Theory about time and the Island

stevejazzx

Has anyone heard of the 'man made island theory'?
It was something I thought of since the pilot when we heard the trees been pulled down like something was staging/organising parts of the Island for our losties.After the last ep when naomi says that her co-ordinates showed just water I remebered my man made island idea. It also explain the hatches etc as monitoring stations as a man made Island would tie in with secret govenrment funding projects which lead to something like 'smokie'. Then they try to and purge the hostiles, or locals from another close-by Island who are interfering with the dharma projects, after the purge smokies malfunctions as it's accumulated artificial intellignce can't resolve with the 'purge' and it turns agianst dharma. It now protects that center of energy on the Island which is responsible for healing that Dharma orignally tried to harness (the cable). The energy is also responsible for the Ghosts of Island as it accentuates their presence
to the point where their thoughts are audible, the old electromagnetic Ghost idea.
Time is travelling much quicker on the Island because inside the swan hatch a core is rotating much faster than the earths core. This provides the em field of the Island and explains how des crossed time when the hatch imploded, very sci-fi this bit...it explains why the plane crashed in daylight and also explains the problem with Island conception, as time is moiving faster the gestation period of babies is significantly shortened, cue alperts diagram of the 70 year old womb belonging to a 30 year old woman.
With the island ahead of time it can warn the old world of impending diaster and this is the ultimate goal of the dharma project
the sonic sub is used to traverse the the old world and the new world
Mikail was not looking at live pictures from the communications center becasue his equipment was somehow crossing the time zones, after desmond follows kelvin out of the hatch the em field (not relaeshed by pressing the button) builds up and pulls the losties plane from the old world (the clue in the pilot was the acceleration of the plane) into the lost world thereby creating a dual fate for the losties just like desmonds dual fate with penny and the photograph, Naomi is telling the truth when she say s that 815 crashed becasue it did in the real world but it also exists in the future, the two worlds enjoyiong a kind of mutal exclusivity both relying on each other so the losties aren't dead they just exist across dimensions, you know that problem we all had with desmond in FBYE
The others are also on a spiritual journey in forming a society that might have to oneday become a restarting society for the whole human race in the event of a diaster, possibly a virus that Dharma/Hanso needed to transport from the future to the past in order to test but perhaps now the megamonical Ben has decided that old world no longer should be saved and that his people are to be the next race. Ben has chosen some of the losties to join his group and is intent on staying in the future, this is why he needs to Juliet to figure out the pregnancy problem and he feels that smokey will not accept any people from the past, smokey is course corrector who is ensuring that time doesn't get crossed. That is why it is intent on destroying the Losties. Something like that.

ZiabR

You talking about Parallel Universes?

stevejazzx

maybe....

I like the bit about the Island spinning faster but the sperate co existing pasts and presents is a hard idea to reconcile.

ZiabR

Are you implying that because time is actually moving alot faster on the Island that the womens Wombs are aging alot faster and this in turn is causing the problems with pregnancy?

I have read this 3 times now . It has some interesting points i must say.

Mellor

Not much of that makes sense, alot of it is based in utter trash.
If the island was "spinning faster" than the world time would still be the same. people would age the same, clocks would still work on real world time, they would probably mis count days, this is of course not possible
but if they linked to the real world it would be the same, the live link proved this.

If the earth suddenly started spinning faster, we would live no shorter or longer (measured in years, seconds etc), nothing would change expect that the length of a day would change. Obviously you couldn't measure time in these new days, but all other times are the same. Most importantly, this would have no effect on pregnancy.
And even IF time was spend up, it still would have no effect on pregnancy, as the growth of the baby would change too,

People seam to think if you fly around the world faster than it spins you can travel in time, not true in the slightest, and I think an old superman story from the 60s is to blame, if lost tried anything this stupid they would be flamed,

stevejazzx

Mellor wrote:

Not much of that makes sense, alot of it is based in utter trash.
If the island was "spinning faster" than the world time would still be the same. people would age the same, clocks would still work on real world time, they would probably mis count days, this is of course not possible
but if they linked to the real world it would be the same, the live link proved this.

