lonely college life?

misefreisin

http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055076747

interesting thread here on the ucd forum about a letter somebody wrote to the indo about ucd being a very lonely place. i have loads of friends i left school with 3 years ago who headed to ucd, and most of them agree that it is a very lonely place indeed, especially in the bigger faculties such as arts. anyone i know who went to trinity has completely made their own friends and having the time of their lives. why is it that ucd seems to be this way? is it the sheer size of the place or what? or does anybody think that trinity isn't much different?

aahhh, revision-procrastination...

Tricity Bendix

My friends have had the same experience. The first problem is the size of the classes. I know some lectures in Trinity can be pretty massive, but UCD Arts is in a league of its own. The second problem is the size of the place. The more students they accept, the more likely it is that you'll be going to UCD with a bunch of people you know. This leads to cliquiness and exclusion for those who do not migrate to UCD in a herd.

shay_562

Trinity can definitely be the same. While I was the only person from my year to go to TCD (from a really tiny, close-knit school with 20 in the entire LC year, so I can relate to the "huge scary new place with thousands of absolute strangers" thing), I did know one girl who did 4th year with us before leaving for the Institute who did SocSocPol, and who dropped out before 1st year was over in large part due to problems similar (though not quite as extreme) as the ones the girl mentions in her letter. Equally, everyone I know who went to UCDD has gotten along great; some of them stuck with the people they already knew, others either couldn't (because they were in different departments) or just chose not to, and instead made loads of friends inside their new courses. My best friend from secondary school is doing Psychology, which in first year is borderline Orts (in terms of class sizes and contact hours), and despite being relatively shy (by her own admission) has made some incredibly close friends in her two years so far.

What I guess I'm trying to say is that I have to agree with Sangre and all the others in that thread who said that the girl in question, and other people like her, need to make college be what they want it to be. If you want to be a social butterfly who can't make it from the Orts block to the student centre without running into at least five of your friends, then join half a dozen societies, go along to a few meetings of each and see which ones stick*. Repeat as necessary (including trying new things, or societies you may not have considered joining before, or a sports club that doesn't seem too physically taxing) until you have a circle of friends. Quite honestly, while most of my close friends in college are in my course, I mostly got to know them through outside activities like the Hist or Frisbee (or indeed Paintball, hils), or through people I met in outside things. I'd have some sympathy for people in places like Dun Laoghaire where, as I understand it, there's no student life at all; in UCDD, where there's a thriving student life if you look for it (I count in excess of 100 clubs and societies listed on their website, before you even get into the SU-type stuff), if you can't find a single thing that interests you, or a single group of people that you can get on with, then really, your problem is likely to be more about you than about the college or the other people in it.

* To briefly address the inevitable "societies are cliquey" thing, yes, they are. That's because all groups of friends are cliquey to some extent. If you didn't have a closer bond with the people you already know in the society than you do with the people you just met, it'd be weird. While some are far too insider-y and not open to new people at all, the vast majority of ones I've joined in TCD have been perfectly welcoming to new people who make an effort to get involved. As was said in the thread misefreisin linked to, societies need new freshers every year, and therefore tend to be relatively welcoming in most cases.

gilroyb

I know a number of people in Trinity who had similar experiences as those mentioned in UCD. Seems to be a question of the size of the course. BESS is in danger of having students fall between the cracks. In general though Trinity seems to have smaller class sizes, and so more interaction between everyone.

College is what you make it, but small, regular groups help. I know I initially made a number of friends though a language option, even if you then drift away from these people, at least it integrates you into the course at first.

Pet

or does anybody think that trinity isn't much different?

Science in Trinity is quite similar, in my experience. Class sizes are pretty similar I'd imagine, and the Hamilton/Goldsmith doesn't have that same "hangout-ability" as the Arts building (in TCD) seems to. I honestly don't know where most people in my class go to between lectures.

