Purpose of prayer, why pray?

Scofflaw

Jakkass wrote:

Hmm, what do you mean in terms of praying humbly or proudly?

Do you pray in the full consciousness of your dependence on God, of the privilege He has granted you in being alive, and in full awe of His glory? Or do you pray believing that God must answer you, because of your own worth?

I don't mean to sound like the Inquisition, by the way - it just sort of comes out that way...

[EDIT]I didn't start this thread. Someone has moved my post (and Jakkass' post as well) - and yes, I find it very irritating. Please ask, whoever it is, before I delete this post.[/EDIT]

cordially,
Scofflaw

philologos

the former. I pray in the hope that He will grant me my prayer. However I recognise should it be selfish, it won't be granted. An example of this would be when Solomon prayed that he would be wise so he could govern the people of Israel in the best way possible. God was pleased with Him as He didn't pray for something out of selfishness.

Splendour

Hi Scofflaw,

Depends on what your view is on praying.

Some people pray the same prayers over and over in a meditative style. For me, it is my way of communicating with God. With any relationship there has to be communication or the relationship will die,( men take note! )

Jesus asked us to pray constantly, which is what I do; could be in the shower, driving, cooking-wherever I happen to be. But also, as in our worldly relationships, one needs to set aside time when true communication takes place. The reason I pray is to say 'thank you', to praise God, to ask God for advice & wisdom, and sometimes to even have a moan! Sound like any relationships you know..?

And no, when I ask God for certain 'things', I don't necessarily always get my way. Thing is, most parents don't always give their kids everything they ask for, though to the child this just ain't fair. Someday though, the child will understand why this had to be so...

philologos

Splendour wrote:

Some people pray the same prayers over and over in a meditative style. For me, it is my way of communicating with God. With any relationship there has to be communication or the relationship will die,( men take note! )

Exactly the same for me, just wondering how do other Christians pray? Out loud, completely through thought or through meditation? Kneeling, or?

siochain

Jakkass wrote:

Exactly the same for me, just wondering how do other Christians pray? Out loud, completely through thought or through meditation? Kneeling, or?

Any one or combination of the above, depends on how the moment takes me to be honest.

Splendour

Ditto for me to Siochain's post. Wherever and whatever I'm at...

kelly1

Scofflaw wrote:

Do you pray in the full consciousness of your dependence on God, of the privilege He has granted you in being alive, and in full awe of His glory? Or do you pray believing that God must answer you, because of your own worth?

I don't mean to sound like the Inquisition, by the way - it just sort of comes out that way...

[EDIT]I didn't start this thread. Someone has moved my post (and Jakkass' post as well) - and yes, I find it very irritating. Please ask, whoever it is, before I delete this post.[/EDIT]

cordially,
Scofflaw

Hello Scofflaw, I think it very much a case of the former. I believe we are all unworthy sinners and it's only through God's mercy and goodness that we receive His grace and the answers to our prayers.

All goodness comes from God. There are lots of people who appear good to us but unless we conform with the will of God, we can't be good.

I believe that compared with God, we are nothing but vile creatures. I know this sounds harsh but nobody can begin to comprehend the infinite goodness and purity of God. Even the angels and saints in Heaven aren't perfect in His eyes. If we do make it to Heaven, it will only be through His great forgiveness and mercy.

The motto of St. Teresa of Avila is "The mercies of the Lord I will sing forever".

God bless,
Noel.

robindch

kelly1 wrote:

unless we conform with the will of God, we can't be good. [...] I believe that compared with God, we are nothing but vile creatures.

People can think whatever they wish of themselves. But I must say that I find it thoroughly objectionable that somebody thinks, without knowing anything, that I and my family and friends are vile too.

How many other religious people hold similar views?

philologos

robindch wrote:

People can think whatever they wish of themselves. But I must say that I find it thoroughly objectionable that somebody thinks, without knowing anything, that I and my family and friends are vile too.

How many other religious people hold similar views?

We are lesser beings than God. But we are definetely not vile. We are part of God's fantastic creation. Bear in mind that the Holy Spirit is meant to manifest itself in the heart of every believer in the Christian faith. Therefore meaning that God has given part of His power to His followers. The human race is far from vile.

I would advise Kelly to look at this in Genesis:

Genesis 1:26-28 wrote:

So God created human beings, making them to be like himself. He created them male and female blessed them, and said, "Have many children, so that your descendants will live all over the earth and bring it under their control. I am putting you in charge of the fish, the birds and all the wild animals"

We are created in the image of God and from his very hand. We are not vile under any circumstances. I would consider it an insult to God's creation if someone said that the human race were indeed vile.