If the earth suddenly started spinning faster, we would live no shorter or longer (measured in years, seconds etc), nothing would change expect that the length of a day would change. Obviously you couldn't measure time in these new days, but all other times are the same. Most importantly, this would have no effect on pregnancy.
And even IF time was spend up, it still would have no effect on pregnancy, as the growth of the baby would change too,

People seam to think if you fly around the world faster than it spins you can travel in time, not true in the slightest, and I think an old superman story from the 60s is to blame, if lost tried anything this stupid they would be flamed,

theororetically time can move faster
but actually you're kinda right ..I was jotting it out onto the page here from work with one eye on the door for my boss
so i'll try to make this nonsense make a little more sense or at least in some way more logical
First I think the episode involving Desmond 'time travelling' is lost already pushing way beyond thr realms of just pseudo science, tptb said in the latest podcast to look to the borderline sci-fi to figure out lost, i think or am pretty sure it involves time
I think there is spinning core inside the hatch. it casues the isalnd to experience time differently than the outside world, so the sub is used to traverse those dimensions, this is the reason for sedating juliet I think, the other dharma guys probably have astronaut type training which prepares them for the kind of geforce involved with traversing the two dimensions...
so perhaps dharma have a way to see the future perhaps involving time, after all desmond can and only because he has some communion with the island like locke.
the womens wombs are aging too quickly, everyone on the island is subject to this i think. after all alpert showed juiet a 70 year womb old belonging to a 30 year old so using occams razor we deduce that the island is the problem, it is making these wombs age quickly, then we deduce that from desmon and fbye that time is moving funnily, then becasue des can see the future we deduce that certain parties have been ahead of time and relaying back. then if we take naomis information and believe we appear to two sets of losties one s which were pulled into some kind of dimsension and other s who crashed in flight 815....

Anima

the womens wombs are aging too quickly

Why would time only be affecting the womb of a woman and not the woman as a whole? In fact, why wouldn't everything be affected? If time is different on the island, then it will be different for everything or nothing. I don't thing this kind of 'selective aging' makes much sense being honest.

From last weeks episode, with the conversation between Locke and Richard. I got the impression that the whole fertility thing is just a side project anyway and is not really the main reason the Other's are on the island.

ZiabR

Anima wrote:

Why would time only be affecting the womb of a woman and not the woman as a whole? In fact, why wouldn't everything be affected? If time is different on the island, then it will be different for everything or nothing. I don't thing this kind of 'selective aging' makes much sense being honest.

I did not say that. I asked if that is what was meant in the post. I was trying to understand what the post meant in full.

Mellor

stevejazzx wrote:

theororetically time can move faster

Yeah, but anyone involved in that speed up time wouldn't notice, as everything would be speed up equally, it would have no effect on growth etc

The live link proves this to be untrue, also by talking to Naomi, they would quickly find out if the date was off by alot.

I think there is spinning core inside the hatch. it casues the isalnd to experience time differently than the outside world, so the sub is used to traverse those dimensions, this is the reason for sedating juliet I think, the other dharma guys probably have astronaut type training which prepares them for the kind of geforce involved with traversing the two dimensions...

A core? What the hell is that? The earths core doesn't spin reletive to the people on it. And even when you leave the earths athmosphere you are no longer affected by the earth spinning, but are still affected by time,
Time and no relation to the spinning of the earth.
It was fairly obvious, that she was sedated so as to avoid the shock of seeing the sub, she would of expected a plane.

the womens wombs are aging too quickly, everyone on the island is subject to this i think. after all alpert showed juiet a 70 year womb old belonging to a 30 year old so using occams razor we deduce that the island is the problem, it is making these wombs age quickly,

As above if time was spedd up, so who everyting, not just the womb, so it would have no effect. The island is clearly affecting them, but i doubt time distorting is an issue

then we deduce that from desmon and fbye that time is moving funnily, then becasue des can see the future we deduce that certain parties have been ahead of time and relaying back. then if we take naomis information and believe we appear to two sets of losties one s which were pulled into some kind of dimsension and other s who crashed in flight 815...

You assume time was moving funnily, no proof for it. Yet there is proof there isn't, live link, Naomi etc. You also assume Darma are ahead of time, once again, no proof, just a blind assumption

As for the news that they found the plane, and there are two sets of losties etc,
that is the least believable explanation.
Isn't it more likely that Darma/others staged the plane wreckage to stop people looking for the plane and finding the island in the process.
They could of set up a fake plane, or even more likely they could of arranged it so that they were part of the crew that was searching, and they gave back false reports.

Mellor

logik wrote:

I did not say that. I asked if that is what was meant in the post. I was trying to understand what the post meant in full.

he wasn't quoting you, he was quoting stevejazzx

PullMyFinger!

