Ridiculous or Great Read

dvdfan

Was watching a hand shown down. The player below with the flush typed AA in the chat box and just called. Was this just stupid by the villain with the flush or an amazing read. The AA guy just plays this terrible but i cant help but feeling im going broke here even with the paired board as i could never see AA played this way

Green Joke Poker Aqua 0.10/0.20, hand converted by the iPoker Converter at Talking-Poker

saw flop|saw showdown

Button PokerFleury ($26.40)
SB HFfan ($20.10)
BB superneanea ($24.05)
UTG smokey99 ($15.65)
UTG+1 ShaveMeShamrock ($26.20)

Preflop: ShaveMeShamrock is UTG+1 with 3 K
2 folds, PokerFleury raises to 0.80, 1 fold, superneanea calls 0.60.

Flop (1.70) A 3 6
superneanea checks, PokerFleury bets 0.40, superneanea calls 0.40.

Turn (2.50) 3
superneanea checks, PokerFleury bets 0.60, superneanea calls 0.60.

River (3.70) 8
superneanea checks, PokerFleury bets 1.80, superneanea calls 1.80

PokerFleury shows A A
superneanea shows K J

PokerFleury wins 7.30 with A fullhouse, Ace's and Three's

Chucky the tree

why did he play it terribly? the only bad thing was not shoving the river i think.

Flushdraw

Its pretty bad play if he knows he's behind and still calls. wtf is that all about!

dvdfan

Chucky the tree wrote:

why did he play it terribly? the only bad thing was not shoving the river i think.

dvdfan wrote:

The AA guy just plays this terrible

I meant the AA guy played it bad, i agree the FD guy played it grand until the river.

Hectorjelly

What do you think the AA guy did that was wrong?

BuChan

AA played the hand well, what more could he do? checking the flop is bad. checking the turn won't win him a bigger pot, it's often more deceptive to bet the nuts than check it. terrible idea for the flush draw to call on the turn when the board paired, especially if he only planned on calling the river bet if he hit.... very strange.

phantom_lord

his bet sizing is really bad.

Tar.Aldarion

Check calling all the way down, I wonder am I beaten?

Marq

KJ guy should move up levels.

dvdfan

Hectorjelly wrote:

What do you think the AA guy did that was wrong?

He bet 1/4 pot on flop on a flush board giving his opponent good odds to draw to the nuts flush and beat his trips. At this level alot of people will call pot sized bets with Flush Draw, he should be at least leading for 3/4 of the pot and trying to build a pot because as played hes going to find it very hard to get his stack in on the turn or river with a pot as small as that.

The way id be looking at that hand is your either going to be winning a huge pot if someone is willing to chase the flush or hit a lower set or a medium pot if he has 2 pair or a lower flush and the villain is going to fold to any reasonable bet if hes missed the flop anyway.

I dont favour slowplaying on a drawing board however once the turn drops the situation changes and i dont mind giving the villain the odds to draw to the nuts flush as i have him beat now. If he had bet 3/4 pot on flop and 1/2 pot on the river there would be $8.20 in the pot by the river compared to $3.70 and a much better chance of winning a big pot on the river. A lower set might come over the top and the FD is going to call a 1/2 pot bet on turn if he called a 3/4 pot bet on river.

I again think he should be betting the pot on the river to maximise hes chance of getting all in if hes RR by a flush or a lower set especially if someone has a non nut flush as their unlikely to RR on a paired flush board so you may only be getting your bet called on the river.

I know giving the 2 hands he played it ok from the turn on because against most players your still getting all in on that river but if hes still not pushing out the flush draw too often if hes a little more aggressive on all streets and hell still get a medium pot from 2pair and lower set.

imho of course:D

Still at the time i was so convinced they were colluding i went back through the hand history as i cant see how anyone wouldnt raise the river there. Were ahead of so many hands and behind so few

BuChan

phantom_lord wrote:

his bet sizing is really bad.

wow yeah i didn't pay attention to the post. .80 preflop .40 on the flop, no wonder he put him AA. it makes the KJ's play on the turn even worse.