Rev Hellfire

Scofflaw wrote:

Do you pray in the full consciousness of your dependence on God, of the privilege He has granted you in being alive, and in full awe of His glory? Or do you pray believing that God must answer you, because of your own worth?

It’s an interesting question. To me a prayer is a communion with a deity and one that can be simply (and preferably) conversational in tone. To have a relationship with someone you must be able to converse with it.

Many people seem to have a sycophantic relationship when it comes to prayer, either on the lines of “gosh god you’re really great” or “I really would appreciate X and Y”. If that’s the limit of your conversation, then I would argue that you have yet to pray in any true meaningful sense of the word.

PDN

robindch wrote:

People can think whatever they wish of themselves. But I must say that I find it thoroughly objectionable that somebody thinks, without knowing anything, that I and my family and friends are vile too.

How many other religious people hold similar views?

Of course, if we think logically rather than emotionally, goodness and vileness are relative terms.

If God exists as an infinitely holy being, then all finite beings will, in comparison be vile.

Robin, would you get upset if a poster said that, compared to an omniscient God, you and your family are ignorant? Or that, compared to an infinite universe, you and your family are tiny?

Of course you may believe that you and your family are also infinitely holy, in which case you would not be vile in comparison to God. In that case you and your family would be God, which would, I guess, make you a theist.

Killaqueen!!!

I don't know how to pray......

That's kind of worrying.

philologos

There isn't a particular method. All you need to do is give yourself a moment to discuss things with God. Kneel, sit, do it as you wish, any form of communication is pleasing to God. I would normally kneel.

PDN

I spend set times in prayer where I worship God, confess my sins, thank Him for the many blessings I have received, and bring supplication - asking him for all kinds of things. (The acronym ACTS helps me to remember this).

I also speak to God, and seek to hear His voice, at all kinds of moments during the day. This can be something simple like praying for a parking space, something important like asking Him to give me the right words to speak to someone who has just been bereaved, or just praising Him or thanking Him when the notion takes me.

I guess it's like a relation with a person. It needs to be 2 way communication, and you don't just talk to someone when you want something from them.

robindch

PDN wrote:

If God exists as an infinitely holy being, then all finite beings will, in comparison be vile.

The primary meaning of "vile" is "morally repugnant" and I'm afraid that I entirely reject somebody's unconditional assertion that I and the people I know are in any sense "morally repugnant". Particularly when the yardstick used is a description of a despotic deity who who encourages the murder of people who do not respect him and who condemns those who do not believe he exists to an eternity burning in hell.

The christian deity's character certainly does exist at one end of an ethical spectrum, and for my own safety and that of my family, I'm much relieved that it's nowhere near me.

Killaqueen!!!

Jakkass wrote:

There isn't a particular method. All you need to do is give yourself a moment to discuss things with God. Kneel, sit, do it as you wish, any form of communication is pleasing to God. I would normally kneel.

But - and sorry for going off topic here - do you have to speak in a certain manner because I never know what to say. In the Bible, I don't even understand some of the stuff in prayers and there are all these words like 'thy' 'thee' 'yea' 'kingdom' etc. Am I supposed to talk like that or just say "hi God it's me. hows it goin? sorry for lying today. please forgive me." And when you ask a question, are you supposed to feel like your actually talking to Him and He gives you an answer cos I just feel stupid. I know thats horrible but I just feel awkward.

philologos

Jesus teaches the following.

Matthew 6:5-15 wrote:

When you pray do not be like the hypocrites. They love to stand up and pray in the houses of worship and on the street corners so that everyone will see them. I assure you they have already been paid in full. But when you pray, go to your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. And your Father, who sees what you do in private, will reward you.
When you pray do not use a lot of meaningless words, as the pagans do, who think that their gods will hear them because their prayers are long. Do not be like them. Your Father already knows what you need before you ask him. This then is how you should pray.
"Our Father in heaven;
May your holy name be honoured,
may your Kingdom come,
may your will be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Give us today the food we need.
Forgive us the wrongs we have done,
as we forgive teh wrongs that others have done to us.
Do not bring us to hard testing, but keep us safe from the Evil one."
If you forgive others the wrongs they have done onto you, then your Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive the wrongs you have done.

God already knows what you are looking for. You don't have to be too elaborate in your prayers. However I have always spoken to God like a person, and I believe that I do recieve a reply from Him. In addition to that, if you feel stupid praying to the One who created you, perhaps you should make a mission of reading the Bible yourself, you'll find, if it inspires you that is, it will make prayer a whole lot easier. I'd personally recommend the Good News translation (the one I quoted from there) as the English is very simplex in it and it is translated directly from the Hebrew and Greek texts.

Kojak

IMO, prayer is a means to maintain a relationship with God. In my case, that is what I use prayer for.