Its interesting to note from that in the recent EW interview when Cuse & Lindelof were asked:

Does the finale set up season four?


CUSE: Yes. The finale clearly sets up season four of the show, and hopefully in doing so, people will see there is still a lot of storytelling left in Lost and will feel really good about the 48 number.

LINDELOF: And it will make you realize that the house you are standing in actually has a lot more rooms than you thought when you came into it.

That last line really made me stop and think. The teasing bastarrds


That coupled with Naomi's recent statement (she could be Dharma but still) and Cuse and Lindolf saying they were going to drop a major hint/anagram Desmond's flashback/flash-foward episode this year

(now known to be the company Juliet went to work for translating to "lost time")

Add that all up and you just know the finale is going to towards a massive *island* reveal at the end of this season.

It was something I thought of since the pilot when we heard the trees been pulled down like something was staging/organising parts of the Island for our losties.

Where exactly does this happen in the Pilot Steve? I wouldnt mind having a listen myself.

ZiabR

Mellor wrote:

he wasn't quoting you, he was quoting stevejazzx

Yes you are right, my apologies Anima. My mistake.

Cainer

Mellor wrote:

Isn't it more likely that Darma/others staged the plane wreckage to stop people looking for the plane and finding the island in the process.
They could of set up a fake plane, or even more likely they could of arranged it so that they were part of the crew that was searching, and they gave back false reports.

That's exactly what i've been thinking. Definitly a planned cover-up by Dharma/Widemore/Government/whoever......

With the losties plane being so far down that only robots could reach it, how could they identify individual bodies? A bit like the Titanic, and there's even a conspiricy that that wasn't real either, it was actually it's sister ship The Olympic.

stevejazzx

Mellor wrote:

Yeah, but anyone involved in that speed up time wouldn't notice, as everything would be speed up equally, it would have no effect on growth etc

yeah you're right i tired to rephrase in my second attempt/post what i meant
time existing across dimensions and those dimensions if realised can effect each other, what carlton means i think with his many rooms idea.

mellor wrote:

The live link proves this to be untrue, also by talking to Naomi, they would quickly find out if the date was off by alot.

so you've got a point about time how it speeds up and slows down, ok you're most likely right there but it's a problem of dimensions

mellor wrote:

[A core? What the hell is that? The earths core doesn't spin reletive to the people on it. [/COLOR]

ok i don't who said that (that the earths core spins realtive to the peple on it) it certainly wasn't me, what you on about?
btw a core is
Core
The average density of Earth is 5515 kg/m3, making it the densest planet in the Solar system. Since the average density of surface material is only around 3000 kg/m3, we must conclude that denser materials exist within Earth's core. Further evidence for the high density core comes from the study of seismology. In its earliest stages, about 4.5 billion (4.5×109) years ago, melting would have caused denser substances to sink toward the center in a process called planetary differentiation (see also the iron catastrophe), while less-dense materials would have migrated to the crust. As a result, the core is largely composed of iron (80%), along with nickel and one or more light elements, whereas other dense elements, such as lead and uranium, either are too rare to be significant or tend to bind to lighter elements and thus remain in the crust (see felsic materials).

Seismic measurements show that the core is divided into two parts, a solid inner core with a radius of ~1220 km and a liquid outer core extending beyond it to a radius of ~3400 km. The solid inner core was discovered in 1936 by Inge Lehmann and is generally believed to be composed primarily of iron and some nickel. Some have argued that the inner core may be in the form of a single iron crystal.[3][4] The liquid outer core surrounds the inner core and is believed to be composed of iron mixed with nickel and trace amounts of lighter elements. Recent speculation suggests that the innermost part of the core is enriched in very heavy elements, trans-cesium elements (above atomic number 55), this would include gold, mercury and uranium.[5]

It is generally believed that convection in the outer core, combined with stirring caused by the Earth's rotation (see: Coriolis effect), gives rise to the Earth's magnetic field through a process described by the dynamo theory. The solid inner core is too hot to hold a permanent magnetic field (see Curie temperature) but probably acts to stabilise the magnetic field generated by the liquid outer core.

