Lets get to the bottom of.......the THURSDAY vote!

darkman2

Lads, I have to say im supprised there is not more uproar about not holding the election at the weekend. Me thinks Bertie is hoodwinking the people here and that Fianna Fail are intentionally undermining the democratic process because they bloody well dont want to see young collage students or young workers voting......I think this is a disgrace and its being done blatantly under our noses.

Think about it. It makes too much sense to hold an election at the weekend so.......lets not do it!? - Smack of low key corruption here tbh which will decide how we are governed for the next 5 years. And im a FF supporter!:eek: :mad:

stepbar

darkman2 wrote:

Lads, I have to say im supprised there is not more uproar about not holding the election at the weekend. Me thinks Bertie is hoodwinking the people here and that Fianna Fail are intentionally undermining the democratic process because they bloody well dont want to see young collage students or young workers voting......I think this is a disgrace and its being done blatantly under our noses.

Think about it. It makes too much sense to hold an election at the weekend so.......lets not do it!? - Smack of low key corruption here tbh which will decide how we are governed for the next 5 years. And im a FF supporter!:eek: :mad:

Who will you vote for so?

darkman2

Whilst not happy with the day of voting I cant see an alternative working so I can honestly tell you that I will still vote for the FF and PD''s to continue but that does not mean I have to be happy about this as I believe the other crowd would do the same thing anyway. A number of things could happen over the next couple of weeks to change my mind.........

Avns1s

I agree darkman. On one hand Bertie and indeed all the politicians say that everyone should use their vote (and I agree with this) but on the other hand they miss out on an easy opportunity to make it easy for them to vote. Eve a friday would have been better.

Maybe they were afraid they'd have to pay the Presiding Officers, Poll Clerks, etc. double time if it was a Sat or Sun. I suppose you'd also have a longer count.

It also strikes me that in Catholic Ireland, I'm sure there is a cohort that wouldn't want voting or counting etc on a Sunday, maybe Bertie is afraid of them having a lash at him! I don't think they'd be too numerous at this stage but it seems Bertie and FF need all the votes that they can get right now.

I'd also be interested in the answer to the question that Stepbar posed to you Darkman..... LOL (I see you got in even before I asked!!)

wow sierra

I think you should be registered where you live most of the time - ie Monday to Friday. You can be added to the register where you live now (ie midweek Thursday) up to 15 working days before the election. The polling day was well flagged so people should have availed of that option.

In my experience students are able to return to their hometowns for football training mid weeketc and are happy to miss lectures at the drop of a hat for very many reasons, so I don't see why they can't for something they allegedly are so upset over.

If this was a Fianna Fail ploy to reduce opposition vote - then the opposition should have been proactive in getting their young voters on the register in their University towns in time to vote.

stepbar

darkman2 wrote:

Smack of low key corruption here tbh which will decide how we are governed for the next 5 years. And im a FF supporter!

LOL brilliant LOL You complain and think its a disgrace but still you'll vote for FF. Nice one. LOL

darkman2

stepbar wrote:

LOL brilliant LOL You complain and think its a disgrace but still you'll vote for FF. Nice one. LOL

Well whilst a big error of judgment I dont think its enough to jeopordise the future of the country;) Something more siesmic will have to happen:rolleyes:

Crucifix

wow sierra wrote:

In my experience students are able to return to their hometowns for football training mid weeketc and are happy to miss lectures at the drop of a hat for very many reasons, so I don't see why they can't for something they allegedly are so upset over.

Just because some (ok, many) students are wasters doesn't mean there aren't diligant students being screwed over

wow sierra

wow sierra wrote:

In my experience students are able to return to their hometowns for football training mid weeketc and are happy to miss lectures at the drop of a hat for very many reasons, so I don't see why they can't for something they allegedly are so upset over.