Also if I was in need of help, lets say around exam time, I would pray to God in the hope that he would be able to render assistance

BrianCalgary

Killaqueen!!! wrote:

But - and sorry for going off topic here - do you have to speak in a certain manner because I never know what to say. In the Bible, I don't even understand some of the stuff in prayers and there are all these words like 'thy' 'thee' 'yea' 'kingdom' etc. Am I supposed to talk like that or just say "hi God it's me. hows it goin? sorry for lying today. please forgive me." And when you ask a question, are you supposed to feel like your actually talking to Him and He gives you an answer cos I just feel stupid. I know thats horrible but I just feel awkward.

One of the things I love is hearing a new Christian pray. It is natural and from the heart with none of the lingo involved.

Speak how you normally speak to a friend. God understands all language. He understands you.


What you quote above is just perfect. You have acknowledged your sin and you repentance. The last thing to do is when you aks Him how's it going, hang in and see if you get a response. He may just give you one.

Spyral

the dude above me (not God!) has it right.

When in a gathering (Mass / service / whatever) it is useful to have traditional prayers that all the people know to pray together but when alone it is good to do it like a nice chat. But rememember that listening is also a part of conversation;)

DinoBot

why does god answer the prayers of non-believers ?

If a muslim prays to his god or a hindu to one of his gods and their prayers are answered, does that not just reinforce his belief in a false god ? Why do that ?

Killaqueen!!!

Jakkass wrote:

Jesus teaches the following.

God already knows what you are looking for. You don't have to be too elaborate in your prayers. However I have always spoken to God like a person, and I believe that I do recieve a reply from Him. In addition to that, if you feel stupid praying to the One who created you, perhaps you should make a mission of reading the Bible yourself, you'll find, if it inspires you that is, it will make prayer a whole lot easier. I'd personally recommend the Good News translation (the one I quoted from there) as the English is very simplex in it and it is translated directly from the Hebrew and Greek texts.

Thanks, the 'Our Father' prayer is the only one I ever use. I think the problem was that I was reading this really old bible that my mother had when she was a child, and I didn't understand it. I'm reading the Good News bible at the moment.

JC 2K3

If God is all knowing then what is the purpose of praying?

It seems to be a mechanism of self comfort to me and essentially the same thing as us non believers call "personal reflection".

I have had many an epiphany whilst reflecting, and I expect Christians would believe that such an epiphany would be an "answer from God".

So are atheists who reflect and think to themselves a lot praying to God without realising or is there a deeper meaning to prayer than personal reflection?

PDN

DinoBot wrote:

why does god answer the prayers of non-believers ?

If a muslim prays to his god or a hindu to one of his gods and their prayers are answered, does that not just reinforce his belief in a false god ? Why do that ?

God is just nice like that. People go about it all wrong and He still blesses them!

robindch

Off-topic perhaps, but what happens when god blesses somebody or something?

philologos

surely it depends on what the person is looking for or requesting from God.

philologos

Killaqueen!!! wrote:

Thanks, the 'Our Father' prayer is the only one I ever use. I think the problem was that I was reading this really old bible that my mother had when she was a child, and I didn't understand it. I'm reading the Good News bible at the moment.

The Bible is meant to be understood, not to be confused by so the simpler the translation the better really. I would personally tell everyone to avoid the King James Version.

Edit: by the by, theres nothing stopping you from making up your own prayers etc. People have done it for centuries. God is really like a person, and for a personal relationship between you and God to occur there has to be normal conversation involved. If anyone is going to understand you He will.

PDN

robindch wrote:

Off-topic perhaps, but what happens when god blesses somebody or something?

Well, there's been days we had no food to put on the table. We prayed, and people dropped off gifts & so we were blessed.

Other times I've been sick. I prayed and got instantly better. That was a blessing.

I pray for parking spaces & then find them right where I need them. That's a blessing.

I prayed for a great wife who would also be a good cook. I got a fantastic wife who can't cook. Not quite what I asked for, but still a blessing.

My wife and I prayed for a home of our own. Then a guy, totally out of the blue, gave us a gift of 20,000 euro to put down as a deposit on a site so we could build. That was a blessing.

And other times I prayed for stuff that didn't happen. I prayed for 5 years for my sick daughter to be healed, but she died. I still consider myself blessed for the time I spent with her in those 5 years.

Blessings come in all shapes and sizes.

DinoBot

PDN wrote:

God is just nice like that. People go about it all wrong and He still blesses them!

But its not nice because it leaves them thinking their prayers were answered by a false God. Would it not be better to show them that praying to anything other than Him will not result in any prayer being answered ?

I would equate it to letting a child eat sweets all day, the child thinks its a good thing your doing but you know the childs actions will only lead to disaster.

So apart from the short term gain, Where is the good ?