Recent evidence has suggested that the inner core of Earth may rotate slightly faster than the rest of the planet.[6] In August 2005 a team of geophysicists announced in the journal Science that, according to their estimates, Earth's inner core rotates approximately 0.3 to 0.5 degrees per year relative to the rotation of the surface.[7][8]

The current scientific explanation for the Earth's temperature gradient is a combination of the heat left over from the planet's initial formation, the decay of radioactive elements, and the freezing of the inner core. Other theories include the georeactor theory.

mnellor wrote:

And even when you leave the earths athmosphere you are no longer affected by the earth spinning, but are still affected by time,
Time and no relation to the spinning of the earth.
It was fairly obvious, that she was sedated so as to avoid the shock of seeing the sub, she would of expected a plane.

don't think so - as the losties were also all sedated with the exception of kate most likely again with orange juice dished out by cindy, oj for juliet oj for jack and locke etc, charlie didn't get any, he shot up, the oj thoery is well established as mental as it first sounded when i heard it first

mellor wrote:

As above if time was spedd up, so who everyting, not just the womb, so it would have no effect. The island is clearly affecting them, but i doubt time distorting is an issue

well again not sped up or slowed down, but acting oddly, i'm not sure how but my theory is that time and the way it moves is the fertility problem

mellor wrote:

You assume time was moving funnily, no proof for it. Yet there is proof there isn't, live link, Naomi etc. You also assume Darma are ahead of time, once again, no proof, just a blind assumption

you're almost right there except the countless refernces to time
mrs. hawking, stephen hawking, hurleys comment 'from any time' sayids comment about the satellite phone being advanced, the incredibly fast aging wombs, the children going missing, desmond seeing the futute, the universe course correcting, the valenzetti equation, dharma studying time as a main project, danielle s team originally were on the island to study time, the original name for lost was 'circle' an einstein reference to time, desmond time travels more or less.......

mellor wrote:

As for the news that they found the plane, and there are two sets of losties etc

that is the least believable explanation.
Isn't it more likely that Darma/others staged the plane wreckage to stop people looking for the plane and finding the island in the process.
They could of set up a fake plane, or even more likely they could of arranged it so that they were part of the crew that was searching, and they gave back false reports.

of course but naomi appears to be sent by penny having the photograph and explaining the em anomaly so why would she lie, a set up? i weighed it up...na, i believe naomi

ZiabR

Alot of what Mellor is talking about is directly related to physics. People will try to justify what lost is about, it being a sci-fi by means of scence and physics.

I can see this thread going on for awhile...

stevejazzx

Anima wrote:

Why would time only be affecting the womb of a woman and not the woman as a whole? In fact, why wouldn't everything be affected? If time is different on the island, then it will be different for everything or nothing. I don't thing this kind of 'selective aging' makes much sense being honest.

From last weeks episode, with the conversation between Locke and Richard. I got the impression that the whole fertility thing is just a side project anyway and is not really the main reason the Other's are on the island.

yeah i don't know the answer to that but i still suspect time to the problematic factor regarding ferility

stevejazzx

logik wrote:

Alot of what Mellor is talking about is directly related to physics. People will try to justify what lost is about, it being a sci-fi by means of scence and physics.

I can see this thread going on for awhile...

well i've just finished my reply to him and i think he's got quite a few things wrong

naomi s telling the truth
oj used to sedate losties
time and dimensions seem to be a huge factor

I could be way out and he may very well be correct I guess time will tell!

Mellor

stevejazzx wrote:

well i've just finished my reply to him and i think he's got quite a few things wrong

naomi s telling the truth
oj used to sedate losties
time and dimensions seem to be a huge factor

I could be way out and he may very well be correct I guess time will tell!

What did I get wrong??
Where did I say Naomi lied? Can you show me? I never said she lied, where did you get that idea??? I believe her fully, and I think her sat phone is advanced because is funded by widmore, they are a huge mutli national, they supply her with the most high tech equipment, far better than they had in the first gulf war when Sayid was in service. I think this will turn into a huge ironic side story btw, Penny, using her dads money, hires a portuguese team to find desmond, who happens to be on an island that was the research base for Dharma, a company that was funded by Widmore also!!

As for the OJ, if they were sedated with OJ, it would suggest that the others organised their arrival. As they organised the OJ for juilette,
if they knew they were coming why were they surprised by the crash, Ben had to make snap decisions and orders to deal with it, they clearly didnt know and if they did they would of been ready.

As for your copy and paste about the core??? All that did was back up my statements up, the spinning core in the earth has no effect, time, gravity, magnetic poles are all caused by other things. And besides, thats the earths core, how could there be another inside the hatch? Man-made or naturally occuring.

