Let's call a spade a spade here lads...

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....that was fcuking sh!te.

Seven - two?

WTF?

They were no ManYoo out there, we were doing so well for such a long time.

I want to see the wing-backs putting more pressure on the full backs of the opponents, if we squeeze up we have the players to make chances for the front three.

We sat too deep, and got deeper as the second half wore on. Gifting them possession and opportunities to shoot.

I'll hold my own hands up here and admit I changed the defence around too much, leading to confusion in there, so sorry about that, but come on lads, we are better than this ffs.

Gileadi

Its true, ****ing shocking performance. I think that maybe some of the newer players didnt realise what was being asked of them in specific roles and maybe a jose-style diagram of the formation could help in this regard.

There were very few positives when we consider that both of our goals came from long ball set pieces....


On a side note did anybody see/pick up my stylish 3/4 length ireland pants after the match? Think i left them pitchside where afew were changing but forgot them when i went towards the car

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They are in the kit bag Simon.

I was trying to nick them.

Iago

having had the night to think this over, here are my thoughts on the subject. It'll be hard but I'm hoping to position it as constructive criticism rather than turn it into a slagging match.

The first thing I'd like to say is that I'm harder on myself than I am on anybody else, so starting with me, I can honestly say that was one of the worst games I've ever played. I've been out of the game for close to 12 months and it really showed, I was about 5 yards off the pace, my touch and passing was shocking and I even managed to drive a penalty over the bar for fcuks sake, that's the first penalty I've missed in about 6 years. In short I was absolutely shocking. I apologise unreservedly for my part in the debacle.

Without getting into other specific players, we looked like exactly what we are, players who don't regularly play with each other or in that formation. With very few exceptions, when we got the ball we couldn't wait to get rid of it, it was like a hot coal, as soon as it came to one of our players we just tried to kick it away. We weren't looking to pick out players, or at least it didn't seem that we were. We need to be more composed on the ball, you're going to get closed down quickly in this league, no matter who we're playing, so you need to get comfortable on the ball quickly.

On that note one of the things the opposition did really well was closing us down as soon as we got the ball. That's essential in this league, you have to get tight early and not let players skip around you or pick their passes. We gave them far too much space and time on the ball, anybody can look like superstars when that happens.

I know this formation worked in the summer, but last night I think it led to us sitting too deep and letting the opposition come on to us. There's a reason that the vast majority of teams play 4-4-2 at professional level, footballers are stupid, they don't adapt well to new things and new ideas. I think if we played a disciplined 4-4-2 the defence would have more options when it came to picking a pass when on the ball, it would be easier to know which of the opposition you're supposed to be marking and ensure that they are marked, and it gives the forward line support when they get the ball and are looking for someone to give it to.

Last night it didn't look like we had a midfield at all, from the first minute they walked through the middle of the park and put us under pressure. We didn't have a single corner in the game, I think we had maybe 4 shots the entire game. Not good enough.

As for the goals we conceded, they were all very soft to say the least. I'm not apportioning blame, after all I was rubbish last night, but we can't afford to concede goals like that on a regular basis.

With all that said it's important to remember that we are a brand new team, there are players that haven't played with each other before, and players that haven't played competitive football for a long time if at all. It will get better and we will find our shape and rhythm. It's not all doom and gloom and we can build from here. Every team in the world suffers setbacks, it's how you react to them that marks your quality.

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Iago wrote:

It'll be hard but I'm hoping to position it as constructive criticism rather than turn it into a slagging match.

That won't happen Gary.

We're fairly open both here and in training.

Anything that you feel needs to be said, out with it.

Just don't let it get too personal lads.

BlackWizard

I actually enjoyed the game last night. Got a good runaround and seen a few new players playing. The first game with a good few new players will always be dicey, but putting aside the dogey goals we conceded I thought we played well. In comparrison to the other team, they had a few easy goals and were let run about midfield with the ball a few times. Otherwise they weren't that special and we showed that in the first half. We weren't playing too well and we could still hold our own on the pitch. I think we were winning 2-1? maybe drawing 2-2.. can't remember.

I'll hold my own hands up here and admit I changed the defence around too much, leading to confusion in there...

I think you got it spot on with the subs. We just need to get used to pressing the opposition a lot more so that the subs are making an impact because they aint as wrecked as the ones coming off. The defense played well though. With practice I guess we could make subs to the defense and it might go seamlessly. Won't happen in one game.