As I said in another thread on this, students have exams at this time of year. My guess is that the only students who would be having lectures this time of year are those doing taught Masters.

flogen

I think they fear the youth vote, and most parties probably do, because it's such an unknown... for a start young people don't traditionally vote in big numbers (because they can't or won't, bit of both really) and secondly a lot of the younger voters are completely new and so are a real unknown quantity.

Besides thing young people are most likely to vote with their ideals rather than their pockets - they won't respond nearly as well to top-rate tax cuts and stamp duty promises because it means sweet fa to them - big salaries and mortgages are a million miles from them at the moment.

So you can either try to reach them, or just do your best to gerrymander them out of the picture - I don't think other big parties would do much differently to be honest.

Oh, and weren't the last local elections on a Saturday? Those same elections that saw historic defeats for FF? Fool them once, shame on you etc. etc.

stepbar

darkman2 wrote:

Well whilst a big error of judgment I dont think its enough to jeopordise the future of the country;) Something more siesmic will have to happen:rolleyes:

jeopordise the future of the economy!!!! FF are doing that at the moment.

darkman2

But its not all about students though. What about those who work in Dublin but can only vote down the country.

GerardKeating

darkman2 wrote:

Lads, I have to say im supprised there is not more uproar about not holding the election at the weekend. Me thinks Bertie is hoodwinking the people here and that Fianna Fail are intentionally undermining the democratic process because they bloody well dont want to see young collage students or young workers voting......I think this is a disgrace and its being done blatantly under our noses.

Think about it. It makes too much sense to hold an election at the weekend so.......lets not do it!? - Smack of low key corruption here tbh which will decide how we are governed for the next 5 years. And im a FF supporter!:eek: :mad:

But the Thursday vote does NOT deprive students of the vote, they were entitled to apply for a postal vote if they are in full time education and living away from home.

Same applies to those who's employment prevents them from voting..

darkman2

Well, I still think it would be easier just to hold it on a weekend for maximum turnout.

little miss

Personally, I think that it makes more sense to hold the election on a weekend to get a better turnout. Postal votes are problematic, especially for people who live in apartments or students in halls of residences as they can get lost. Its also a problem for those who know they are changing addresses, for example students who don't know when their exams will end etc when they register to vote. It makes sense for those people to register at home in order to make sure they are allowed to vote. Personally, I disagree with the whole idea of having to register to vote. At a time when everything is done electronically you should be able to print out your voting card and take it with you to any polling station. Every card would have an unique number or barcode obviously to stop you being able to vote more than once. Ok, I haven't totally thought this through, but I hope you get the idea. But until then, it would make sense to hold the vote on a Friday or Saturday.

A Random Walk

darkman2 wrote:

that I will still vote for the FF and PD''s to continue

Sums up so much about the country. Comes on here whinging and then expects someone else to do something about it. Reminds me of those eejits who are interviewed on vox pobs saying that the media should leave Bertie alone it was only a few grand - these are the same people who will be giving out when their sons and daughters can't afford to buy a house because development land in this country costs so much.

darkman2

A Random Walk wrote:

Sums up so much about the country. Comes on here whinging and then expects someone else to do something about it. Reminds me of those eejits who are interviewed on vox pobs saying that the media should leave Bertie alone it was only a few grand - these are the same people who will be giving out when their sons and daughters can't afford to buy a house because development land in this country costs so much.

Hold on for a second. Dont be making any assumptions about me here. You dont know me. Ive already explained why I will still be voting for the current government.

Zaph

darkman2 wrote:

Lads, I have to say im supprised there is not more uproar about not holding the election at the weekend.

May I refer you to this thread where it has already been discussed. And because I'm lazy, I'm just going to re-post my response from there.

I do have a certain amount of sympathy for students who won't be able to vote, but what I can't understand is why they're only moaning about it now. It's not as if it was a great state secret so that nobody would know there would be an election before June, so why wait until the election is called to complain about there being no time to register for a postal vote? Most have had as long as they've been in college to sort it out, and even if it wasn't uppermost in their minds before there's been plenty of media coverage since the start of the year. So to blame it on the government being sneaky is deflecting the issue, IMO, if the students complaining were really that interested in their democratic right they would have sorted things out long before now.