I imagine that the whole story behind lost will be a little sci-fi. But the writers will need to base it on fairly sound principles, or else they will be slated by the public.
I just don't think that time will be a huge part of it, as its they would be doing very well to prove it.
I feel that there is alot that would make it unlikely (although anything is possible in lost) for a time difference. These are some reasons from the top of my head.

• The link between the real world and between Mikail.
• The fact that a number of the others travel between the island and america etc, these are Richard, Ethan and some others
• And the fact that desmond came to the island 3 years before the losties, but when they crashed, the date from the island (via the computer list) was the same as the date the plane was chartered for. If there was a difference it would show up here.

Anima

what carlton means i think with his many rooms idea.

I don't think he was referring to anything specifically in the storyline with that statement. I think he was hinting at the fact that the Lost we know currently will be a lot bigger and more complex next season story wise.

well again not sped up or slowed down, but acting oddly, i'm not sure how but my theory is that time and the way it moves is the fertility problem

No offense Steve but a theory usually involves some kind of explanation rather than just "I don't know how or why or when but this is the way it is". I think Mellor's reasoning on how time is 1:1 with the rest of the world, i.e. live video feeds, computer dates etc, makes a lot more sense.

stevejazzx

Mellor wrote:

What did I get wrong??
Where did I say Naomi lied? Can you show me? I never said she lied, where did you get that idea???

yeah it cam across that away, sorry, I never said you said she lied. I said she's telling the truth by which I mean that there wasn't another 815. You think she s been conned like the rest of the world with a fake plane, another 815 plane? This was of course my first thought but the more it goes on I don't think this is the answer, I may of course be completely wrong and looking into too much but hey...I havn'y postulated a wacky theory in a while and thought I throw some stuff out there

mellor wrote:

I believe her fully, and I think her sat phone is advanced because is funded by widmore, they are a huge mutli national, they supply her with the most high tech equipment, far better than they had in the first gulf war when Sayid was in service. I think this will turn into a huge ironic side story btw, Penny, using her dads money, hires a portuguese team to find desmond, who happens to be on an island that was the research base for Dharma, a company that was funded by Widmore also!!

Yeah I'd more or less go along with that as a possible explanation but I reckon Penny knows quite a bit at this stage.

mellor wrote:

As for the OJ, if they were sedated with OJ, it would suggest that the others organised their arrival. As they organised the OJ for juilette,
if they knew they were coming why were they surprised by the crash, Ben had to make snap decisions and orders to deal with it, they clearly didnt know and if they did they would of been ready.

Yeah well this has been discussed in some depth anf the upshot of it all is there appears to be more evidence to support the theory that they were brought ot the Island despite 'Bens' apparent surprise in 3x01.

mellor wrote:

As for your copy and paste about the core??? All that did was back up my statements up, the spinning core in the earth has no effect, time, gravity, magnetic poles are all caused by other things. And besides, thats the earths core, how could there be another inside the hatch? Man-made or naturally occuring

You've got all that wrong. The core of the earth effects all those things.

nmellor wrote:

I imagine that the whole story behind lost will be a little sci-fi. But the writers will need to base it on fairly sound principles, or else they will be slated by the public.
I just don't think that time will be a huge part of it, as its they would be doing very well to prove it.
I feel that there is alot that would make it unlikely (although anything is possible in lost) for a time difference. These are some reasons from the top of my head.

• The link between the real world and between Mikail.
• The fact that a number of the others travel between the island and america etc, these are Richard, Ethan and some others
• And the fact that desmond came to the island 3 years before the losties, but when they crashed, the date from the island (via the computer list) was the same as the date the plane was chartered for. If there was a difference it would show up here.

Yeah absolutely, you obviously know your lost and you might well be right. There seems to be of late in particular FBYE some irrecoincible problems with time and also the closely guarded secret until of late that danielles team were studying time.
I guess we'll find out shortly enough, it's just a theory...half baked one maybe but I had some time free so.....

stevejazzx

Anima wrote:

I don't think he was referring to anything specifically in the storyline with that statement. I think he was hinting at the fact that the Lost we know currently will be a lot bigger and more complex next season story wise.

Fair enough

anima wrote:

No offense Steve but a theory usually involves some kind of explanation rather than just "I don't know how or why or when but this is the way it is". I think Mellor's reasoning on how time is 1:1 with the rest of the world, i.e. live video feeds, computer dates etc, makes a lot more sense.