I was playing alongside Joe in between midfield and striker. But I found myself having to cover runs going though midfield and into defense. I don't mind doing that at all. But maybe I wouldn't find myself ontop of the defense marking runners if we pushed up more? Eventually if they get by our high line of pressing players, I'd be drawn back marking runners, but thats fine. It's just our starting positions seemed quite deep even though the ball might of been with their defenders.

emc2

Last night was awful, there can be no excuses really. Thinking about it we really need the striker upfront to hang on the edge of the area to keep there defence push back and maybe in a game like last nights two strikers pushed up might have been the way to go.
I think we defended a bit too deeply, this let them have people running at us the whole time.
Also we need to take more shots, we had 4 shots last night, two lead to goals one hit the crossbar and the other was the penalty.

ditpoker

have been keeping an eye on this forum for a bit. ya's lost 7-2!? and with a "front three".

change to a 4-1-4-1. most teams will play 442.you have one centre back who sweeps and controls the back line, the other centre back marks one of the strikers. the 2nd opposition striker should be marked by the left/right back depending which side he pushes out to. the 1 playing the defensive centre mid role is there to keep the 4 midfield line from dropping deep and is there to stop the opposition "walking through the midfield". stick a dirty ball winner in there who will kick lumps out of any player daring to come through the midfield. the 1 up front is the target man, not the goalscorer, have someone who has good control of the ball up there who can keep it up there to take pressure off the back line and feed the 4 in the midfield as they come up to support. top goalscorers will be the 2 centre mids i reckon.

just me ranting from what has been posted in this thread. i'll go back under my rock now. best of luck in your next game lads!! BOARDS FOOTY!!!

kaizersoze123

I still can't believe that we managed to throw away that game. Were we 2-1 up at one stage??! Unbelievable. I don't know what happened, we seemed to lose the head or something. There was nothing going down either of the wings, which limited us to playing down the middle and feeding off scraps. We were getting stretched a lot in the last 20 mins, which led to most of their goals. I was 1 on 1 with one of their players a few times at right back position , why was there noone there?

FrankGrimes

Spent a good bit of thought on dissecting that shambles of a performance last night and here’s my thoughts.

First off, it has to be said that the goalkeeping situation can’t go on – far too regularly all through last season we gave away pathetic goals and we just can’t face into another season knowing that we concede roughly half of the opposition’s shots on target regardless of the shooting range. I was counting and I make it they had 10 shots on target last night and scored 7 goals. That’s heart-breaking and is clearly our Achilles heel so we need to see improvement there in one shape or another. That’s not an attack on Bernie, who is a mate of mine, but is a cold assessment of the facts.

But there’s plenty more areas to be improved on and I agree with Gary’s points that we’re setup too defensively and lack composure on the ball. The way I see it is our back 3 sit far too deep, on average 5 yards outside our box. The opposition’s defence has so far generally sat 5 yards short of the halfway line, moving back only as we progress forward that means the game is played in our territory and when we get the ball our primary focus is getting it out of the danger zone, resulting in ‘anywhere will do’ balls. I don’t remember a single goal scored by us or any opposition all last season that involved a through ball or ball over the top that got a striker in behind the defence in a one-on-one. That means the no offside rule is not as big a factor as we expected so we should setup as normal as if we were playing offside and defend higher up the pitch.

With our defence sitting so deep here’s what I think happens: when we win the ball the midfielders push forward as they should do to support the attack. When we lose the ball there’s a few opposition players standing where our midfield was and they get the ball played out of defence. Crucially, they get it sitting in space behind our midfield and in front of our defence meaning by the time our defence reach them, they have built up momentum which means it’s easy to go by a man who cant slide them with a quick change of direction.

I’d like to see the defence push up as the midfield push up and put pressure on that space. If a lad wants to hatch behind them then let him – haven’t seen it happen and we’ll worry about it if it becomes a problem. This means we’d be giving less time and space for the opposition to have long-range shots that we’re so poor at keeping out. I like our chances in limiting one-on-one oppurtunities and then Bernie saving a good few of those that get through, as its clear from training 1-on-1s are his strength.

This approach means the defence would be involved in breaking up play a lot more just inside our half – currently the midfield are doing most of it in that area and defence are waiting for the attackers to come onto them before breaking it up (which they have been doing very well). That would mean when a defender gets the ball he’s only yards away from a midfielder who should be the type that will put a foot on the ball and find a good forward pass. Then the midfield follow that pass and already it’s clear that we’d be winning far more second balls and shore up the middle of the park a lot better. It gives us the right players in the right positions to make smart creative passes rather than the hit and hope balls we’ve been relying on (actually its more ‘hit and get rid of it’ at the moment).

Then there’s the question of formation: last night we were effectively playing 5-2-2-1 as the wing backs rarely got out of our half, if the defence pushes up they should push up the wing backs as they come, but it probably does need to be reconsidered. I thought the original plan was for the 2 behind the striker to get behind the ball when we don’t have it, but it’s not happening, so we’re effectively playing 3 up front and 5 at the back. That leaves 2 men getting overrun in the midfield third of the pitch and it’s not hard to figure out the disconnect between back 5 and front 3 leads to long hopeful balls.

I wouldn’t rule out the current system completely just yet, but maybe it should be one behind the striker and 3 in the middle, though 4-4-2 does need to be considered again: we’ve got a few good wingers in the squad and plenty of lads who won’t do much wrong defensively at full back but aren’t too inclined to get forward – with them winning it and playing it to a nearby winger hungry for the ball it might give us an outlet. Midfield could be changed to holding player with 2 in front behind a lone striker as needed.

kaizersoze123

FrankGrimes wrote:

Spent a good bit of thought on dissecting that shambles of a performance last night and here’s my thoughts.

