CWC - Day 38 Thread - West Indies V Bangladesh

KevIRL

Not a huge game by any means. Would be nice if the Windies thumped Bangladesh and Ireland moved back into 7th as a result.

Thoughts?

Updates here later.

mikeruurds

I'd rather see the Tigers humiliate the Windies.

No offense my Irish friends.

county

windies to win other wise there could be riots in the carribean

sportaholic

Windies get their fingers out and win this one.

LuckyLloyd

Why oh why have the Windies been so inept so far in this competition? They are surely due a good performance (including some half decent fielding) eventually...

Rjd2

An interesting article on Lara's captaincy from cricinfio
Flawed legacy of Lara's mortal genius

Sambit Bal

April 19, 2007

Brian Lara has been a peerless batsman © Getty Images

Saturday could be the last time we watch Brian Lara in an international match. Anyone who has a feel for cricket will mourn his loss, for no batsman in the last 15 years has brought more joy to spectators. But paradoxically, West Indian cricket is unlikely to miss him.

Lara's legacy will be deeply flawed as he has been the most mortal of geniuses. Any human, however talented, must be granted his indiscretions, and Lara has always been a complex character. His batting, a hostage to his moods, has touched extraordinary highs and inexplicable lows. But that's the essence of Lara and the peaks have been so rewarding that it's been easy to overlook the troughs.

To judge Lara's contribution to West Indian cricket, it is essential to separate his batting from his leadership. Lara the batsman is peerless, light years ahead of his compatriots who have struggled to match the deeds of their predecessors. Lara the leader has been diametrically opposite. Aloof and whimsical are the mild words used to describe him. The stronger ones are selfish, vindictive and unbecoming.

It is hardly a secret that Lara was foisted as captain by Ken Gordon, the president of the West Indies Cricket Board and a fellow Trinidadian, after the infamous row between the board and the players over sponsorship in 2005. A majority of the then selection committee didn't want him and none of the members of the present one want him either. But Gordon, in a move that will be familiar to most cricket fans in the subcontinent, imposed his will on them, and might want do so again. However, his hold on the board has been weakened following the World Cup debacle, and if the selectors have their way, Lara will not make the West Indian touring party for the trip to England in May. Not as captain, not even as player.

While it would be unfair to blame one person, however powerful, for the abjectness of an entire team, those in the know firmly believe that the rot begins right at the top. Lara, they say, has never allowed the team to settle down, and worse, done his best to undermine any player who has crossed his path.

Of course, barring occasional outbursts against the selectors, he has been a model of rectitude and decorum in public, always choosing the right words, and hitting the right notes. In his press conference before the game against Bangladesh at Kensington Oval on Thursday, he repeated his apology to cricket fans and talked about the disappointment of the Caribbean nations. "The need to show character" was a phrase that came up repeatedly.



Two faced: as a leader Lara has been selfish and vindictive © Getty Images



Yet, Lara, who will retire from one-day internationals after the tournament, stands accused of destroying the character of the team more than anyone else. On the field, he has been eccentric and unpredictable and some of his tactics have bordered on the bizarre. Some of his improvisations, like opening the bowling with Wavell Hinds and Dwayne Smith, have borne fruit, and he has been persuasive in arguing that he has used innovation as a surprise weapon due to the lack of too many real ones at his disposal. "I wouldn't have needed to experiment if I was leading Australia," he said during last year's Champions Trophy.

But some of the selections defied logic and cricket sense. For much of last year, Ian Bradshaw and Jerome Taylor were the team's best one-day bowlers. Bradshaw was outstanding with the new ball, often bowled his overs through and conceded about 40 runs. Taylor was beginning to master operating at the death, delivering at pace and firing in yorkers. Both have found themselves dropped repeatedly and Bradshaw has been used at first change and sometimes even at the death where he has been easy meat at his pace.

Lara picked the rookie Lendl Simmons as a batsman in the World Cup and put him at No. 8, and in the crucial, near knock-out match against New Zealand, he chose to hand a one-day debut to the 19-year-old Keiron Pollard while dropping Marlon Samuels, in whom he had expressed faith only a few weeks earlier.

Off the field, he has set a poor example to his team-mates when it comes to behaviour and personal work ethic. Genius must receive an allowance, and tales of Garry Sobers turning up at a match after a night of revelry abound in these parts. But Sobers played in a different era and he was captain for only a short part of his career. Lara has led a bunch of impressionable and far less talented individuals much prone to the risk of being led astray.

And he has been severe on the players who he has come to dislike. Ramnaresh Sarwan, a captaincy candidate who has a far better record in both forms of the game than most current players, had the mortification of being dropped on the tour of Pakistan and others have had their batting positions shuffled. Some are believed to be dead against him, while many others live in fear. It is not only a team lacking faith in its own ability, but lacking faith in their leader.