Thats true. I tried to explain in a few posts now that this was wittled off in work and that should be considered. Instead of thoery I could say that it is a loose idea about time and in particular dimensions playing a key, really significant role in lost.

Killaqueen!!!

I don't think the ultimate answer will be too complicated in the end. It's a tv program after all and the average joe isn't as nerdy to be discussing theoreys in depth on the internet. Time does seem to come into it though....I'm not sure...you could have the right idea here..

Demetrius

Bah!...the last episode/film will end with John Locke waking up in the shower like Bobby in Dallas.:)

Mellor

stevejazzx wrote:

Mellor wrote:

As for your copy and paste about the core??? All that did was back up my statements up, the spinning core in the earth has no effect, time, gravity, magnetic poles are all caused by other things. And besides, thats the earths core, how could there be another inside the hatch? Man-made or naturally occuring

You've got all that wrong. The core of the earth effects all those things.

Ok, please explain how the earths core has an effect on those things.
Time, Gravity, and Magnetic poles,
As as far as I was aware there is no effect,

time is a constant, the core has no effect on it, the whole earth has no effect,
gravity is based on a universal constant, it is proportional to the combined mass of the two bodys (earth and moon, earth and person, sun and earth) and inversally proportional to the distance between centres of gravity. The earths core has no effect, it was removed and its mass put in other areas, with the core empty. gravity would be the same


And the magnetic field is believed to be cause by currents in the layer of molten iron that surrounds the core, not affected by the core either


Can toy explain I was wrong, instead of just saying I was wrong.



As for naomi, your still not making sense,
You believe that there is a second 815, due to two realities
I believe that there is another due to a cover-up,

Mellor

Killaqueen!!! wrote:

I don't think the ultimate answer will be too complicated in the end. It's a tv program after all and the average joe isn't as nerdy to be discussing theoreys in depth on the internet. Time does seem to come into it though....I'm not sure...you could have the right idea here..

I agree

somuj

Mellor wrote:

Ok, please explain how the earths core has an effect on those things.
Time, Gravity, and Magnetic poles,
As as far as I was aware there is no effect,

time is a constant, the core has no effect on it, the whole earth has no effect,

Time is in no way constant.

Mellor wrote:

gravity is based on a universal constant, it is proportional to the combined mass of the two bodys (earth and moon, earth and person, sun and earth) and inversally proportional to the distance between centres of gravity.

There isn't really any such thing as gravity. Tis an just a reaction to the curvature of space from bodies of mass

Mellor wrote:

The earths core has no effect, it was removed and its mass put in other areas, with the core empty. gravity would be the same

Mellor

somuj wrote:

Time is in no way constant.

If you make idiotic claims please attempt to back them up.


This is just down right funny. Time is a constant, the units it is measured in can change depending on situation. Such as a day or year are not constant. The earths core has no effect on time. That is what I said, please show me some infomation to prove this wrong.
obviously there are situation, were time cannnot be measure, such as when travelling at (or approaching) the speed of light. But this doesn't apply to earth, and the earths core.

There isn't really any such thing as gravity. Tis an just a reaction to the curvature of space from bodies of mass

This is the perfect example of how information is dangerous. You are quite mistaken here. And I think you are mixing up two things.
Of course there is such a thing as gravity. If you understood this you wouldn't of quoted me as my discription was spot on. It is a reaction relating to mass, distance between bodies, and the gravitational constant.

All bodies (even people) that have mass exert a force of gravity, but it is not really noticable in bodies smaller than planets.


Every single point mass attracts every other point mass by a force pointing along the line combining the two. The force is proportional to the product of the two masses and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between the point masses

Thats the sci discription, I gave a laymans version in my original post.


As for your "curves of space", I believe you are confusing gravity and orbits.
Orbits are created by gravity. The moon is falling towards the earth, but the earth is constantly moving, this results in a curved path around the earth. its hard to explain, this should help.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orbit#Understanding_orbits


Anyway, you were mixed up, and it has nothing to do with the topic of the thread.