First off, it has to be said that the goalkeeping situation can’t go on – far too regularly all through last season we gave away pathetic goals and we just can’t face into another season knowing that we concede roughly half of the opposition’s shots on target regardless of the shooting range. I was counting and I make it they had 10 shots on target last night and scored 7 goals. That’s heart-breaking and is clearly our Achilles heel so we need to see improvement there in one shape or another. That’s not an attack on Bernie, who is a mate of mine, but is a cold assessment of the facts.

But there’s plenty more areas to be improved on and I agree with Gary’s points that we’re setup too defensively and lack composure on the ball. The way I see it is our back 3 sit far too deep, on average 5 yards outside our box. The opposition’s defence has so far generally sat 5 yards short of the halfway line, moving back only as we progress forward that means the game is played in our territory and when we get the ball our primary focus is getting it out of the danger zone, resulting in ‘anywhere will do’ balls. I don’t remember a single goal scored by us or any opposition all last season that involved a through ball or ball over the top that got a striker in behind the defence in a one-on-one. That means the no offside rule is not as big a factor as we expected so we should setup as normal as if we were playing offside and defend higher up the pitch.

With our defence sitting so deep here’s what I think happens: when we win the ball the midfielders push forward as they should do to support the attack. When we lose the ball there’s a few opposition players standing where our midfield was and they get the ball played out of defence. Crucially, they get it sitting in space behind our midfield and in front of our defence meaning by the time our defence reach them, they have built up momentum which means it’s easy to go by a man who cant slide them with a quick change of direction.

I’d like to see the defence push up as the midfield push up and put pressure on that space. If a lad wants to hatch behind them then let him – haven’t seen it happen and we’ll worry about it if it becomes a problem. This means we’d be giving less time and space for the opposition to have long-range shots that we’re so poor at keeping out. I like our chances in limiting one-on-one oppurtunities and then Bernie saving a good few of those that get through, as its clear from training 1-on-1s are his strength.

This approach means the defence would be involved in breaking up play a lot more just inside our half – currently the midfield are doing most of it in that area and defence are waiting for the attackers to come onto them before breaking it up (which they have been doing very well). That would mean when a defender gets the ball he’s only yards away from a midfielder who should be the type that will put a foot on the ball and find a good forward pass. Then the midfield follow that pass and already it’s clear that we’d be winning far more second balls and shore up the middle of the park a lot better. It gives us the right players in the right positions to make smart creative passes rather than the hit and hope balls we’ve been relying on (actually its more ‘hit and get rid of it’ at the moment).

Then there’s the question of formation: last night we were effectively playing 5-2-2-1 as the wing backs rarely got out of our half, if the defence pushes up they should push up the wing backs as they come, but it probably does need to be reconsidered. I thought the original plan was for the 2 behind the striker to get behind the ball when we don’t have it, but it’s not happening, so we’re effectively playing 3 up front and 5 at the back. That leaves 2 men getting overrun in the midfield third of the pitch and it’s not hard to figure out the disconnect between back 5 and front 3 leads to long hopeful balls.

I wouldn’t rule out the current system completely just yet, but maybe it should be one behind the striker and 3 in the middle, though 4-4-2 does need to be considered again: we’ve got a few good wingers in the squad and plenty of lads who won’t do much wrong defensively at full back but aren’t too inclined to get forward – with them winning it and playing it to a nearby winger hungry for the ball it might give us an outlet. Midfield could be changed to holding player with 2 in front behind a lone striker as needed.

I agree 100% with Jules on the midfield thing. It seemed for most of the game yesterday there was only 2 midfielders in total, and they were coming at us from all angles, with frequently 2 of them for every 1 of our midfielders in the middle of the park. We desperately need either 1 holding midfielder and 2 central midfielders, or a flat midfield. 1 holding and 1 central is leaving us totally overrun, and leading to chances for long speculative shots from 30 yards by the opposition. The problem with having 2 wing backs is that they HAVE to be able to run up and down the line all night, if they can't make it back...we're in trouble.

Draupnir

I felt we struggled in the middle of the park last night in terms of numbers. The opposition had 6 players in the middle in the second half, whereas we had 2, Jules and Shay.

Anything we did was either too rushed or too casual, composure was not a word you could use to describe the game!

Wing backs isnt working out at all because we have no option to spread the ball wide, I think we need to swap back to 4-4-2 to be honest. It will allow us to get ball out wide and put some pressure on the other team, plus we can remove the pressure on the lads in the centre.

There wasnt one player I would give above 6 out of 10 going on last nights performance, but first game back with pretty much a new team and we were leading 2-1 at half time and didnt give them any shots on goal either, so thats very encouraging.

6 of the 7 goals were bull****, so lets just work at things and keep up the training, we will be better next week I hope and we might try to play some more football on the ground.