4-tracking Northern Line

Tadhg17

Will it be possible in future to four track the Northern Line out of Connolly to Dundalk or has there been to much develpment near the line in recent years to allow this?. Will people have to wait for the interconnector before capacity on the line will be suitably increased?

MLM

This was planned. Maybe not as far as Dundalk but I remember reading about it somewhere. I think the plan was four track to Howth Junction and three track on the southside to Dalkey or somewhere.

Slice

It's shame this is not given more priority since any increase in services beyond the Dart network on the northern line would only further compromise frequency of Dart services.

loyatemu

there is space most of the way from Connolly to Howth Jct, but it would require rebuilding most of the stations. Southside I would say its impossible.

Zebra3

loyatemu wrote:

there is space most of the way from Connolly to Howth Jct, but it would require rebuilding most of the stations.

Eh, I don't think there is....

GerardKeating

loyatemu wrote:

there is space most of the way from Connolly to Howth Jct, but it would require rebuilding most of the stations. Southside I would say its impossible.

There is space beside the tracks for most of the route, but all stations and most bridges ( Killester looks like it has the space for 4 tracks) would have to be rebuilt and there would be a lot of big engineering problems, like widening the existing embankment from Fairview to the Howth Road bridge and some large retaining wall for the sections in cuttings between Killester and Raheny.

A much cheaper option would be to 4-track the Metro Line to the airport and continue it Rush/Donabate. This would allow anything north of Malihide to divert via the airport and leave the Malihide/Connolly line to exclusivly commuter use.

While i cannot site any costs, 4-Tracking an as yet unbuilt like has to be cheaper than 4-tracking the northern line and would avoid any distuption to existing services.

Ste.phen

Apart from the fact that the raised alignment is only 2 tracks wide, i can't personally think of anywhere that CPOing someone's back garden wouldn't result in being able to throw in 2 extra tracks.
I'm probably wrong though, i'm sure there's somewhere on the route that the tracks pass close by a large building, etc, where a CPO isn't viable.

GerardKeating

Igy wrote:

Apart from the fact that the raised alignment is only 2 tracks wide, i can't personally think of anywhere that CPOing someone's back garden wouldn't result in being able to throw in 2 extra tracks.

A few houses and other Buildings would have to go if they 4-tracked the line north of Connolly and a few houses near Kilbarrick station would be a bit too close to the line to be viable after any 4-tracking.

Pineapple stu

They have just finished extending the platforms on the north side dart line and starting shortly on the grange road station so they wont be puting in extra tracks. There is no room anyway.

icdg

GerardKeating wrote:

A much cheaper option would be to 4-track the Metro Line to the airport and continue it Rush/Donabate. This would allow anything north of Malihide to divert via the airport and leave the Malihide/Connolly line to exclusivly commuter use.

While i cannot site any costs, 4-Tracking an as yet unbuilt like has to be cheaper than 4-tracking the northern line and would avoid any distuption to existing services.

A number of problems with that, the biggest technical problem being that the Metro will most likely be European standard gauge rather than Irish gauge. While it won't be on street, it will be near street level in places, something not compatible with Enterprise / InterCity services. Also, it won't link in (I don't mean in terms of interchange stations, I mean the tracks physically joined to) with the existing network, and will be owned by a completely different organisation (the RPA/future Dublin Transport Authority instead of CIE).

Slice

A much cheaper option would be to 4-track the Metro Line to the airport and continue it Rush/Donabate. This would allow anything north of Malihide to divert via the airport and leave the Malihide/Connolly line to exclusivly commuter use.

I don't think this would be a cheaper option - half of Metro North will be underground remember

Terrontress

What about four tracking certain stations along the Northern Commuter line only.

That way the DARTs could wait to let the commuter trains past and the Commuters could wait to let the Enterprise past.

If the system was timetabled properly and the trains run efficiently, it would be great. There is nothing worse than being on the 1735 ex Connolly and having to crawl along at 5mph so as not to get too close to the DART in front.

If the DART could wait at its platform in Harmonstown untill the Commuter goes by then it would ease alot of the problems.

As it stands though, I have been on the 1707 ex Connolly, waiting for the train to leave when a DART pulls into the station, picks up and lets off and heads out in front of the Commuter service. Then the Commuter is forced to crawl out the line.

Could the people of Irish Rail be trusted to run a proper service if they were given the infrastructure to do so?

Victor

GerardKeating wrote:

A much cheaper option would be to 4-track the Metro Line to the airport and continue it Rush/Donabate. This would allow anything north of Malihide to divert via the airport and leave the Malihide/Connolly line to exclusivly commuter use. While i cannot site any costs, 4-Tracking an as yet unbuilt like has to be cheaper than 4-tracking the northern line and would avoid any distuption to existing services.

You can't mix heavy and light rail vehicles. In an accident a train would make mincemeat of a Metro / tram.

3- or 4-tracking might not be cheaper with Metro as it would be tunneled and would need to be connected somewhere anyway.

GerardKeating

Victor wrote:

You can't mix heavy and light rail vehicles. In an accident a train would make mincemeat of a Metro / tram.

Ok, build a good wall between the Metro and Train track.

Victor wrote:

3- or 4-tracking might not be cheaper with Metro as it would be tunneled and would need to be connected somewhere anyway.

The "train" tracks could diverge from the Metro allignment and join the midland line into connolly, or go into Heuston via the park tunnel.