Express nails

looksee

Can anyone tell me what Express nails are, why do you have to drill a hole for them, how do they work?

karltimber

they are mainly used for wall plates or attaching timber onto concrete walls.

They look like this.

Just another method of fixing timber and cheaper than rawl plugs or expansion bolts.
A hole is drilled -8mm for an 8mm nail and when it is hammered down it bends inside the hole and fixes the timber etc to the wall.

K

looksee

Right, thanks. I'd never come across them before.

davidoco

Recently used 6 x 60 express nails to nail down ply to concrete floor. Seems to give a wider span of hold on the board than 8 x 80 hammer in fixings. The head spreads out when beaten down and exerts pressure outwards. Also much easier drilling 6mm holes in concrete.

Double check the item your fixing though as you'll never get the fixing out again.

Salmon

Would 6 x 60 nails be ok for battening the ceiling underneath a hollowcore floor?

tradesman

Hello Salmon,
I call these express nails - "compression anchors" they do what it says on the tin. When hammered in they compress - thats what the slot is all about. When you say battening do you mean 2" x 1" battens or 2" x 2" battens. Generally with any fixing of timber it recommends to go into the wall at least the depth of the timber. But i always allow a bit more to be sure.

johnnyrotten

karltimber wrote:

They look like this.

http://www.chite.com/ mmmmm interesting name for a web****e , sorry website

Seriously though they are great for fixing battons, very quick and very secure

Lex Luthor

I still find it difficult how they actually secure inside the concrete wall

do you drill a hole slightly smaller diameter than the nail itself so that when it is forced into the hole, it shrinks a little but fits snugly in its hole?

Sonnenblumen

Express anchors have a slight taper, but it is important to drill the right size hole to suit. As you drive in the anchor the taper creates a very tight but secure fixing.

Same principle as Rawl bolts using the force of expanding metal to create secure fixing. Rawlbolts however are more secure than express anchors. But the latter are quick and ideal for specific situations.

fatchance

Express nails are the dogs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Neil_Sedaka

Since I discovered express nails, I use them for everything (and I mean everything)
Man's greatest invention IMO

papapete

My builder has used express nails to fix old salvaged floor boards to a concrete floor in an old period house! The heads of the nails are showing on the surface of the new floor and I am now worried what is going to happen when we come to sand down the floor. I expect that this will make a bad situation even worse with the nail heads being polished to a bright copper colour in an otherwise wooden floor.

Any ideas on how to remedy this situation or at least improve it before sanding? Many thanks.

Zebbedee

papapete wrote: »

My builder has used express nails to fix old salvaged floor boards to a concrete floor in an old period house!

I wouldn't call him a builder.
Absolute incorrect use of express nails in this application!
Very hard to fix that problem now without putting large holes in your floorboards trying to drill out the express nails.
You might end up having to replace the floor.

tabby aspreme

You could drive them under the surface of the boards and fill the holes with a filler slightly darker than the finished floor , will always be noticeable thought,
a better but more labour intensive method would be to drive the nails well below the surface then use a Forstner bit to drill down about 5 mm and glue a circular piece into the hole , if you could get a plug cutter set it would make the job easier.
Sounds like a serious botch by the builder , was it a new concrete floor.

fred funk }{

Is it possible that it might not be as bad as you think?. It might look okay and the express nails might add a bit of a feature to the floor.

Gen.Zhukov

Is it possible to have a concrete floor in an 'old period house' ?
Is it possible for a builder to be that thick, if such a floor did exist ?

Could be a bit of a wind up.

papapete

Zebbedee wrote: »

I wouldn't call him a builder.
Absolute incorrect use of express nails in this application!
Very hard to fix that problem now without putting large holes in your floorboards trying to drill out the express nails.
You might end up having to replace the floor.

Wow, thanks to everyone who replied with useful suggestions (and a lot of sympathy) to this issue (it's far from a wind up - the house is an old fixer-upper in the Liberties in Dublin so did not have any fancy sub-floors).

Zebbedee/Tabby, thanks for the suggestions. My thoughts exactly, what a mess and what a joker. I'll look at the Forstner bit idea - sounds like it has prospects.

Also, what do you think of taking a rasp bit to them and trying to grind down the collar and some of the shaft but not enough to completely release the grip of the shaft on the wood? Then I could use plastic wood or the Forstner / plug cutter / dowel idea to fill the hole before sanding? Any comments on this as a strategy? Again, thanks for all of the tips.

PS. Fred, shiny copper disks all over the wooden floors might add a bit of character to the house but I think I'll try one of the above approaches first. Thanks all the same.

Gen.Zhukov

The builder has made a balls of it. To get it right the boards should come up and the holes filled with the same wood dowels. Battens fixed to concrete and boards fixed to battens. The express nails are made of a spring steel and are very hard to work.

Builder should be doing this at his expense.

papapete

Gen.Zhukov wrote: »

The builder has made a balls of it. To get it right the boards should come up and the holes filled with the same wood dowels. Battens fixed to concrete and boards fixed to battens. The express nails are made of a spring steel and are very hard to work.

Builder should be doing this at his expense.

Thanks General. I'm meeting the builder tomorrow and will face him down - strengthened by all of the commentary and armed with the suggestions offered. Thanks again to all.

PS. I'm a rookie at this Boards.ie thing so may be posting in the wrong forum but so far, so good, it's working!

the_pen_turner

can we have a picture. I would like a good laugh

my3cents

RE: Fast nails and the salvaged floorboards.

Any chance of a close up pic of how bad they look?

Tigger

papapete wrote: »

My builder has used express nails to fix old salvaged floor boards to a concrete floor in an old period house! The heads of the nails are showing on the surface of the new floor and I am now worried what is going to happen when we come to sand down the floor. I expect that this will make a bad situation even worse with the nail heads being polished to a bright copper colour in an otherwise wooden floor.

Any ideas on how to remedy this situation or at least improve it before sanding? Many thanks.

Are you sure they are express nails
They are hollow

my3cents

Tigger wrote: »

Are you sure they are express nails
They are hollow

I wondered about that and if its traditional cut nails that have been used?



A lot of people wouldn't be familiar with cut nails but they would be the correct nail for old floorboards.

Tigger

my3cents wrote: »

I wondered about that and if its traditional cut nails that have been used?



A lot of people wouldn't be familiar with cut nails but they would be the correct nail for old floorboards.

Yeah old style floor brads and timber underneath was what I suspected

papapete

Yes, Tigger they are hollow, copper coloured with a collar at one end and tapered to the other end. The builder has now said that this is his method of choice for fixing flooring where it is not possible to use glue or battens (as here), that the work is not finished yet and that he will show me other work he has done where the nails have been fully recessed and plugged with dowels and then sanded out of sight. We'll see.

Gen.Zhukov

If he does that, then yeah, it will look fine. Giving himself a whole pile of work though.