Best Bike/Scooter to carry 2 people

Luckycharm

Have been driving a scooter for 6 odd years mainly to get in and out of work. Have a 5yr old who I have to bring to school each day. I have a car as well but the Missus uses it to go to work.
So every night drop bike at folks house, grab their car to bring little un to school and then drop car back in morning, jump on bike to go to work.

Have been wondering for a while what age would it be safe to put her on the back of a bike? Then what bike/Scooter is the best/safest for carrying 2 people - don't want anything too powerful or proper Motorbike as such. It would be only 5mins on a bike, it is too far to walk and would not have time to make it into work. I presume I would need to get a new License etc

Any advice would gladly be taken.

Idleater

First bit of advice - clarify what type of licence you have.

You are not allowed to carry pillion passengers on a Provisional licence.

If you have a full B, you are limited to 50cc (maybe <50 i.e. 49) and you would want to check with your insurance company if they consider this M class as a Full or a Provisional licence for the purposes of carrying pillions.

L.

galwaytt

if you have a full B, you are entitled to an M. There is no test for M, so no provisional.

That's how I interpret it, anyway.

As for OP - the rule for pillions is, that they have to be able to reach the footpegs. If you have to modify them, so be it..........the pegs, that is, not the child

The Doktor

I would really say that 5 is too young to bring on a the back of the bike. I bring my lad with me, since he was about 9. But he isnt allowed near the bike without his armoured jacket, trousers, bike boots, gloves and decent helmet.
I also have a top box with pillion cushion pad, so he can lean against it.
Can ur 5yo reach the foot pegs, cos if they cant dont even think about it.

tk123

My nephew is 11 and said he prefers to be on the back of my bike because it has a back rest for him and he feels comfy and safe compared to my brothers bikes - I have a marauder at the moment and it has comfy seats for the rider and passenger and a padded sissybar. You'd want to make sure she has footrests that her feet fit on and something to hold onto - i would recommend a backpack over your flesh!! If you want to stick with a moped you could maybe try a vespa with a sissybar or something with a topbox thou I'd say the sissybar would be more comfy for her to lean against. I've seen little seats with straps for bikes but she mighn't want to arrive at school like that!! Also you can pick up kiddie biker jackets on ebay for around €40-50 with all the padding etc so she'll be protected.

Luckycharm

I have a full B license, I know 5 is too young just thinking ahead for the future. Can you modify a scooter- what are the bigger scooters that have 2ish seats - bergman? I remember when I was in rome a couple of months ago I saw lots of scooters that seem to have 2 seats with a back part for the passenger but never really see it here.

You can look at the Burgmans or Yamaha Majesty 125 / X-Max. You have a B licence which is no good for these however so you will have to get an A or an A1 and you can't carry a pillion on a provisional.

AidoCQS

Do you feel lucky? Lucky charm ? :cool: - Sorry could not resist that.:D

But its IS an important point, Any of us riding, do so on a certain amount of luck. See most of us that are going to crash are going to be victims of events we cannot control. Most of the accidents in this country are caused by other parties to the accident - not the rider themselves. There is a shocking amount of ignorance on these roads, bad habits, a culture of it. Alot of people over 50 did not even have to do any kind of exam at all.

So my point is, anybody riding knows this, or figures it out quick, they then decide if they want to continue or not - and also because the statistics are grim. If we were in indonesia or some pace where there is a bike culture, we would not even be discussing this. So what I guess I am saying is that, like rearranging armchairs on the titanic, there is actually little you can do to protect a 5 year old on a bike, you should just make sure you are comfotable with exposing the kid to those risks.

Hotblack Desiato

Aido, a lot of people under 50 haven't passed a driving test either!!

Sure, you can't prevent other people from doing stupid things, but advanced training really does cut down the chances of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. All the time I see riders do things which expose them to unnecessary risk without them even realising it (and I don't mean mad speeds or risky overtakes - just where you position yourself on the road, how you observe and deal with hazards, etc. etc., simple things but they all add up.)

If you ride solo your risks are your own, but anyone who carries a passenger really should put a bit of thought into whether their riding is as safe as it could be. Only an experienced instructor can really tell you this.

Jamesobrady

Tbh if the school is a 5 min scooter ride away then its a 15-20min walk?
Why is that too far to walk if you're already having to make a journey someplace else to collect the car?

With 2 wheels..what you choose to do is what you choose to do. If you choose to wear jeans instead of armoured trousers then so be it. The choice is the important bit, you're obviously old enough to make your own decisions. Your daughter isnt.
A young child will do whatever their parents encourage them to do, including getting onto a scooter and getting killed. Even falling off at low speed, a grown up might get a few cuts and bruises, a young child will get a lifelong debilitating injury. For the sake of a 15minute walk with your daughter to school every day, and the time well spent in doing so, its a no-brainer to my mind.

Or if that really isnt an honest option, then maybe reorganise your schedules...can your wife drop the daughter to school instead,even if its out of her way moreso then yours?

What about buying a pushbike and bringing her on that? Still a small risk involved, but far far less than a scooter and on roads depending on your location,but still much quicker than walking- And you get excercise!

Hotblack Desiato

Jamesobrady wrote:

What about buying a pushbike and bringing her on that? Still a small risk involved, but far far less than a scooter and on roads depending on your location,but still much quicker than walking- And you get excercise!