So to get back on track, time could be related to the island, but I imagine that the bases for it would have to be very solid, as it will be ripped to shreds all over the web.

stevejazzx

Mellor wrote:

Ok, please explain how the earths core has an effect on those things.
Time, Gravity, and Magnetic poles,
As as far as I was aware there is no effect,

Ok, well the earths core is the center of the earths gravity.
Because the outer core contains iron, when it flows it generates a magnetic field. This is of course the source of the Earth's magnetic field.

mellor wrote:

As for naomi, your still not making sense,
You believe that there is a second 815, due to two realities
I believe that there is another due to a cover-up,

Well kind of. I believe it's the same one (plane) across some kind of dimsension. Now, I know that sounds 'out there' but there have been a few hints to this. The idea that everyone thought originally that alll the losties dead were i think is actually the idea of dimensions, where the universe can change in many ways the outcome of a certain event. There is course correction going on to ensure that certain outcomes prevail over others but the crash involving the lsoties has not yet been resolved or course corrected. But you know I'm still open to the cover up thing, it was my first thought but I get the feeling that the writers wern't just dropping all those time refernces in for nothing.

Mellor

Ok, well the earths core is the center of the earths gravity.
Because the outer core contains iron, when it flows it generates a magnetic field. This is of course the source of the Earth's magnetic field.

The core is centre of gravity by default, it has no effect on gravity, it just happens to be there.
And the magnetic field is create my currents in the molten iron, I said this previously, once again, the solid core has no effect, and its the outer molten layer
We are going in circles, your just copying what i have said.
We'll have to wait and see.

somuj

Mellor wrote:

If you make idiotic claims please attempt to back them up.

.

You might want to give the general theory of relativity a once over.

Ever here of a little spaceship called gravity probe B. You may wish to look it up.

While your at it you may wish to google time?

Mellor

somuj wrote:

You might want to give the general theory of relativity a once over.

Ever here of a little spaceship called gravity probe B. You may wish to look it up.

While your at it you may wish to google time?

and you may wish to read my whole post, I already refered to theory of relativity, and pointed out that it doesnt apply to Newtonian physics on earth, and my comments about time were in relation to time on the island being unaffected by a rotating core in the hatch.

as for gravity probe b, i dont know much about it at all, i believe its a satalite not a spaceship, but i could be wrong, and it is measuring ideas that came from the theory of relativity, frame dragging and geodetic effect.
The only reason I know this is because the geodetic effect was comfirm the last month. in terms of the whole universe no time isnt a constant, I have already said this, but the rotation of the earths core has no effect on time on earth, and a rotating object in the hatch would have no effect on the islands time. and time on earth is a constant. The objects would need to be massive, ie planets, to have an effect.
Your comments mean nothing, as they have no relevance to what we were talking about. the effects of time in space has no application on the island, I have already said this. The writers may choose to go this route, but it would be silly.

stevejazzx

Anima wrote: »

I don't think he was referring to anything specifically in the storyline with that statement. I think he was hinting at the fact that the Lost we know currently will be a lot bigger and more complex next season story wise.



No offense Steve but a theory usually involves some kind of explanation rather than just "I don't know how or why or when but this is the way it is". I think Mellor's reasoning on how time is 1:1 with the rest of the world, i.e. live video feeds, computer dates etc, makes a lot more sense.

Been waiting a while for this:

Ha ha..told you so@!:)

aahhhh that felt good

loon

i love it when people try to discuss time...

as of yet, no-one has actually mentioned 'time' as you mean it, yet.

stevejazzx

loon wrote: »

i love it when people try to discuss time...

as of yet, no-one has actually mentioned 'time' as you mean it, yet.

You wanna explain to me time 'how I mean it' then? In this thread that I started over a year ago or so all I ever tried to say was that time played as big part in what was going on overall I wasn't claiming to know exactly, we're still unsure on how exactly time works on and off the island but it was interesting how others seemed so convincined and said that 'time' on the island was normal and that that had been proved by live streams etc...which was annoying because there was quite a bit of evidence for the time factor.

loon

i wasn't talking about anyone in particular...

it just makes laugh when people confuse 'the rate of change' and 'time'. time is a measurement eg. seconds, minutes, hours, etc. whereas the rate of change are the effects which occur during time.

when people talk about travelling through time, they actually mean traversing the effects of time.

also, the STR has nothing to do with time or time travel... it is an equation based on travelling faster than the perceived rate of change.

and let's just be thankful that this isn't heroes.

Chardee MacDennis

stevejazzx wrote: »

Been waiting a while for this:

Ha ha..told you so@!:)

aahhhh that felt good

huh? time does runs at the same rate on the island....

stevejazzx

Call_me_al wrote: »

huh? time does runs at the same rate on the island....

perhaps read through the thread, the point was over a year ago made that time played a very significant part in what was going on and thats the way it has gone, not that I was totally right or anything in my predictions just that others were totally wrong...

