some 3bet pots.

phantom_lord

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG ($115.05)
MP ($121.85)
Button ($78.88)
Hero ($97.50)
BB ($122.45)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A, 8.
2 folds, Button raises to $4, Hero raises to $12, 1 fold, Button calls $8.

Flop: ($25) 2, J, 4(2 players)
Hero bets $18, Button calls $18.

Turn: ($61) 6(2 players)
Hero bets $49

Final Pot: $110


Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (4 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($101.70)
SB ($74.35)
Hero ($101)
UTG ($137.90)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 2, A.
1 fold, Button raises to $4, 1 fold, Hero raises to $12.5, Button calls $9.

Flop: ($26.50) 7, 9, 8(2 players)
Hero bets $20, Button raises to $50, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $96.50

phantom_lord

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

UTG ($31)
MP ($179.45)
CO ($102.50)
Button ($84.34)
SB ($98)
Hero ($100.20)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q, Q.
UTG raises to $4, 2 folds, Button calls $4, SB calls $3.50, Hero raises to $15.5, UTG calls $12, Button folds, SB calls $12.

Flop: ($52) 7, T, 6(3 players)
SB calls $97.50 (All-In), Hero calls $99.20 (All-In), UTG folds.

Turn: ($248.70) 9(2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($248.70) 9(2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $248.70


Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Button ($271.80)
SB ($93.50)
Hero ($102.10)
UTG ($116.25)
MP ($175.49)
CO ($107.70)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 3, Q.
4 folds, SB raises to $4, Hero raises to $12.5, SB calls $9.

Flop: ($26) J, 3, 6(2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $19, SB calls $93 (All-In), Hero folds.

Final Pot: $138

phantom_lord

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($167.07)
Hero ($246.53)
MP ($100)
Button ($117.35)
SB ($107.02)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with Q, Q.
Hero raises to $4, MP raises to $13, Button calls $13, 2 folds, Hero calls $9.

Flop: ($40.50) 8, 8, J(3 players)
Hero checks, MP checks, Button checks.

Turn: ($40.50) 3(3 players)
Hero bets $28, MP calls $28, Button folds.

River: ($96.50) 6(2 players)
Hero checks, MP calls $100 (All-In), Hero calls $59.

Final Pot: $255.50




Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($157.45)
UTG ($120.80)
MP ($100)
CO ($102.97)
Button ($47.40)
Hero ($113)

Preflop: Hero is SB with T, 8.
1 fold, MP raises to $4, CO calls $4, Button calls $4, Hero raises to $14, 1 fold, MP calls $10, CO calls $10, Button calls $10.

Flop: ($57) A, 3, 8(4 players)
Hero checks, MP checks, CO calls $102.97 (All-In), Button calls $47.40 (All-In), Hero folds, MP folds.

Turn: ($207.37) 4(2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($207.37) K(2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $207.37

phantom_lord

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

CO ($0)
Button ($109.85)
SB ($44.38)
Hero ($219.85)
UTG ($128.95)
MP ($123.20)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K, A.
1 fold, MP raises to $4, Button calls $4, SB calls $3.50, Hero raises to $14.5, MP calls $11, Button calls $11, SB calls $11.

Flop: ($60) 7, 8, 7(5 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, MP bets $35, Button folds, SB folds, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $95



i can only fit 15 images per post.


standardish?

bops

all fine by my aggro standards

[edit] are you a bit tilty, or is this the norm for you??

eoghan104

bops wrote:

all fine by my aggro standards

[edit] are you a bit tilty, or is this the norm for you??

I dont like the raising out of the blinds in the first two examples. Has to be a losing play in the long run.

phantom_lord

eoghan104 wrote:

I dont like the raising out of the blinds in the first two examples. Has to be a losing play in the long run.

i don't think so, not against a button steal.

Mr.Plough

hard to comment properly without any player info

con_leche

H1 & H2

I am not re-raising from the blinds with Arag unless the button is raising every orbit, and only then if my table image dictates the re-raise should take it down pre-flop. If the re-raise is called, you are committed to bluffing a healthy portion of your stack on a weak hand & may be dominated.

H3
Standard to Marginal with QQ

H4
Q3o? Spew. ONCE YOUR RERAISE IS CALLED, ITS ALWAYS BEST TO PUT THE OPPONENT ON A GOOD HAND [in the absence of other info].

H5
Standard to Marginal with QQ

H6
Re-raising 108o in a multi-way? Spew, unless your image is right.

H7
Standard

General:
I think the re-raise with junk move is important, but can only be used sparingly and according to dynamics, as generally you don’t want a caller.

Instead of hands like A3o, A8o, 108o, Q3o, how about 3-betting more with SCs if the opportunity arises?

Are you not better off initiating a moev by raising a blind with Q3o as opposed to fighting back with it?

El Stuntman

this thread is useless without info on villains

pok3rplaya

ffs I know reraising is an image play and blah-de-blah but perhaps use something which even resembles hand selection requirements?

phantom_lord

off the top of my head, most of the villains are fairly standard tags, i haven't got any history with them, and these are the only re-re-raised pots I've played with them so I can't offer much info.

i'll look at their stats and see if I remember anything about them

Standard to Marginal with QQ

what do u mean by this?

pok3rplaya

phantom_lord wrote:

off the top of my head, most of the villains are fairly standard tags, ?

OK well then I guess I like about 1 of them.

Hectorjelly

pok3rplaya wrote:

ffs I know reraising is an image play and blah-de-blah but perhaps use something which even resembles hand selection requirements?

why?

