PillowBiter said I should do it ....

fuzzbox

2/4 6-max

Button is like 32/25
SB is like 28/22

Stacks 400

Preflop
Button opens to 14, SB makes it 52, I make it 160 pretty quick with Qh4h.

Thoughts?

cardshark202

How have you been playing? Seems good though

phantom_lord

i like it.

although, do u need to raise so much? 120-130 should have the same effect, no?

Ste05

Yeah I like it, I do this kind of thing maybe once an hour or so, maybe slightly less depending on the Villains, but these 2 seem perfect.

cardshark202

Really does depend on your image though, and their tendancies

Gholimoli

as cardshark said you cant look at the play in isolation.
your line looks very strong and realisticly button and sb should drop anythng but KK/AA here but there are alot of ppl out there who will call with TT+,AK there.
also how you have been playing is very important as well cuz from a tight player this is more than likely KK/AA but from a lag this can be a wider range.

whats the plan if you get called post flop?
is a call from either of them kk/AA or a wider range?

some times you get called pre-flop but can take this down post flop with even a half pot bet and ofcourse some times the guy holding AA/KK will just flat call you so i think its best to know most of this before you try the move.

padraig_f

For me, I much prefer to bluff-raise a raiser than a reraiser, their range is so much wider. While there are plenty of $2/$4 players who are fairly aggressive for a single raise, I haven't found 3-betting light to be that common, so I tend to think the SB's ranges is pretty tight. I pretty much never make this move.

NickyOD

lol! So when SB goes all in you were forced to call and cracked his AK?

I like what padraig said.

califano

What do you mean "PillowBiter said I should do it"?.

phantom_lord

rounders123 wrote:

What do you mean "PillowBiter said I should do it"?.

i wouldn't be too quick to follow a pillowbiter's advice tbh.

RoundTower

I don't really like it, because I wouldn't be folding to a push so you are risking 400 to win 66 or something which doesn't really seem worth it.

califano

phantom_lord wrote:

i wouldn't be too quick to follow a pillowbiter's advice tbh.

neither woild i but im wondering if those two are in cahoots. id be surprised if they were.

fuzzbox

RoundTower wrote:

I don't really like it, because I wouldn't be folding to a push so you are risking 400 to win 66 or something which doesn't really seem worth it.

Why would you not fold to a push?
You are not getting odds Vs his shoving range (having to call 240 to win 570, so its 2:1, and when he 5-bet shoves, his range narrows ... oh considerably).

RoundTower

well you're about 27% against AK, AA, KK and you need about 29% to break even. So folding might be correct because he sometimes has QQ or AQ, but I would hate to fold this spot in case he ever has 67s or something.

pok3rplaya

I much rather do this with Axs because it cuts down on the chances of there being an AA out there.

fuzzbox

RoundTower wrote:

well you're about 27% against AK, AA, KK and you need about 29% to break even. So folding might be correct because he sometimes has QQ or AQ, but I would hate to fold this spot in case he ever has 67s or something.

Most of the time he has AA/KK, some of the time he is v.audacious with AK, and some of the time he has QQ.

In the actual hand, he did shove, and I tried to quickly count it up, and figured that I was murdered Vs his 5-bet range, so I passed.

Hectorjelly

I like the move is the sb is good enough to reraise with a bigish range

BigCityBanker

IanMc posted something lately about re-raising with any two from the BB when the button open raises and the SB calls. This is obviously different but the logic behind it is quite clear.

MrPillowTalk

I like it I do this a good bit if the sb is the right kind of player.

I probably raise less, a smaller raise doesnt actually look weaker. Against most players a push over our raise will be AA/KK or sometimes QQ AK in my experience you will basically never see another hand pushing here.

Its pretty easy to get away from the push imo as you have narrowed his range so much and if you have picked the right customer hes going to fold out so many hands its a profitable play.

Daithio

This is a move I never really would have considered making but I like it. Just one question, what's the plan for the hand if either player flat calls and you miss the flop entirely? Push any flop? Assuming if it's the SB that flat called he has checked the flop to you. But I suppose if they're good enough to make this play against they'd be good enough not to flat call that raise with any holding.

BigCityBanker

Daithio wrote:

This is a move I never really would have considered making but I like it. Just one question, what's the plan for the hand if either player flat calls and you miss the flop entirely? Push any flop? Assuming if it's the SB that flat called he has checked the flop to you. But I suppose if they're good enough to make this play against they'd be good enough not to flat call that raise with any holding.

I dunno about this? Is this not a good spot to flat call with AA? Is you push pre with AA almost every hand is folding, if you flat call and give your opponent the opportunity to bluff it is surely the best line?

Or is it a case of allowing your opponent to get away from it by seeing the flop whereas he may have committed his stack preflop had we provided him with the opportunity?

Thoughts?

fuzzbox

Daithio wrote:

This is a move I never really would have considered making but I like it. Just one question, what's the plan for the hand if either player flat calls and you miss the flop entirely? Push any flop? Assuming if it's the SB that flat called he has checked the flop to you. But I suppose if they're good enough to make this play against they'd be good enough not to flat call that raise with any holding.

If I get called, then he normally believes that he has the best hand. So I dont put another dime into the pot unless I hit a big flop (Q4x, 44x, QQx, a flush).