Anima

Eh... what? Have you really been keeping this thread at the back of your mind for the past year? Amazing stuff.

Time is 1:1 with the island as we found out recently. I never said in this thread that time didn't play a part. I don't there was anyone who thought it didn't. So I really don't know what you're at in fairness.

stevejazzx

Anima wrote: »

Eh... what? Have you really been keeping this thread at the back of your mind for the past year? Amazing stuff.

well considering i could have come to this thread way befroe now should give you the clue that no i haven't been keeping this in my mind, was just looking at some old threads saw this and then i bumped it becasue i remebered how certain some people were saying that 'time' would not play a major part in the show - but clearly it has.

anima wrote:

Time is 1:1 with the island as we found out recently. I never said in this thread that time didn't play a part. I don't there was anyone who thought it didn't. So I really don't know what you're at in fairness.

if you read the thread my argument came down do time being a major factor, long before we knew for sure it was...thats all.
you essentially were in the camp that said that time wasn't going to become a major factor essentially saying that is was regular at which was denoted by the 1:1 reference then, didn't play in the pregnancies etc, there's not one comment from you in the thread stating that you thought 'time' was or would play a major role in the show'....thats all

...I bumped the thread more becasue I think the issue of time in lost is very intersting and revelant obviously to the current stroyline..

cooker3

Be honest, you bumped it because you wanted to say you were right and everyone else is wrong

Anima

if you read the thread my argument came down do time being a major factor, long before we knew for sure it was...thats all.

Yeah but what about the other mulititude of garbage you were spouting. I mean anyone can write a crazy bastard theory and then come back months later and say "see I was right about this part". Like come on Steve, clutching at straws. If you had guessed that time was the same on the island and the world but there was some weird effect when crossing then yeah there would be kudos. You only said that time plays a part, which we already knew at that point when you created this thread. I really don't know what you are getting at, so lets leave it at that.

Sherifu

Anima wrote: »

I mean anyone can write a crazy bastard theory and then come back months later and say "see I was right about this part".

Too true.

stevejazzx

cooker3 wrote: »

Be honest, you bumped it because you wanted to say you were right and everyone else is wrong

Not really, I mean all the thread was about at the time was 'time and dimensions' playing a big part, I bumped more out the fact that it was now more revelant and also I wanted to see what those who shooting it down so vigilantly at the time had to say, from the sound of things though now they were in agreement all along!

stevejazzx

Anima wrote: »

Yeah but what about the other mulititude of garbage you were spouting. I mean anyone can write a crazy bastard theory and then come back months later and say "see I was right about this part". Like come on Steve, clutching at straws. If you had guessed that time was the same on the island and the world but there was some weird effect when crossing then yeah there would be kudos. You only said that time plays a part, which we already knew at that point when you created this thread. I really don't know what you are getting at, so lets leave it at that.

It wasn't part of my theory it was the main jist of it

From thread

stevejazzx wrote:

Thats true. I tried to explain in a few posts now that this was wittled off in work and that should be considered. Instead of thoery I could say that it is a loose idea about time and in particular dimensions playing a key, really significant role in lost.

It is pretty conclusive you shot this sentiment down in the thread, you said that time was essentially noraml, you were way off. Now you say that its grand you pretty much realised all the way through that time and dimensions were important...review your posts in the thread it's utter bullsh1t to claim that now. It wasn't until much later that time was really established as a major factor.


By the by why the need to make it so personal?

anima wrote:

...utter garbage...crazy bastard thoery...etc

It was a friendly enough poke when I bumped it, right or wrong your tone is always agressive. Whats with that?

Hobbes

Currently reading "The invisibles". I suspect they nicked some of the storyline. Most likely the island itself is a sentient creature that lives at an intersection between quantum universes. So it is freely able to move through time/space however the scientists had locked it down some how so it couldn't "move". Moving would cause future events to never happen and the flashforwards are most likely the current future the cast is in now.

I'd throw in an "Island called Eureka" that the scientists set up shop there not fully realizing what it was.

The numbers most likely trap it in some way and it manifests itself into the real world through the numbers.

Would explain the comments of "The island won't let you die". It is able to push itself slightly to a different quantum state to stop things from happening.

Sherifu

Very interesting Hobbes. Good luck to them getting average viewers to understand it though.