I have mixed feelings about that article. On one hand, I agree with the "large classes suck" - I don't know most of my science class (although that's due in part to my terrible attendance last year). The saving grace is the lab classes (I really never thought I'd ever utter that sentence..) however, because you get to meet people 1-to-1.

On the other hand, I've still made tonnes of friends here, because I got involved in stuff, and didn't just **** off home every day right after my last class like some people seem to. Also, I guess living in Halls introduced me to loads of people from outside my course that I never would have met otherwise.

Tricity Bendix

shay_562 wrote:

My best friend from secondary school is doing Psychology, which in first year is borderline Orts (in terms of class sizes and contact hours), and despite being relatively shy (by her own admission) has made some incredibly close friends in her two years so far.

I think the course may have a lot of bearing on how successful people are socially. I, too, know happy Psychology people, and I hear the Ag Science people are a great laugh. The Commerce folk seem to band together as well. But everyone I know doing Arts in UCD has the same story: people who went to the same school will stick together, which generally depresses the atmosphere for the rest of the course.

I'd have some sympathy for people in places like Dun Laoghaire where, as I understand it, there's no student life at all

Everyone I know in Dun L is having a whale of a time.

misefreisin

Pet wrote:

Science in Trinity is quite similar, in my experience. Class sizes are pretty similar I'd imagine, and the Hamilton/Goldsmith doesn't have that same "hangout-ability" as the Arts building (in TCD) seems to. I honestly don't know where most people in my class go to between lectures.

I thought that about science in first year, but i have to say, i quite like the hamilton for "hangout ability", i'm always running into people in java, library, comp rooms, wherever. I think it was pretty easy to make friends in my year once i got it out of my head that i was the only one who didn't know the whole year in first year. It did feel that way back then, as the course was so big, but i'd say i know about 75% of people now.

ApeXaviour

Pet wrote:

Science in Trinity is quite similar, in my experience. Class sizes are pretty similar I'd imagine, and the Hamilton/Goldsmith doesn't have that same "hangout-ability" as the Arts building (in TCD) seems to. I honestly don't know where most people in my class go to between lectures.

I'm sorry pet I'm going to have to utterly disagree with you and expand on misefreisin's post. Firstly how you can lump the hamilton and goldsmith together I don't know. That's like lumping the GMB and the sports hall together.
The total class size is big, but the individual subject classes are not and they gradually more diverse and weaned. The hamilton is a great place. From January coming back from my project, I (and another lad who deferred final year) basically knew nobody bar the odd person who repeated a year in my class (~30-40). These people had been in the same class all throughout their 4 years, so me and this other bloke were outsiders. I can safely walk up to anybody in my class now and just start a chat, go for coffee with them etc. So can he. There seems to be a whole lot less cliqueness down this end of the college.
Pretty much all of my friends here are somewhat related to the course I do, which is bad in one way I suppose (I didn't join much). But it certainly tells a different story of the science end than you claim.

Outside the shop, the library, the vending machines, physics garden, (pav/cricket pitch of course) and even infront of your usual departmental buildings, all great hangout spots / meeting points.

Edwardius

aye, but that's in third/fourth year when all the pricks have been failed out so a lot of the remaining physicsy folk tend to be approachable to the point that you get the impression that they won't lift your wallet, beat you to death with a tin of sardines and go doo-doo on the carcass. There may be some exceptions though but I haven't been murdered yet to the best of me knowledge. However, I could be wrong. Right, that's enough.

Pet

ApeXaviour wrote:

I'm sorry pet I'm going to have to utterly disagree with you and expand on misefreisin's post. Firstly how you can lump the hamilton and goldsmith together I don't know. That's like lumping the GMB and the sports hall together.
The total class size is big, but the individual subject classes are not and they gradually more diverse and weaned. The hamilton is a great place. From January coming back from my project, I (and another lad who deferred final year) basically knew nobody bar the odd person who repeated a year in my class (~30-40). These people had been in the same class all throughout their 4 years, so me and this other bloke were outsiders. I can safely walk up to anybody in my class now and just start a chat, go for coffee with them etc. So can he. There seems to be a whole lot less cliqueness down this end of the college.
Pretty much all of my friends here are somewhat related to the course I do, which is bad in one way I suppose (I didn't join much). But it certainly tells a different story of the science end than you claim.