Actually, per km travelled the risk of cycling is about the same, maybe a tad more, than that of motorcycling

Few cyclists commute long distances or rack up tens of thousands of km in a year, so their exposure to risk is less than the average motorcyclist.

For a given journey length, it's hard to argue that a bicycle (poor or no suspension, poor tyres, poor brakes, poor lights, poor acceleration and zero respect from every other class of road user) is going to be safer.

But your other points are valid. If it's walkable then do it. Safest (assuming footpaths exist!) and healthy and gives you the chance to chat about stuff, and best of all it's free.

Jamesobrady

ninja900 wrote:

Actually, per km travelled the risk of cycling is about the same, maybe a tad more, than that of motorcycling

For a given journey length, it's hard to argue that a bicycle (poor or no suspension, poor tyres, poor brakes, poor lights, poor acceleration and zero respect from every other class of road user) is going to be safer.
QUOTE]
Thats probably true enough, I was invisioning the use of cycle lanes in a built up area when i replied.
Funny that, I'd assume bringing a child on a push bike is safer than on a PTW. Most people probably would !
Damn your statistics and facts

Luckycharm

Jamesobrady wrote:

Tbh if the school is a 5 min scooter ride away then its a 15-20min walk?
Why is that too far to walk if you're already having to make a journey someplace else to collect the car?

With 2 wheels..what you choose to do is what you choose to do. If you choose to wear jeans instead of armoured trousers then so be it. The choice is the important bit, you're obviously old enough to make your own decisions. Your daughter isnt.
A young child will do whatever their parents encourage them to do, including getting onto a scooter and getting killed. Even falling off at low speed, a grown up might get a few cuts and bruises, a young child will get a lifelong debilitating injury. For the sake of a 15minute walk with your daughter to school every day, and the time well spent in doing so, its a no-brainer to my mind.

Or if that really isnt an honest option, then maybe reorganise your schedules...can your wife drop the daughter to school instead,even if its out of her way moreso then yours?

What about buying a pushbike and bringing her on that? Still a small risk involved, but far far less than a scooter and on roads depending on your location,but still much quicker than walking- And you get excercise!

To answer your questions because I have to be in work for 9.30am which my work kindly let me change my hours, I do not have time to walk the 20mins plus back and forth to school if I am to get to work in time.
As for getting a bike - Ironically when she was 2 I used to bring her to creche on the back of a bicycle and then cycle to work this was when I was living in Town. Actually I did not find it that safe on a bike as hard to get weight distribution etc, no acceleration, dangerous when wet etc would feel safer on a bike but as I say not till she is a good bit older. Also now my work is a good 9/10 miles away.

As for the 5mins journey there, when I drop the car back it on the way to work so does not really add any time to my journey.

As for wife reorganising ourselves given that she works in a creche and they used to go to work together, we have had to do alot of reorganising in order just to get her to and from school. My wife starts work at 7.30am finishing at 1pm in order to collect here. Unfortunately given we live in dublin both of us have to work to afford to live here

Given I have been travelling over 6 years through the heart of dublins traffic on bike and over 14 years by car. My awareness of cars, bikes, pedestrians is quite good- always give myself enough time hopefully, pass as wide as possible if no oncoming traffic, always looking under, over, through cars for Pedestrians. Actually closest I have come to accidents is with bikes and pedestrians who just don't bother looking and fly out in front of you.

As for Excercise- I play sport 3/4 times a week so reasonably fit and only enjoy sport which involves chasing something /is competive, hence don't enjoy cycling or gyms.

Hotblack Desiato

Jamesobrady wrote:

I was invisioning the use of cycle lanes in a built up area when i replied.

So was I! Have you seen the state of some of them? :eek: Generally their design and execution are very poor, and that's before they get filled with broken glass and parked cars.

Krusty_Clown

It's an interesting debate. At what point do you think a child is of a reasonable age to make their own decisions about riding pillion?

My 6 year old is restricted to a little spin up and down the road outside my house and nothing more (which upsets her greatly). In my mind she's too young, and I would doubt the availability of proper bike gear anyway..

But I'm comfortable enough carrying my 13 year old, who has a fitted helmet, bike jacket, bike trousers, and boots.. I started letting him ride pillion (his request, not mine!) from when he got his bike gear (when he was around 10 or 11)..

Irrelevant, but interesting: Valentino was first on a bike when he was two, started kart-racing when he was 5, racing (and winning) mini-motos when he was 11, and moved to 125cc racing when he was 14. Admittedly it's unlikely that there are any Valentino's in my stable..

galwaytt

...which brings up a point: where can I get actual kids helmets? Tried at the bike show, even amongst the MX stands, but to no avail.

I've got a 7 year old and a 4 year old, both adept quad riders, and now have a QR50 arranged for the 7 year old.

The Doktor

Try www.babybiker.co.uk
They have an XS HJC AC10??? Which is usually a couple of hundred sterling for only 60 sterling.
Also a good range of moto x... and jackets trousers boots etc.

I got the whole lot except boots from them, and only 15 quid postage.

Krusty_Clown

Very tricky finding an appropriate helmet.. Eventually found one in PlanetMoto. If you can manage it, I reckon Heine Gericke in NornIron would be a good spot.. A large number of shops will only carry motox helmet sin kids sizes, but they might be what you're looking for anyway.

tk123

Krusty_Clown wrote:

Admittedly it's unlikely that there are any Valentino's in my stable..

Well it's obviously the little girl - thats why she's so keen to get on the bike!!:rolleyes: