Hand from Irish Open which has me baffled

NickyOD

This hand has been annoying me. I didn't see all the RTE coverage so I don't know if it was shown but I know it happened on the feature table towards the end of Day 3 so it was a very important hand.

Martin Smyth raised from early position to 75,000. I'm not sure what the blinds were. Paul Dooley who was a very aggressive player reraised (I think from the button because Smyth was first to act on the flop) to 220,000 and Martin Smyth cold called this raise leaving 300K behind.

Then Smyth went all in on a A-6-3 flop.

Now what hand can Smyth have here? My first reaction when someone makes this bet, especially someone like Martin who is obviously very talented is that he can't have an ace. Why push the Ace when he is probably miles ahead, and what is he calling off such a huge % of his stack with preflop with. i can't figure it out at all. Dooley folded, what was almost certainly a big pair after a long dwell up.

Was this hand shown or does anyone have the real info on it? The more I think about it the more I think Smyth must have had AQ and played it oddly, or perhaps AK and played it that way because he knew he would be called preflop anyway and decided he would call and push any flop, but like I said, why push when he flops the Ace?

Mellor

NickyOD wrote:

why push on the Ace?

Because it looks like he hasn't got one, thats why.
I'll have a look theough the recordings later and see if I pick it up

Tar.Aldarion

My first reaction when someone makes this bet, especially someone like Martin who is obviously very talented is that he can't have an ace. Why push the Ace when he is probably miles ahead

To make it look like he doesn'thave an ace?

Ste05

It does look like he didn't have an Ace alright, I presume he was hoping to fold out a higher pair than his. Maybe he was trying some sort of stop and go or else some sort of double bluff, like he wouldn't push with an Ace therefore pushing might make KK or QQ call. Very strange.

phantom_lord

Tar.Aldarion wrote:

To make it look like he doesn'thave an ace?

that's some serious leveling right there.

Now what hand can Smyth have here? My first reaction when someone makes this bet, especially someone like Martin who is obviously very talented is that he can't have an ace. Why push the Ace when he is probably miles ahead, and what is he calling off such a huge % of his stack with preflop with. i can't figure it out at all. Dooley folded, what was almost certainly a big pair after a long dwell up.

Was this hand shown or does anyone have the real info on it? The more I think about it the more I think Smyth must have had AQ and played it oddly, or perhaps AK and played it that way because he knew he would be called preflop anyway and decided he would call and push any flop, but like I said, why push when he flops the Ace?

if he has ak would he not just push pf. or check/call all in with on the flop?

seems a bit bizarre, surely he's not deep enough to expect to do a stop'n go successfully?

Solksjaer

I think the answer here is obvious . .......If the pot is 440K and Martin had 300K behind, Why the hell not push here even if he did have a High A. The pot is HUGE. Take it down and move on. I'd be delighted to take that pot down. The check may not entice a raise and thefore give a free card. It's too big a pot to fk around with.

Tar.Aldarion

'leveling'?

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

phantom_lord

calling for 40% is strange enough anyway. but does this not look like a really obvious stop 'n' go to the other guy?

i guess if he thinks he's been 3bet light, a 4bet has little f/e cause of the his stack, so calling/shoving any flop or folding are his only options?

i dunno, I don't play enough tournaments.

NickyOD

UnLuckyLloyd wrote:

When a player of his quality calls for 40%+ of his stack pre - flop, I think he is pushing any flop tbh - irrespective of his cards. It is a play with huge FE. I don't think his cards are really that relevant in that the decision to push was prolly made as he cold called the re - raise.

I agree you would expect him to be pushing any flop after the preflop call. It was made look like a very obvious Stop n' Go but I still think the action is very odd.

What does Martin put Dooley on. If he puts him on AJ/AQ and wants to avoid racing with a hand like 88/99 then fine but if that's your read would you still push when the flop is Ace high?

OR, lets say he has AK/AQ puts Dooley on 99-QQ and since he knows he will be called if he jams preflop just decides to do it on the flop to create some fold equity but again when the Ace flop surely this is a bad push if his read is that Dooley has 99-QQ. i think this is the most like scenario and Smyth was just happy to take down the pot on the flop but if so I think the push is bad unless he thinks Dooley is bad enough to call him but I tihnk that was very optomistic.

Mellor

This hand wasn't shown on the coverage, when dooley sat down on the Marty Smyth and dooley weren't even shown on the feature table at the same
only Dooleys exit for 10th
where did marty smyth finish?

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

NickyOD

UnLuckyLloyd wrote:

Nicky - how many players were at the table at this point? Was it short - handed or full ring?

I think this was 8 handed with 2 tables remaining.

NickyOD

Mellor wrote:

This hand wasn't shown on the coverage, when dooley sat down on the Marty Smyth and dooley weren't even shown on the feature table at the same
only Dooleys exit for 10th
where did marty smyth finish?

Smyth won the tournament. Dooley was actually 8th.

ozpoker

Isn't the point of making a stop and go play to give your opponent an opportunity to make a mistake? That's why you push any flop, including the one's you hit, to balance the play.

-Oz-

nicnicnic

he had pocket fives

NickyOD

nicnicnic wrote:

he had pocket fives

wow! lol! He was lucky with the flop then because Dooley must have had a bigger pair. Sick.

nicnicnic

think it was the final table eight handed. Found it a bit surprising the call pre, Marty said he put Dooley on queens or jacks when Dooley raised pre. Definitely a high risk move say Terry McDaid make a very similar play against DE Wolfe for a 600k pot three tables out but ran his 88 into AK on a K 4 3 flop, guess its a northern thing

BigCityBanker

Did Marty reckon that Dooley wouldnt have the bottle to call on a flop which contained overcards? Ok you can think he has lined you up for a stop and go you see him do it BUT for an amatuer player do you want to be the lad to crash and burn in the last stages of a major tournament by calling off your stack with a pocket pair when the board contains an Ace?? This could probably be debated at length from many angles.

Very few players at this stage of a tourny would make the call in Dooleys position.

Look at Halfbaked's call with 88 against Elvis - one of the calls of the tournament and it didnt get much acclaim on the TV. Peter is one of the guys id back to make the call that Dooley didnt - but there aint many who would do it.

LuckyLloyd

This post has been deleted.

NickyOD

Yeah, my immediate reaction when watching the hand (I was right beside the table at the time) was that Smyth must have a middle pair. I guessed 88/99 but I would certainly have called with JJ/QQ in Dooley's position. I just can't believe Smyth called hoping to get Dooley off his hand. An Ace high flop is the only one he does that and there is no way he gets that flop and get's Dooley off the pot, or hit a 5 often enough for the preflop call to be profitable. It was just such a crazy hand that the more I thought about the more I thought Smyth must have had something else, but no matter what 2 card Smyth held in his hand I think he played this one very badly and was lucky to escape from it.