeps mentioning that he's gonna start giving me this € 350 but were seperated now since Jan and i havent seen it once.... hes givin a whopping € 400 altogether since Jan to now.......
I didnt want to go to court over money untill my house was fully sorted I didnt want anything holding it back...... I think the best thing to do now would probs be go to court ????

Trinity

PinkPrincess26 wrote:

re money is pretty much the same....... He sees our son when he feels like it, we have set days but he never sticks to them.. especially at the weekend.... When he does bother to turn up i just let my son see him because he wants to see his dad.....

I am back at home living with parents till I get something sorted ..... he has bought a one bed apartment with help from the money from the house we sold....... i could afford to buy a two bed place although money would be fairly tight but I could only do this if I knew for certain daddy would help pay half of creche fees which you can never be certain of that...... i couldnt afford mortgage bill then creche as well on my own.......
He keeps mentioning that he's gonna start giving me this € 350 but were seperated now since Jan and i havent seen it once.... hes givin a whopping € 400 altogether since Jan to now.......
I didnt want to go to court over money untill my house was fully sorted I didnt want anything holding it back...... I think the best thing to do now would probs be go to court ????

God whatever you do go to court. Its not out of badness, bitterness, meaness etc or whatever anyone thinks.

Visitation should be consistent and thats a whole other court case but money should be consistent too. You need to know how much income you will have each week in order to put a roof over your little ones head.

I never took mine to court and when he fcuked off to spain there wasnt a damn thing i could do about it. I havent seen a penny in 2 years. I've just had to drop my case now cos i dont have a home address for him.

Just go into dolphins house beside the Porterhouse pub and get a court date. All you need is his home address.

Good luck

esmeralda

I would definitely take it to court, just so you both know where you stand, and also bearing in mind that even with the best will in the world (not often the case when emotions are running high just after a divorce) it is easy to misinterpret agreements and arrangements. Also if you do have problems later on it will give you some kind of redress, and while you do not want to be going to court every two seconds, the fact that you could may be enough to make your ex keep his side of the bargain. But I see what you mean about not wanting to before your housing is sorted out – there’s a big difference between declaring outgoing payments when you’re staying with your mum and dad and when you are making mortgage payments! I don’t know if it would be possible to include forecasted mortgage payments among your outgoing expenses, given that you intend to get a house…? Better consult a lawyer on that one!

I can imagine how annoying it can be when your ex just turns up when he feels like it because he knows you will let him see his son, but I do think you’re right to let your son see his father as much as possible. Perhaps getting visitation rights fixed by the court would make him take the need for consistency and respect for your private space more seriously. It doesn’t mean that he could only visit at those times, but make it clear that any improvised visits must respect any previous arrangements and your life in general. Easier said than done, I know! I am seeing a similar situation from both a mother’s (best friend) and a father’s (my current partner) point of view, and I have come to the unfortunate conclusion that there is very often one parent that has their own rather than their child’s interests at heart (even though I presume they love their kids), and it is that parent that prevails in these circumstances, simply because the parent who wants the best for the child gives in to the other’s unreasonable behaviour to avoid putting the child through unpleasant experiences. Note that I use the word prevail, not win. It may take a long long time and it may sound corny but I believe that the parent who places the child’s interests first “wins” in the end.

If he feels that getting agreements about maintenance or visiting recognised by a court is ridiculous, insulting, or whatever, remind him that any lawyer worth his or her salt will advise even the best of friends who are going into business together to draw up detailed agreements, precisely because they trust each other too much, and that leads to unrealistically high expectations in all kinds of circumstances.

Re the amount of maintenance, given that you both have similar incomes and circumstances, I would do what metrovelvet suggests, adding up how much it costs to maintain your child each month, i.e. what the child costs you over and above the living costs you would have if you lived on your own (including the crèche – after all if he had to look after the child full-time he would have to pay for a crèche – or would his boss let him take the baby to work???) and divide it by half. I presume there is no weird law that states you can’t include the creche? A creche is certainly a direct cost resulting from the fact you have a baby in your care!

Kildrought

Maintenance is based on each parents income and expenditure and is not solely related to costs for the child(ren); for a good spread sheet on how to calculate maintenance see www.solo.ie.

There are also useful discussions on www.rollercoaster.ie on the issue.

MMKC1

Hi wondering have you tried the mediation process?? They can have a situation sorted for you where both parties agree and when an agreement has been reached that both parties are in agreement solictors will look it over and make it a legal contract without it going to court.

If you can/ no do whatever you can to avoid the court situation as it will create more difficulties down the road. Beleive me i took my ex to court and it made things worse. However if you feel that you are getting nowhere this may be the road you have to go down. If you are playing fair he should be paying maintenance for his child. Communication is the key. Avoid the extremists who are only to willing to advise you. Good luck