ROI vs. UK 'units' of alcohol

Aziraphale

So I happened to have a can of Guinness Draught bought in NI and a can of Guinness Draught bought in the Republic sitting next to each other. The NI can is 440ml and says on it 1.8 UK units. The ROI can is 500ml and says 1.7 ROI units. (They're both 4.2% vol.)

The Wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_of_alcohol) gives this formula: (quantity in ml x vol) / 1000. For the UK can, that gives 1.848, so I'm assuming the Wikipedia article's talking about UK units. The Irish can works out to 2.1 UK units.

So there are ~1.2 UK units to an Irish unit. When did this happen? Did they think we're all drunkards who'd laugh at the guidelines based on UK units? Are they worked out on a basis of nationality?

Or is it just Guinness?

rubadub

Maybe the irish unit is 10g of pure alcohol. I never really paid attention to units, I always calculated in a similar way though, multiplying % by the volume, so a shot of vodka 37.5% x35.5ml =1331.25, whereas a pint of erdinger is 568mlx5.3%=3010.4, over twice the amount you get in a shot, showing what a ripoff shots are in pubs.

Strange things happen when you dilute alcohol. If you mixed 1 litre of 50% alcohol with 1 litre of water you might expect to get 2 litres of 25% alcohol, but this is not the case, it actually reduces in volume to below 2 litres and it heats up while doing so. I cant remember if the % goes up or down but it is not 25%, I would guess it goes up in % from 25 since the volume reduces.

Theta

The unit system is out of date and inaccurate. It was developed when measures were smaller and wines had far less alc by volume. I wouldn't base much on the unit system!

Aziraphale

irlmarc wrote:

The unit system is out of date and inaccurate. It was developed when measures were smaller and wines had far less alc by volume. I wouldn't base much on the unit system!

But every time there's a government health warning campaign or the gardai come round to schools to warn of the danger of drink they go on (and on) about units. I can't think in anything else now. Maybe we weren't expected to be able to spell milligrams.

Wines had less alcohol by volume? When was that supposed to be?

Theta

The system was devleoped over 30 years ago I think when wines on average contained less alcohol. They said that a glass of wine contained 1 and a half units when its more like 2 and a half if you have a strong red. Saw it on a BBC2 documentry. This could just be the UK system but I thought that there two were one and the same!

rubadub

More likely the size of the glass changed rather than the wines %. All depends on definitions thats why I hate these sites vaguley saying "a glass of wine has 1.5 units" " a bottle of beer has 2 units", while omitting the 2 most important factors, the ml, and the %. useless info.

A uk shot is 25ml while an irish shot is 35.5ml. I remember somebody saying they were in the UK and drank 10 shots of baileys, surprised that they could manage it. But that is 10x25.5mlx17%=4335 "units", 2 pints of normal 4.3% beer has more alcohol in it! (the baileys shots here are 50ml but they were getting them from a regular Uk measure.

Theta

rubadub wrote:

More likely the size of the glass changed rather than the wines %. All depends on definitions thats why I hate these sites vaguley saying "a glass of wine has 1.5 units" " a bottle of beer has 2 units", while omitting the 2 most important factors, the ml, and the %. useless info.

A uk shot is 25ml while an irish shot is 35.5ml. I remember somebody saying they were in the UK and drank 10 shots of baileys, surprised that they could manage it. But that is 10x25.5mlx17%=4335 "units", 2 pints of normal 4.3% beer has more alcohol in it! (the baileys shots here are 50ml but they were getting them from a regular Uk measure.

4335 units???

beardybrewer

Wine ABV has been relatively steady, but the glasses we use are bigger. Now beer ABV, that has gone up. Don't even mention cider.

The unit system I know was 1 shot (1.5oz) 80 proof liquor, 4oz. 12-14%ABV wine, 12 puny oz. of 3.5-4%ABV beer.

A grown 180lb man can have 2 units and be just under the .08 grams of alcohol per 1000 grams BAC. You're liver processes about 1 unit/hour. So theoretically, you could have 2 units and then 1 unit/hour and still be legal (obviously, don't try this). Interestingly, a 180lb woman could not - her BAC would be higher as men have more blood/wieght hence a lower BAC. I always thought that was wild.

rediguana

The fashion for wine these days is for "big" wines - lots of fruit, lots of alcohol, lots of "extraction". Wines from the new world (ie. not europe) are gaining market share all the time. Grapes grown in these countries - Australia, USA (California), South Africa etc - enjoy a long, even ripening period resulting in more sugar in the grape and consequently more alcohol in the dry wines. Anyone even vaguely familiar with wine will have heard of Robert Parker, the uber-influential critic. He favours high alcohol wines, reviews them favourably and this has an effect on what sells in the market. So, all things being equal, a random glass of still wine is likely to have a higher ABV these days than, say, twenty years ago.

I was at a "Wines of California" wine tasting in Dublin Castle last Monday. One wine there (I think it was a zinfandel) was 15.6%. This is straying into fortified wine territory. It was actually fantastic though, it had so much else going for it that the alcohol didn't stand out, or burn.

At the other end of the scale, I had a Rheingau Riesling Spatlese weighing in at 8% last night. German whites are the way to go if you want to enjoy a couple of glasses but you're not so keen on the ethanol.

Liamallica

Originally Posted by rubadub
More likely the size of the glass changed rather than the wines %. All depends on definitions thats why I hate these sites vaguley saying "a glass of wine has 1.5 units" " a bottle of beer has 2 units", while omitting the 2 most important factors, the ml, and the %. useless info.

A uk shot is 25ml while an irish shot is 35.5ml. I remember somebody saying they were in the UK and drank 10 shots of baileys, surprised that they could manage it. But that is 10x25.5mlx17%=4335 "units", 2 pints of normal 4.3% beer has more alcohol in it! (the baileys shots here are 50ml but they were getting them from a regular Uk measure.

Theta wrote: »

4335 units???

Its a quick way I also use to calculate them without bothering to calculate it per weight alcohol. It is not standard units obviously. just unfortunately phrased. Relative units, to say 2 beers, 4% at 568ml volume. Quick calc, you are talking 4450 or so?, compared to 4335.

stevenmu

Certain groups seems to love the unit system because it can make it sound like you are drinking too much. There's ads on buses at the moment 'warning' people that a pint of beer is 2 'standard drinks', which is stupid when you consider that the standard drink most people will have is a pint of beer.

huskerdu

Goin back to the OPs question - Why is a unit of alcohol different in Ireland the the UK ?
Because a unit of alcohol is an arbitrary measure with no real meaning or international standard.

Each countries health authority decide what a unit of alcohol is, probably based on different research and reflect the fact that there is no authorative scientific evidence that any artibtrary level of alcohol intake is "safe" for the entire adult population of a country.

The wikipedia article lists the different unit sizes in numerous different countries ranging from 6g in Austria to 17g in Hungary.