Having said all that, I do think it's an absolute disgrace that anyone studying abroad can't use a postal vote.

luapenak

wow sierra wrote:

I think you should be registered where you live most of the time - ie Monday to Friday. You can be added to the register where you live now (ie midweek Thursday) up to 15 working days before the election. The polling day was well flagged so people should have availed of that option.

In my experience students are able to return to their hometowns for football training mid weeketc and are happy to miss lectures at the drop of a hat for very many reasons, so I don't see why they can't for something they allegedly are so upset over.

If this was a Fianna Fail ploy to reduce opposition vote - then the opposition should have been proactive in getting their young voters on the register in their University towns in time to vote.

what?
a little less of the ignorance please
If you didn't know most university exams are on during the week of the voting. For example, i have an exam from 2-5 on the day of the election. Infact it is probably going to be one of , if not the hardest exam of my degree. There is not one person who won't need the whole morning to study for.Then they have to get home from dublin to all parts of the country to vote. some will, but for some it is going to be too difficult. By the way i dont know anybody excet people who live within an hours journey of dublin, that would head home mid week at the top of the hat. maybe your mixing up your use of students with arts students (no offence but they have a lot more free time). Why would one register to vote in their university town or city? luckily i live within commuting distance of dublin but i spend a lot of time there and have no idea about any of the candidates there. If you didnt already know, us students have extensive holidays, so half the timme is spend at home anyway. so why would one vote in a place where they spend half there time and for only a few years. There are plenty of people that will have moved home within a year or a few months for good, while the TD's will be elected for years.

wow sierra

Really - and there was I under the impression that because of unequal regional development the jobs were where the colleges were so ye would remain living there or ye would all be travelling the world next year!!! Not going back to Mammy & Daddy!!

Sorry, I will be serious. This election like every other one, while to a certain extent is about local issues and individual characters, is mainly about parties.

If you want your local Sligo/Laois Fine Gael TD to have influece in the future you are better off voting for the Fine Gael candidate in your college area and ensuring a change of Government. I thought as someone in College you would be able to grasp that.
I moved to Dublin in the 80's to go to College and immediatly registered there - I am very loyal to my home County and spend a lot of time there, but I have never voted there.

I really cant see the problem and as I said - IF YOU FELT SO STRONGLY ABOUT IT YOU SHOULD HAVE REGISTERED IN YOUR OWN AREA AND VOTED THE GOVERNMENT OUT.

S

Dave!

You can all go on about how it's on the students to ensure that they second guess the government, register to postal vote, etc., but at the end of the day the Taoiseach decides when the polling day is, and if he's a democrat, then he should ensure that he makes it as convenient as possible, for as many people as possible, to vote. And for that, the weekend would be the obvious choice. But because of the power the Taoiseach has with respect to this, he can be as cynical and crafty as he likes, and disenfranchise students if it's likely to benefit him.

Has he given a reason why Thursday was chosen? Any explanation?

GerardKeating

darkman2 wrote:

Well, I still think it would be easier just to hold it on a weekend for maximum turnout.

Actually, a weekend vote would not suit me, i live in Galway, but then to go home to Dublin at the weekend, no choice is perfect.

stepbar

darkman2 wrote:

Hold on for a second. Dont be making any assumptions about me here. You dont know me. Ive already explained why I will still be voting for the current government.

Explained in the context of this thread or other threads? Could you point me towards where you have explained your view because you sure havent in the context of this thread.

DMC

DaveMcG wrote:

Has he given a reason why Thursday was chosen? Any explanation?

