KK hand both deep stacked

Macspower

villan is a good sophistacted player capable of top class plays and is an aggressive winner. stats 30/17/1885.

I wasn't happy about how i played this one.
my own analaysis of the hand is that I should have RR preflop but decided against on this occassion as he generally fold to any 3 bet and i wanted him in.
I took the lead on the flop hoping he would come over and he did. (perfect says I) I lead the turn as you can see.....

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Gubbe9 is at seat 0 with $203.20.
TonySE is at seat 2 with $266.95.
Villan is at seat 3 with $658.05.
riverrobbert is at seat 4 with $207.80.
Macspower is at seat 5 with $587.05.

The dealer is seat 4.

Macspower posts a blind of $1.
Gubbe9 posts a blind of $2.

(Macspower is dealt Kh Kd.)

Pre-flop:
TonySE folds.
Villan raises $5.
riverrobbert folds.
Macspower calls for $6.
Gubbe9 folds.

The flop comes
3s Jc 4c.

Macspower bets $13.
Villan raises $19.
Macspower raises $56.
Villan calls for $56.

The turn comes Qs.

Macspower bets $120.
Villan goes all-in for $563.05.

Macspower??????

Whats my move?

Mr.Plough

dont think i could fold here

kebabfest

a tough one alright.
U have shown strength all along and he is going nowhere.
This reraise is unlikely to be a bluff, so you gotta think what you're beating.
The Q didnt scare him at all.
I reckon you're up against Trips a lot of the time here. Could even be a jammy JQ.
I only say this as you stated he was a sophistated decent player.
Against a donk I call without hesitation. Against this son of satan I am laying it down while punching the screen.
You're right in the fact you should have reraised pre-flop, but you gotta vary your play sometime so I wouldnt be too critical of that.
I hope you called and somehow managed to hit a flukey K on the river !!

pok3rplaya

please RR pf for millions of reasons.

pok3rplaya

You are beat 100% btw

valor

what the hell are you doing preflop, that is really gross

Captain Tom

all you beat is a bluff and i dont think many players bluff here nearly 300bb deep.he has AK/J/Tc here a really small % of the time.

Macspower

agreed pre flop is horrible..... i RR here about 98% of the time but on this occassion it's what i did.... as i said I had 3 bet him several times already and he folded each time so I wanted action..... is this so bad...yeah i suppose it is.... Anyway played as is prefop what about my flop lead turn lead? Is the whole thing just horrible?

anyway I folded as I know I'm beaten here against this player. If it was any of the other players with smaller stacks I'm in there...

Thanks Guys,

Mac

phantom_lord

agreed pre flop is horrible..... i RR here about 98% of the time but on this occassion it's what i did.... as i said I had 3 bet him several times already and he folded each time so I wanted action

then he's more liekly to play back! fold now anyway.

Goodluck2me

Does he ever bet draws this aggressively?
OT: I have found a lot of these threads where people have AA or KK we are all fidning reasons to fold, does noone think we let go of these hands too much? surely it must be easy to bluff a good TAG off overpairs like this. does noone ever get it all in with an overpair even if the pots arent RR. (when 100BB deep). Does anyone like a Shove on the flop?

im not saying that any thing i am saying is correct per sae either im just generating discussion. i often see people say when we pick up massive turn draws to shove (like OESFD etc, and therefore surely people are doing this against us, we are folding strong hands like OPs and 2Ps and strong hands because their lines are so aggressive, but if they are simply playing their big draws aggressively we should call. Also to note i think people should be able to give read like this when initally postign the hands.

phantom_lord

goodluck2me wrote:

Does anyone like a Shove on the flop?

we're 300bbs deep! a shove would be pure spew.

im not saying that any thing i am saying is correct per sae either im just generating discussion. i often see people say when we pick up massive turn draws to shove (like OESFD etc, and therefore surely people are doing this against us, we are folding strong hands like OPs and 2Ps and strong hands because their lines are so aggressive, but if they are simply playing their big draws aggressively we should call. Also to note i think people should be able to give read like this when initally postign the hands.

he hasn't played it like he has a strong draw.

Macspower

the amount of times he is on a draw here would be so small that it would never be profitable IMO. I've played with this guy many times (nearly 2000 hands) and he generally seems to avoid me and I him. He folds to my 3 bets and I to his..... I'm beaten here as far as I can see...... If i wasn't so deep I'd have got all in on the flop for a buy in or so.... I know it's not the way to look at it but it would be a shame to ruin 3 hours work to see if he was bluffing....

Goodluck2me

phantom_lord wrote:

we're 300bbs deep! a shove would be pure spew.

lol i should have entered a smiley

he hasn't played it like he has a strong draw.

How would he play a strong draw.

Also re: context above i dont mean this hand necessarily, but more in general terms.

Goodluck2me

Macspower wrote:

I know it's not the way to look at it but it would be a shame to ruin 3 hours work to see if he was bluffing....

yeah exactly your either ahead or not. you could say - no better way to reward 3 hours of goos work that a deep double up from a good call

cardshark202

This isn't the spot to flat-call preflop with KK. And its certainly not the spot to lead the turn after the flop action unless you are planning to get it all in. I fold now but if for some mad reason I had cold called preflop I would prob c/c flop and turn.