Your bluffing, so it doesnt make much difference what your hand is. The chance of your opponent flopping a hand he wants to go with and you flopping something is so slim that it makes no difference when compared to other situational factors.

Its impossible to know just looking at a single hh if these were good three bets, it depends on what has gone on before.

phantom_lord

1. 40/15/1.2 spewmonkey. um.
2. 18/13/2 who was been hammering my blinds
3. 28/15/2 goot
4. 21/12/1 seemed ok
5. 28/26/1.6 big loser
6. original raiser 18/14/4. my image was pretty good at this point. surprised that everyone called.
7.

con_leche

"Standard to Marginal with QQ"

Calling someones AI bet in a re-raised pot with QQ means sometimes you're ahead [JJ, AK, 47s, Q3o?], sometimes you're behind [AA, KK], but seldom as for ahead as you'd like [QQ, big draw, etc.].

Lacking any stats, or other info, you're happy to get it in, but its close.

Shortstack

Reraising out of the blinds for the sake of it is a long term losing play.

Anything you need to do has to have a reason. The only reason to do it with junk hands like A2, A8 & Q3 is if you are getting your blinds raised by the same person constantly. Once you are called you are gonna be behind & OOP which is not good.

3betting is all well and good but pick your customers and pick your hands. Pairs and sc's are the best hands to do this with.

Shortstack

phantom_lord wrote:

1. 40/15/1.2 spewmonkey. um.
2. 18/13/2 who was been hammering my blinds
3. 28/15/2 goot
4. 21/12/1 seemed ok
5. 28/26/1.6 big loser
6. original raiser 18/14/4. my image was pretty good at this point. surprised that everyone called.
7.

This as all well and good if you were using this info at the time. This post leads me to believe you were not:

phantom_lord wrote:

off the top of my head, most of the villains are fairly standard tags, i haven't got any history with them, and these are the only re-re-raised pots I've played with them so I can't offer much info.

i'll look at their stats and see if I remember anything about them.

pok3rplaya

Hectorjelly wrote:

why?

Your bluffing, so it doesnt make much difference what your hand is. The chance of your opponent flopping a hand he wants to go with and you flopping something is so slim that it makes no difference when compared to other situational factors.

Its impossible to know just looking at a single hh if these were good three bets, it depends on what has gone on before.

I disagree. I think the profitability of the situation is increaced greatly if we have at least the ability to make some sort of hand postflop. Yes I'd rather 3bet a really loose player with T2o then a really tight player with a suited connector but still I think that our 3 bet bluffing frequencies should be low enough that we have the time between 3 bets to wait till we have something resembling a useful hand. If they get way higher then this then it affects our image in ways that are not good when trying to play a reasonably TAG style which I presume P_L is aiming for.

pok3rplaya

What I'm saying is imagine we come accross a reasonably good 3betting situation every 20 hands. And we get dealt a good 3bet bluffing hand every 8 hands. The spots match up like this:

0 20 40 60 80 100
0 8 16 24 32 40 48 56 64

So we should be 3betting on hands 0 and 40 and in my experience with the actual numbers in place that gives us something like a reasonable 3bet bluffing frequency.

phantom_lord

3. is calling that shove ok?
4. didn't expect to be called. c-bet is standard?
5. standard?
6. i thought I could use my image to pick up the pot here. maybe a bit ambitious
7. should i raise more pf? c/f on the flop ok?

Ste05

I like where this thread is going.

I'm kind of in both camps, generally when I 3-bet a habitual button raiser my cards aren't really relevant I'll kind of do it based on frequency more than my cards, so what I'll do is if a player open raises on the Btn every time it's folded to him (be it with me in the SB or BB), I'll usually let the first 2 go and on the third one, I'll 3-bet regardless of my cards (basically but with in reason). (If I'm in the SB I'll also take into consideration the BB).

Then if I have something like a S/C or PP or something where it's not strictly value re-raise I'll add that into the mix as well even if out of sequence and incorporate that into my frequency. (so the 3 time clock starts to run again)

This might sound like alot but it's not really, say if every 2 or 3 orbits it's folded to him, and then every 3rd one of those I 3-Bet, this works out as about 1 3-Bet every 6-9 orbits or so, it's calm enough to keep my tightish image and loose enough to not signal when I 3-Bet for Value.

pok3rplaya

Quick move it to the high content forum... oh wait....

Hectorjelly

I like to be very exact in as to when I 3 bet, if the situations came along a lot then it would make sense to do it only when you have a half decent hand (like JQs), however I think I must be much more discerning than other people as to when I 3 bet. I do it virtually every time I think the situation is right. If I started waiting for good hands to do it with Id never three bet.

I think its also important to note that in a 100bbgame where 3 betting will be aces/kings/queens a large % of the time then it really makes no difference what your hand is. Because when you 3 bet you have so far overrepresented your hand, your opponent will only continue after the flop if he can be beat at least queens, so its very rare that this happens, and when it does the chances of your hand being good enough to continue are almost non-existant, and as such it really doesnt matter what your hand is (pre)

pok3rplaya

a relevant point ^^^

ocallagh

I agree with HJ here. For me, 3-betting requirements are as follows (in order of importance with rough indicators)

History (60)
Position (30)
Hand Selection (10)


What are peoples thoughts on weak/passive limpers in middle to early position before the initial raiser. Does this change things?

pok3rplaya

makes me more likely to reraise. TAGS are increasing their ranges trying to isolate the fish.