The cricket world will be poorer for Lara's departure, but for West Indian cricket it could be the way forward. It's a tragedy. Lara ought to be remembered as one of the most special batsmen in the history of the game and not a captain whose whims and sullenness destabilised an already feeble team

Mothman

Well I thought that Ireland's best chance on 7th was for Bangladesh and England to beat the Windies heavily.

Windies now 8/2...

cgf

Raced onto 27-2 off 15. zzzzzz - it's like looking at a bad Ireland or England.

pwd

163-4 after over 42.
mediocre score means ireland almost certainly bottom

Marshy

Somebody get the calculator out! What have the banglas got to be bowled out for to enable us to claim 7th spot?

Currently they are 31-3 off 14 replying to 230-5 made by WI

DMC

Going back to Lara as a leader of men, I lost all respect for him when he selfishly got 400* in that test against the English last tour. The way that was played out, he didnt care for the match or series situation, just "his" world record that Matthew Hayden stole from him 6 months earlier.

When he got to 200, I remember the commentators at the time mentioned how boring the game was getting. Utterly predictable and false. It wasn't about winning or losing a test match, it was all about Lara getting in and chasing 380

ninebeanrows

Bangladesh are really struggling

48 for 5 off 20 overs, that's pretty Ireland'esk

They would be lucky to make 120

giddyup

Marshy wrote:

Somebody get the calculator out! What have the banglas got to be bowled out for to enable us to claim 7th spot?

Currently they are 31-3 off 14 replying to 230-5 made by WI

An e-mailer on BBC Live text is saying between 60 and 70 so we already 8th if that is correct.

(edit)Actually thats a load of Horlicks because the overs faced will have a bearing also.

DMC

pfft

DMC

Na, thats balderdash...

Bangladesh nailed on for 7th place, as of now, their NRR is -1.42

Bangladesh 112/8 after 37 overs

Marshy

Ok all this NRR kinda confuses me. Just a query, would I be right in saying Irelands NRR was -6.5ish yesterday. But I mustnt be right because they finished the event on -1.73 AFAIK and They definitely werent plus anything going into yesterday. Could Anyone clarify please?

As I speak tony cozier says its likely We'll get 7th, hope hes right!

Diamondmaker

Yeah looks like Ire finish 7th??TBC??, nice ay day for the boys and Irish Cricket.

Plus 10k for the Paki' game and 5k for the other and the draw???

Savage Ire well done, its been great entertainment:)

SOunds like 8th now :-(

Still great!

pwd

OVER 44: Gayle: 0-0-W
131- WICKET! - Finally the game is over, Gayle bowling Rasel to complete a 99-run win for the Windies. The hosts now go on to face England on Saturday while Bangladesh finish bottom of the Super Eight table.

from sky sports live scores thing

DMC

I think its 8th... I've yet to see an updated table...

DMC

Super Eights  	Mat  	Won  	Lost  	Tied  	N/R  	Pts  	Net RR  	
Australia 	6 	6 	0 	0 	0 	12 	+2.028 	
Sri Lanka 	7 	5 	2 	0 	0 	10 	+1.483 	
New Zealand 	6 	5 	1 	0 	0 	10 	+1.068 	
South Africa 	7 	4 	3 	0 	0 	8 	+0.313 	
England 	6 	2 	4 	0 	0 	4 	-0.440 	
West Indies 	6 	2 	4 	0 	0 	4 	-0.657 	
Bangladesh 	7 	1 	6 	0 	0 	2 	-1.514 	
[B]Ireland 	[/B]7 	1 	6 	0 	0 	2 	-1.730

LuckyLloyd

DMC wrote:

Going back to Lara as a leader of men, I lost all respect for him when he selfishly got 400* in that test against the English last tour. The way that was played out, he didnt care for the match or series situation, just "his" world record that Matthew Hayden stole from him 6 months earlier.

When he got to 200, I remember the commentators at the time mentioned how boring the game was getting. Utterly predictable and false. It wasn't about winning or losing a test match, it was all about Lara getting in and chasing 380

Did the West Indies not win that Test match??

DMC

England won the previous 3 tests in the 4 test series, this was a draw.

http://uk.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/2003-04/ENG_IN_WI/SCORECARDS/ENG_WI_T4_10-14APR2004.html

It was halfway through the afternoon session on Day 3 that Lara reached 400 and declared, giving England just over 2 days to bat out the game. England did follow on, but this was the proverbial batsman's paradise. A concrete slab.

As much as the 375 innings is oft repeated, the 400* is seldom seen in a highlights reel.

Royale with Cheese

To be honest I thought it was fair enough. It's not like the Windies were definitely going to win had he declared earlier. Like DMC said it was a batsmans paradise. People are going to remember the first 400+ score in a test match alot more than they would the West Indies winning a test match at the end of a losing series. It's not like he denied them the chance of winning a game of any significance. England managed to get 422/5 in the final innings, so a draw was always the likely outcome on that pitch.

DMC

Aye, Royale, they'd have been struggling for 40 wickets in a timeless test.