I remember an interview Bertie gave a few months ago, and he said in 2002, the Friday vote didn't work well, and in Dublin especially, there was traffic trouble (Fridays on the M50 are no fun!) and it was wet. Dublin more so than the country is where the weather affects polling, as people are normally within walking distance of their polling station.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0322/ahernb.html

I would reckon, on Berties part, that those issues affected FF getting an overall majority. Noel Dempsey was minister for the Environment, and was very keen on electoral reform, ending of the dual mandate, the e-voting was trialled at the 2002 election in Meath, Dublin North and Dublin West. But as soon as Dempsey went from that post, the traditional way of things has resumed.

No one knows how or why Thursday is the "traditional" polling day.

Wishbone Ash

darkman2 wrote:

What about those who work in Dublin but can only vote down the country.

They will have had ample opportunities to transfer their vote. Anyone working and living in a particular part of the country should have their vote there also.

DMC wrote:

and he said in 2002, the Friday vote didn't work well... .....and it was wet

Yes, it was an awful day weatherwise. I remember because a friend got married that day so I was especially conscious of it.

DMC

Ahhh... got the UK version of "why Thursday"....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thursday#Thursday_in_the_United_Kingdom

In the United Kingdom, all general elections since 1935 have been held on a Thursday, and this has become a tradition, although not a requirement of the law — which only states that an election may be held on any day "except Saturdays, Sundays, Christmas Eve, Christmas Day, Maundy Thursday, Good Friday, bank holidays in any part of the United Kingdom and any day appointed for public thanksgiving and mourning". An explanation sometimes given for the choice of Thursday as polling day is that it was, in most towns, the traditional market day, although it has also been observed that the choice has practical advantages — with the outcome of the election being known by Friday, the new or continuing administration then has the weekend to organize itself in preparation for the "government shop opening for business" on Monday, the first day of the new week following the election.

Additionally, local elections are usually held on the first Thursday in May.

The reason given for knowing the result on Friday doesn't hold too well here, as with PR, counts do not start until the Friday, and are generally not concluded until Saturday.

John_C

I remember it used to be the case that if you lived in campus accommodation you couldn't register to vote because you didn't legally live there, you lived at home and had a 'license to reside' in the University. Is this still the case?

I ask because there is probably most of a quota living in Belfield and I'm surprised some enterprising politician hasn't gotten them all registered. The green party could well end up with an extra TD if they did.

dajaffa

I have to say I'm sick to the teeth of people going on about how students should register in their constituency and how they could have registered for the postal vote.

People generally register to vote far in advance of elections, and the vast majority will register where they consider home, especially when they're registering and they don't know where they'll be on the day.

As for the postal vote, unless the student in question is actively interested, it wouldn't really come into mind until the date is confirmed when you're really against the clock. Also the lack of advertising the postal vote is shocking. In UCD the Student's Union ran a postal voting registration campaign, but we don't really have resources coming out of our ears, and given the time of year it's hard to get students to man stands as the exams are coming.

I firmly believe that it should be declared far in advance what day of the week the vote will be, and run a decent postal voting campaign. The general election is the most important time to use your vote, and we only get to do it once every 5 years so it should be made easier than it currently is for people to use their vote.

For what it's worth, I really think a Sunday vote is the way to go. Just look at the turnout they got in France, a country where Sunday is much quieter than ourselves. I think a Sunday vote, indicated ar in advance that it would be in a Sunday would maximise voter turnout.

dajaffa

John_C wrote:

I remember it used to be the case that if you lived in campus accommodation you couldn't register to vote because you didn't legally live there, you lived at home and had a 'license to reside' in the University. Is this still the case?

I ask because there is probably most of a quota living in Belfield and I'm surprised some enterprising politician hasn't gotten them all registered. The green party could well end up with an extra TD if they did.

I think that's changed, UCDSU tried to get 1500 Res students to register as that would be enough for an on-campus polling station (though it was messed up as there was a mis-communication and they thought people could register in 2 constituencies)