Outside the shop, the library, the vending machines, physics garden, (pav/cricket pitch of course) and even infront of your usual departmental buildings, all great hangout spots / meeting points.

You do physics. Come back to me when you've done Biology, the biggest class size of all.

Also, you're a final year student, of course you know everyone in your course. I'll be the same when I'm in JS/SS, where the max class size is about 20..but as a SF student, it's not the case. There are simply too many people doing Biology 1/2 to know them all. Geography is a different story; the class size is way smaller and we know each other from all our continuous assessments and field courses. I've heard similar things about Geology.

But overall, science is pretty faceless, at least in the Freshman years.

MrRobert87

Pet wrote:

On the other hand, I've still made tonnes of friends here, because I got involved in stuff, and didn't just **** off home every day right after my last class like some people seem to.

These people get to me. It seems such a waste of the "college experience". Its a real shame when they pass down the group coffee sessions, the nights out, the Pav experince in favour pissing off home. We're all 17-25. Have they nothing better than to spend their free time in front of the television or with their parents?

ApeXaviour

Dead Ed wrote:

aye, but that's in third/fourth year when all the pricks have been failed out so a lot of the remaining physicsy folk tend to be approachable to the point that you get the impression that they won't lift your wallet, beat you to death with a tin of sardines and go doo-doo on the carcass.

Ed... I met and began hanging around with you and pretty much ALL my other friends in JF.

You do physics. Come back to me when you've done Biology, the biggest class size of all.

The physics class when I was in SF was 75. Bear in mind you couldn't do it in SF unless you'd done physics A in JF. So thats quite a bit less than the amount studying it in JF. So what in a large class you won't know everybody. You can still make bloody friends! You still hang around with groups of people.

Pet wrote:

you're a final year student, of course you know everyone in your course

You mean all those people I had never even met before January this year?* I was a stranger to these people, encroaching on their tight little class group. A level of acceptance was acquired with surprising effortlessness.

Bottom line is, you (Pet) lived in halls. You used and loved that to fulfill the majority of your social needs. You had little motivation for socialising with your class. Facilitating in that was your odd hours, lack of attendance and maybe even a bit of prejudice.

I submit that your opinion of fiendishly reclusive science-end cliques (unless we're taking a postmodernist viewpoint) is total cac.



*Footnote explanation: When repeating JS, didn't have labs, didn't attend any lectures so never met anyone in the class. Hung around mostly with SS people and the odd JS repeater. Michealmas term 2006 I was away doing final year project. So this statement is quite true.

Edwardius

ApeXaviour wrote:

Ed... I met and began hanging around with you and pretty much ALL my other friends in JF.

The physics class when I was in SF was 75. Bear in mind you couldn't do it in SF unless you'd done physics A in JF. So thats quite a bit less than the amount studying it in JF. So what in a large class you won't know everybody. You can still make bloody friends! You still hang around with groups of people.

You mean all those people I had never even met before January this year?* I was a stranger to these people, encroaching on their tight little class group. A level of acceptance was acquired with surprising effortlessness.

Hmmmm, aye, now that you mention it, I managed to recruit a lot of the war effort sympathysers in early years. Did pick up a load of folk in subsequent years too. Dunno if this is a matter that has a proper answer due to the varying ways of them humans and I ain't arsed thinking about it. On another note, I saw a homeless guy asking for money from another homeless guy. The dude was seriously pissed off. think he was an alco homeless 'cos his skin was purple. in any case it was odd and slightly amusing.

oconnoao

No way! i gotta say i love the science class-im in SF too, and i was really impressed with the science ball last week-so many of the year were there, and most people get on pretty well!
i've made a great bunch of friends, even though i was pretty quiet in school, and whats more i'd be happy to talk to most of the class...lol esp on nights out....!