Chucky the tree

dvdfan wrote:

He bet 1/4 pot on flop on a flush board giving his opponent good odds to draw to the nuts flush and beat his trips. At this level alot of people will call pot sized bets with Flush Draw, he should be at least leading for 3/4 of the pot and trying to build a pot because as played hes going to find it very hard to get his stack in on the turn or river with a pot as small as that.

The way id be looking at that hand is your either going to be winning a huge pot if someone is willing to chase the flush or hit a lower set or a medium pot if he has 2 pair or a lower flush and the villain is going to fold to any reasonable bet if hes missed the flop anyway.

I wouldnt say hero played it terribly though, he made a few small betting size mistakes. But nothing criminal.

Hero in this case has 7 outs to improve from set to full house/quads. 9 outs for Villan to make his flush draw, one of those being a 6h which help the Hero so its not a huge difference.

Nothing worse then betting the pot on the flop with a set and having someone fold. I'd have made it a $1 on the flop. Too me it looks like Hero is just trying to get as much as he can from it. The check by villan on the flop is clear he missed, now Hero can either bet big and hope he's on a draw, or bet small to keep him in the pot.

How you play the hand all depends on what the tables has been like up until that hand. Its been like maniac central then its played terrible by hero, but if its been very tight you cant really fault him too much.

Hectorjelly

I think the aces guy played it well, obv his bet sizing is terrible but other than that its good.

Lazare

Chucky the tree wrote:

Hero in this case has 7 outs to improve from set to full house/quads. 9 outs for Villan to make his flush draw, one of those being a 6h which help the Hero so its not a huge difference.

This doesn't make any sense.

Hero (AA) is ahead, he has 39 cards that keep him ahead, villain has 8 outs to improve to beat hero.

He gave villain correct odds on the flop, which is a mistake, simple as.

jimmii

You can tell the AA guy thinks to himself that AA is unbeatable and so just bets an amount he knows will keep the other player in.

Chucky the tree

Lazare wrote:

This doesn't make any sense.

Hero (AA) is ahead, he has 39 cards that keep him ahead, villain has 8 outs to improve to beat hero.

He gave villain correct odds on the flop, which is a mistake, simple as.

So i should just play a hand dependent on odds and nothing else?

Lazare

Chucky the tree wrote:

So i should just play a hand dependent on odds and nothing else?

Not too sure what you mean here.

Pot odds are an integral part of every decision you make, and every time you force your opponent to make a mistake, ie, call with incorrect odds, you win. I'm not saying he should be over betting trying to protect his hand, but he should be forcing the villain to make a bad wager. A 3/4 pot bet would be fine.

Chucky the tree

Lazare wrote:

Not too sure what you mean here.

Pot odds are an integral part of every decision you make, and every time you force your opponent to make a mistake, ie, call with incorrect odds, you win. I'm not saying he should be over betting trying to protect his hand, but he should be forcing the villain to make a bad wager. A 3/4 pot bet would be fine.

That what i was wonder, what would be a good amount too bet on th flop. Cheers.

phantom_lord

130-140 I guess.

David Michael

Newbie thoughts...

I think AA did ok but could have done better. That pot could easily have had a few more $'s in it.
Were I in the AA shoes with two hearts on the flop regardless of my set..... I'd have made supern pay well to see the turn due to fearing the flush. Probably have paused and checked the turn though hoping to look like a missed flush draw and his check would mean same or a raise wold mean same? Hitting the flush on the river I'd have raised a lot more only because checking and hoping he raises has proved a waste in the past. My raise and his fold is the same result. A raise and call is a bonus.

If he hit quad 3's Expleatives are leaving my lips and good suck out old chap!

dvdfan

Hectorjelly wrote:

I think the aces guy played it well, obv his bet sizing is terrible but other than that its good.

How would u have played it?

Thats a genuine i want to learn post